Opening a Cafe

treasuryman

Hi Everyone

Looking at opening a cafe over the next year in an unknown Leinster/ Munster location. On the look out for a suitable space.

I have extensive hospitality experience in food service and am currently working as a commis chef in a high end hotel to get kitchen experience from a well run hotel kitchen. This is so I am privy to all the processes in both a kitchen and front of house environment.

I have approx 25k to pursue the opening of same and already have some equipments for the cafe. I hope to offer good coffee, pastries and cake (bought in I would imagine to to financial constraints) good quality and healthy breakfasts presented well and stylish( ie granola, scrambled, full irishouse, pancakes and maple syrup etc and smoothies. Quick lunch sandwiches and salads etc and other all day snacks. Hope to have an open plan cooking and display area so that I can serve and cook etc.

A friend of mine is a Chef and we hope to cost the menu to establish prices and have ingredients I can use in a variety of dishes ie salads, eggs, and make specials etc.

Can anyone tell me would 25K suffice to open samevery. Would be loowing at approx 800 to 1200 square feet and design on the cheap. I would have no bank allssistance so this amount would be contingency money aswell

If anyone could breakdown costs associated with applying for planning for change of use from retail to cafe aso I think this may suit better. I hope to buy all equipments second hand and upgrade as business progresses or when needed.

Any general advice be great.

THanks in advance

scwazrh

Not a hope if you're looking for a new unit to fit out to your requirements.Only option is to find a premises already fitted out .

treasuryman

scwazrh wrote: »

Not a hope if you're looking for a new unit to fit out to your requirements.Only option is to find a premises already fitted out .

I hope to buy all the equipment second hand and do the work myself and family installing and doing up the place. I think you may be right with the costs associated with fit outs.

jimmii

This is the go to read on cafe opening here:

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057278302/1/#post91929796

Well worth a read if you haven't seen it before.

Even for a smaller unit I would imagine 25k wouldn't get you far with that sort of money and nothing in reserve I'd imagine you would need to find somewhere already kitted out for cafe use.

duploelabs

treasuryman wrote: »

I hope to buy all the equipment second hand and do the work myself and family installing and doing up the place. I think you may be right with the costs associated with fit outs.

Second hand equipment doesn't count for stuff that needs specialised installations such as Air handling, grease traps, and dishwashers which are all non-negotiable install requirements for what you're proposing

treasuryman

duploelabs wrote: »

Second hand equipment doesn't count for stuff that needs specialised installations such as Air handling, grease traps, and dishwashers which are all non-negotiable install requirements for what you're proposing

I will be putting in an extractor fan which I have experience in fitting and my brother is an electrician so that's that solved grease trap will be anotified expense all right and other simple plumbing can be done as well all costs though

duploelabs

treasuryman wrote: »

I will be putting in an extractor fan which I have experience in fitting and my brother is an electrician so that's that solved grease trap will be anotified expense all right and other simple plumbing can be done as well all costs though

Trying not to sound pedantic but has the equipment list been approved by your eho as per your menu? One of the most common budgetary overruns I've seen is a 'be grand' attitude when it comes to the approval by an Eho on an equipment list versus the aspirations of the menu. Not saying you have that same attitude however, make sure the eho knows exactly what your menu is and that they have approved your equipment list to compliment the menu

Bandara

I'm in the middle of opening a cafe at the moment

Actual figures :

Planning process - Planning - DAC - Fire Cert - Alcohol Licence €18k

Upfront 3 months rent/upfront yearly maint. fee/10k deposit to landlord (refunded in 2 years) €28k

Furniture - 60 chairs, 30 tables, 8 stools €12k

Kitchen Fit Out - Using ALL second hand equipment €29k

Actual interior Build - Electric rewire / new plumbing/ bathrooms / counters / cosmetic finishes / kitchen walls & ceilings, new entrance doors to satisfy planning / grease trap €65k

Other items - Plates Glasses, light fittings etc - all Ikea €4k

Other ancillary items have allowed 5k.

Signage 2k

EPOS system and kitchen printer 2k


And thats without any nasty surprises. I am expecting nasty surprises to come in between 5-10k

I will have a good looking and polished cafe, with approx 80 seat capacity.

My break even figure per week will be €8,400. Average spend needs to be €7.80 ex vat per person

You need to be on your game here, your coming into this far to casually in my opinion. I looked at venues for two years before I leaped at my location, background and qualification wise I would be extremely attractive to a landlord.

I offered significantly less rent than others but secured the unit - I mean 25% less rent. Its not just about the money - you will find it incredibly hard to find a unit that you can get - and while you are looking, getting frustrated and pissed off, and getting messed around by estate agents who won't have much time for you, you will see an average unit thats a huge risk but you will convince yourself its the one and you'll jump in. And thats the big problem.

Good luck with it. If I can help I will.

lem865

Fair play to you Bandara for posting your costings.

Does your breakeven point take into account the paying back of the 180k invested in the business as outlined by you or would this be done out of the profit? Also would I be right in saying this cafe is outside Dublin or any other big city as the rents there seem to be insane at the minuet!

All the best, it looks like you are on the right track anyway.

CeilingFly

Look for a good pub or golf club that is looking to outsource its food offering.

That way the kitchen is there as is the premises, but I think 25k is quite low for a standalone premises.

duploelabs

CeilingFly wrote: »

Look for a good pub or golf club that is looking to outsource its food offering.

That way the kitchen is there as is the premises, but I think 25k is quite low for a standalone premises.

Or an independent producer who specialises in that market *cough cough*

Bandara

lem865 wrote: »

Fair play to you Bandara for posting your costings.

Does your breakeven point take into account the paying back of the 180k invested in the business as outlined by you or would this be done out of the profit? Also would I be right in saying this cafe is outside Dublin or any other big city as the rents there seem to be insane at the minuet!

All the best, it looks like you are on the right track anyway.

Hi lem

The capital investment will be fully repaid by the business within 5 years. I would not see it as feasible otherwise.

Cafe is located in Dublin, in a working class area with huge footfall and no like minded competition, only takeaways and junk food outlets in the area. I think it will do very well.