Tax status - living in UK, working in ROI

Carnmore

Can anyone confirm the tax/PRSI status of someone living in N.Ireland with their sole self-employed income in the Republic of Ireland?

I am getting contradictory answers from various official bodies-some saying HMRC, others Revenue.

nompere

If you're carrying on a trade in the State, then the Revenue Commissioners get to tax the profits. Then HMRC get to tax it as well because you're resident there. HMRC will give credit for the tax paid in Ireland.

If you're living with your family in the North then you'll probably only be paying National Insurance contributions there, and be PRSI exempt here.

You'll probably be within the USC charge here.

You're also going to have to cope with different year ends - the UK works on a 5 April year while here it's 31 December.

You will probably need an accountant who is well versed in all this, or you will probably end up paying too much somewhere.

Carnmore

nompere wrote: »

If you're carrying on a trade in the State, then the Revenue Commissioners get to tax the profits. Then HMRC get to tax it as well because you're resident there. HMRC will give credit for the tax paid in Ireland.

If you're living with your family in the North then you'll probably only be paying National Insurance contributions there, and be PRSI exempt here.

You'll probably be within the USC charge here.

You're also going to have to cope with different year ends - the UK works on a 5 April year while here it's 31 December.

You will probably need an accountant who is well versed in all this, or you will probably end up paying too much somewhere.

Being currently resident in ROI, is there any method of continuing to pay PRSI in ROI after relocating residence to N.Ireland in order to maximise the contributory state pension record ?

Squatter

Carnmore wrote: »

Being currently resident in ROI, is there any method of continuing to pay PRSI in ROI after relocating residence to N.Ireland in order to maximise the contributory state pension record ?

Not if you're paying National Insurance in the UK (as splinter65 has already advised you on this thread: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057868550 ) however, if you're re-locating your residence to the North but are still continuing to work (and pay PRSI) in the South then nothing will change for you.

Why not have a look at this: http://borderpeople.info/a-z/taxation.html it will either clear things up or confuse you even more!

tanit

Question:

How do you get some kind of harmonisation between the tax you have paid in NI/Uk with a tax calendar that runs from 6 April to 5 of April the following with the tax you need to pay in Ireland with a tax calendar that follows the calendar year 1 January to 31 December each year?

Carnmore

Squatter wrote: »

Not if you're paying National Insurance in the UK (as splinter65 has already advised you on this thread: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057868550 )

It's more complex than that and there's a lot at stake for me hence my question on this forum.

Squatter wrote: »

however, if you're re-locating your residence to the North but are still continuing to work (and pay PRSI) in the South then nothing will change for you.

That option depends on whether it's employment, self-employment from an ROI premises or self-employment in ROI without a premises.

Squatter

Carnmore wrote: »

It's more complex than that and there's a lot at stake for me hence my question on this forum.

So there's "a lot at stake" yet you opt to ask a complex question on an anonymous web forum populated mainly by well-intentioned amateurs, rather than paying an expert for reliable information! Way to go man! :rolleyes:

Carnmore

Squatter wrote: »

So there's "a lot at stake" yet you opt to ask a complex question on an anonymous web forum populated mainly by well-intentioned amateurs, rather than paying an expert for reliable information! Way to go man! :rolleyes:

What part of “I am getting contradictory answers from various official bodies-some saying HMRC, others Revenue“ do you have difficulty in understanding?

Squatter

Carnmore wrote: »

What part of “I am getting contradictory answers from various official bodies-some saying HMRC, others Revenue“ do you have difficulty in understanding?

No problem whatsoever in comprehending fully what you wrote above.

My difficulty is in understanding the unwritten but implicit bit of your question that says "this matter is so important to me that I'd rather seek unreliable and possibly incorrect advice from unknown posters on an internet forum than pay a professional for his/her advice!"

But hey, at the end of the day, it's your call! Might I suggest you consider consulting a fortune teller next - those Tarot cards are well-nigh infallible! :P

Carnmore

Squatter wrote: »

No problem whatsoever in comprehending fully what you wrote above.

My difficulty is in understanding the unwritten but implicit bit of your question that says "this matter is so important to me that I'd rather seek unreliable and possibly incorrect advice from unknown posters on an internet forum than pay a professional for his/her advice!"

