Smart Heating Confused !

ra0044

Hi.

Hopefully someone can give me some clear advice because all the conflicting opinions I am getting on what will and won't work are driving me mad.

What we currently have is -

Worcester condensing boiler plumbed for single channel heating and water together.

2 zones ( downstairs and upstairs ) on thermostats.

At the moment we have a single channel digital timer set to come on twice a day.

If we want to just have hot water but no heating we turn down both thermostats.

What I want is to keep the 2 zones separate for heating but if we wanted to still be able to just heat water.

I was thinking of the tado system of 2 thermostats and the add on unit to replace the timer. This is however quite expensive.

Do any of the other systems offer the dame functionality.

Any help really appreciated.

Latro

Atm if you turn down both thermostats you heat DHW cylinder only as if it was 3rd separate zone.
Replacing current thermostats with smart ones wont change anything.

ra0044

Hi. Thanks for the info.

I will obviously need two thermostats that will replace the old analogue ones and also something to replace the timer.

This will allow me to turn down the temp on both the thermostats and still fire the boiler for hot water during the summer.

Am I correct in thinking that the nest and hive active don't replace the analogue thermostats and so wouldn't control the zone valves

DGOBS

The issue is not what the devices will control, but moreover that your current contours are not complete and wired correctly.

The whole idea of motorised valves is that they are interlocked with the boiler (i.e. the valve calls the boiler for heat when opened) and yours are not, if checked the grey and orange wires on your valves have not been wired in, and it sounds like you don't have a valve at all on your hot water.

The idea is you can call for heat to each zone (including hot water) based on time and temperature, this is the most efficient way of running your system, as currently, every time you call from heat, your going to heat a cylinder of water regardless if you want it or not (wasting energy)

What i would suggest it upgrade this first, have a 3rd motorised valve fitted to your hot water circuit, and have a 7 core cable runs from that area where all 3 valves are back to where you timer is currently, then have this replaced with a mutlizone smart system.

ra0044

DGOBS wrote: »

The issue is not what the devices will control, but moreover that your current contours are not complete and wired correctly.

The whole idea of motorised valves is that they are interlocked with the boiler (i.e. the valve calls the boiler for heat when opened) and yours are not, if checked the grey and orange wires on your valves have not been wired in, and it sounds like you don't have a valve at all on your hot water.

The idea is you can call for heat to each zone (including hot water) based on time and temperature, this is the most efficient way of running your system, as currently, every time you call from heat, your going to heat a cylinder of water regardless if you want it or not (wasting energy)

What i would suggest it upgrade this first, have a 3rd motorised valve fitted to your hot water circuit, and have a 7 core cable runs from that area where all 3 valves are back to where you timer is currently, then have this replaced with a mutlizone smart system.

Thanks for the info.

Unfortunately the two motorised valves that are linked to the mechanical thermostats are wired with 2 core and located in the hot press 2 floors above the timer which is beside the boiler. As far as I know all the houses in our estate are wired the same way.

I will have to have a closer look at what can be done.

Thanks again

spongerobinson

Be interested in hearing what solution you end up going with, as my house is wired/plumbed exactly the same by the sounds of it.

Had a plumber friend suggest in the past, that it might be possible to move the timer to up beside the hot press, and re-use the existing few wires that go back to the boiler, instead of having to somehow run a new wire from the boiler to the hot press. Never really investigated too much further after that.

ra0044

spongerobinson wrote: »

Be interested in hearing what solution you end up going with, as my house is wired/plumbed exactly the same by the sounds of it.

Had a plumber friend suggest in the past, that it might be possible to move the timer to up beside the hot press, and re-use the existing few wires that go back to the boiler, instead of having to somehow run a new wire from the boiler to the hot press. Never really investigated too much further after that.

So far I have narrowed it down to the Hive active heating controls.

As far as I can see I would need 2 thermostats that would replace the existing mechanical ones I have. Both have control boxes that replace the timer and are wired in to the boiler. The app allows you to set on/off times and to have remote access to the boiler and the thermostats.

The thermostats only activate the zone valves and can fire up the boiler when needed.

I have e. Mailed hive to make sure that if I turn down the temps on the thermostats and so trigger the zone control valves to close and the bypass valve to operate. I need to know if the set times in the app will keep the boiler running to heat the water in the tank.

Basically replicating what I currently have but with the smart controls

DGOBS

Hive will only replace the timer you have, so if it's a single channel timer, you can only have a single channel Hive, as above, the wiring still isn't there to support multiple switching to multiple valves, and you still have an open circuit to the hot water.

Hive UK may tell you that it will work, but trust me, it won't!
In the UK they do not see these installs with the auxiliary switch cut away on the motorised valves, with a single channel timer controlling multiple zones, they have standard s-plans wired correctly.

When you turn down the thermostats, the do trigger the Hive receiver to close, but you would have both receivers where the old timer used to be, but this only has ONE SWITCH WIRE, the receiver can't share this if you get me, you still have your old problem.

One way around this would be, if there is enough wires in your hot press, where you have an earth, live, neutral and switch wire back to the boiler (coming from the boiler spur), then you could install the 3rd motorised valve for hot water we discussed above, and the Hive receivers could be installed in the hot press also, to control each of the valves and call back to the boiler (via the switched live).