But hey, at the end of the day, it's your call! Might I suggest you consider consulting a fortune teller next - those Tarot cards are well-nigh infallible! :P[/

I’ve done that, funnily enough, but hey I’m only encouraging your antagonistic ramblings hiding behind a username by replying so why don’t you just jog on

mkdon05

If you are in the the Republic at any stage during the day, then that day counts as 1 full day for residency rules. If your income is derived from the Republic, I presume you will be in the state for the required 183 days in the year to be considered resident. If you are also domiciled in Ireland, then your worldwide income is liable to Irish tax.
You will therefore have to submmit tax returns in the republic (and pay prsi).

Carnmore

mkdon05 wrote: »

If you are in the the Republic at any stage during the day, then that day counts as 1 full day for residency rules. If your income is derived from the Republic, I presume you will be in the state for the required 183 days in the year to be considered resident. If you are also domiciled in Ireland, then your worldwide income is liable to Irish tax.
You will therefore have to submmit tax returns in the republic (and pay prsi).

Thank you for your reply. I would be in ROI almost every day but not necessarily for work. Is 'residency' not defined as where one stays at night? By domiciled do you mean resident? If so, that would be in N.Ireland (UK) not ROI.

From what I've been able to garner from various authorities, advisers is that self-employed income from the ROI (without a premises) is taxed by Revenue and to be tax compliant a tax return is also submitted to HMRC.

HMRC provide a tax credit for the ROI tax paid and any shortfall is payable to HMRC.

Apart from the extra administration, my main concern is being able to continue paying PRSI for contributory state pension purposes plus voluntary National Insurance contributions for the UK contributory state pension.

The following site goes some way to providing an answer but not specifically addressing social insurance contributions in both jurisdictions or the residency definition as you outline above:

http://borderpeople.info/a-z/income-tax-in-ireland.html

mkdon05

Your domicile is usually the country where you where born (or your fathers country of birth). They took away the need to be present at midnight in the country to qualify as 1 day as the rich lads just flew out before midnight so as not to be resident.

So as you would be here almost every day (doesn't matter for what reason) you will be deemed to be resident.

If you were born in the UK and reside there (but also qualify for residency in the Republic) you will have to file an Irish tax return, paying irish income tax/USC/Prsi.

You will also have to file a tax return in the UK but will get a tax credit for the irish tax paid against your UK liability.

Carnmore

mkdon05 wrote: »

Your domicile is usually the country where you where born (or your fathers country of birth). They took away the need to be present at midnight in the country to qualify as 1 day as the rich lads just flew out before midnight so as not to be resident.

So as you would be here almost every day (doesn't matter for what reason) you will be deemed to be resident.

If you were born in the UK and reside there (but also qualify for residency in the Republic) you will have to file an Irish tax return, paying irish income tax/USC/Prsi.

You will also have to file a tax return in the UK but will get a tax credit for the irish tax paid against your UK liability.

This is useful information, which I wasn’t previously aware of- could you provide a source?

If, as you say, the income tax and PRSI liability would be in ROI where the self-employed income is earned with any shortfall payable to HMRC, what would be the situation with National Insurance for contributory state pension purposes? Would compulsory NI be due or voluntary contributions allowed?

At present it is possible to make voluntary NI contributions when simultaneously paying compulsory PRSI in ROI, provided residency is outside the UK.

mkdon05

The source I'm afraid is me slogging it out for 4 months in a lecture hall.

Those are the Irish tax rules so you would need to find a UK accountant to advise on the UK liabilities. I'm assuming they are similar to Ireland and Prsi would be due in both jurisdictions. As in if you are resident and domiciled in the UK, tax and Prsi would be due on worldwide income.

Either way you will need to engage a tax specialist to advise.

The Diddakoi

https://www.revenue.ie/en/life-events-and-personal-circumstances/moving-to-or-from-ireland/moving-or-returning-to-ireland/tax-residence-status.aspx

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/tax/moving_country_and_taxation/tax_residence_and_domicile_in_ireland.html

Squatter

mkdon05 wrote: »

Either way you will need to engage a tax specialist to advise.

I don't think he wants to hear that!