Club cars

yop

Hi All
Wondering if any of you have experience in how club cars are funded and managed within your club.

We need to get a club car on the road but its going to cost a good chunk to buy it, insure it and get it ready.
Also the insurance company needs a named driver.
Also the running costs, if a rider (s) takes it to the race how do you manage the cost of that trip and insurance.

Many thanks

slow

A lot of club cars are owned by clubs that have good sponsors, so the sponsorship money pays for the running of the car. Some clubs charge a contribution to the riders who use it to part cover the fuel.

Be aware, that since 2016, a lot of social, domestic and pleasure motor insurance policies won't cover driving in the race cavalcade. A lot of northern clubs are now using the same insurer and the insurance for the year is around £900. Down south, a lot of car drivers aren't aware that their insurance cover possibly isn't sufficient...

buffalo

We are facing a challenge with insuring our car at present.

Previously we had one named driver and an open drive policy, but given that any claims would have an impact on that named driver's personal policy, we aren't following that approach any more.

If you have someone who is willing to take that on and has a good insurance history, great. You might even then restrict drivers to people who can show they have 'driving other cars' on their own policy and they will claim on that if needed.

Otherwise I'd try find a local business who could sponsor you and register it as a company car, or find a local insurer who'll sponsor you.

CramCycle

buffalo wrote: »

We are facing a challenge with insuring our car at present.

Previously we had one named driver and an open drive policy, but given that any claims would have an impact on that named driver's personal policy, we aren't following that approach any more.

If you have someone who is willing to take that on and has a good insurance history, great. You might even then restrict drivers to people who can show they have 'driving other cars' on their own policy and they will claim on that if needed.

Otherwise I'd try find a local business who could sponsor you and register it as a company car, or find a local insurer who'll sponsor you.

If the car is road worthy and the driver has open insurance, the car does not need to be insured (according to the motor forum here) in many cases. I in fact went through my old documents over the years and with one exception, they were right, there was no need for the other car to be insured.

Eamonnator

CramCycle wrote: »

If the car is road worthy and the driver has open insurance, the car does not need to be insured (according to the motor forum here) in many cases. I in fact went through my old documents over the years and with one exception, they were right, there was no need for the other car to be insured.

This might well be the case, however, you would have difficulty taxing the car, if it's not insured.

CramCycle

Eamonnator wrote: »

This might well be the case, however, you would have difficulty taxing the car, if it's not insured.

I always wondered about this, is it illegal to have a car taxed but not insured? Every time I fill out my online tax, I never know my insurance number so I just make it up. i have done the same in the past in the tax office and they have never even queried it.

martyc5674

Eamonnator wrote: »

This might well be the case, however, you would have difficulty taxing the car, if it's not insured.

You can tax a car without having an insurance policy.

fat bloke

Eamonnator wrote: »

This might well be the case, however, you would have difficulty taxing the car, if it's not insured.

That's not the case. I know they ASK for an insurance policy number when you tax your car online but the systems aren't linked and you can write any ol number in the box.

I resent the request anyway, one has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the other. 1234ASKMEAR$is my policy. :pac:

yop

Ok, so from reading this.


The car doesn't have to have insurance, even though the tax system "kinda" ask you for a policy number, which is never actually validated.
If a driver wants to take the car, their own insurance needs to be either "Open Insurance" or "Can drive other cars".

I need to find a sugar daddy to sponsor the car!

CramCycle

yop wrote: »

Ok, so from reading this.


The car doesn't have to have insurance, even though the tax system "kinda" ask you for a policy number, which is never actually validated.
If a driver wants to take the car, their own insurance needs to be either "Open Insurance" or "Can drive other cars".

I need to find a sugar daddy to sponsor the car!

Also the club would be expected to do some due diligence on this. Verify that the person is licensed and insured in such a manner to allow the club member to drive legally on the road.

This might be in the form of a disclaimer but I would be looking for a copy of their license and policy document, to put off chancers, and there would be some. Also to understand that these open policies normally only cover 3rd party in the case of an accident, so if they do mess up, be prepared for the club to take the hit.

buffalo

yop wrote: »

Ok, so from reading this.


The car doesn't have to have insurance, even though the tax system "kinda" ask you for a policy number, which is never actually validated.
If a driver wants to take the car, their own insurance needs to be either "Open Insurance" or "Can drive other cars".

I need to find a sugar daddy to sponsor the car!

Be careful - open drive is a policy on a car that lets other insured drivers use that car. So you might get that for the club car.

If you don't get that, any drivers need to have 'can drive other cars' on their own policies in order for them to drive the club car (as opposed to their own car).

(I'm saying all this as someone who doesn't own a car, so I may be mistaken.)

CramCycle

buffalo wrote: »

Be careful - open drive is a policy on a car that lets other insured drivers use that car. So you might get that for the club car.

You need someone to agree to be the insured party in this case, so adds a risk to them affecting their own future insurance if someone has an accident. I'd be happy to do it for my club as I have years of named driver but no longer have a policy in my own name and really don't care, but alot of people would and you would be hard pressed in many clubs to find someone stupid enough (like me) to volunteer their name IMO.

If you don't get that, any drivers need to have 'can drive other cars' on their own policies in order for them to drive the club car (as opposed to their own car).

This would be the most sensible option for members. It exposes the club a bit more as they might be liable to cover damage to the car directly (although some rare policies offer this as comprehensive, most are 3rd party cover only)

(I'm saying all this as someone who doesn't own a car, so I may be mistaken.)

It seems pretty accurate.

Eamonnator

CramCycle wrote: »

I always wondered about this, is it illegal to have a car taxed but not insured? Every time I fill out my online tax, I never know my insurance number so I just make it up. i have done the same in the past in the tax office and they have never even queried it.

I remember, in the days before online tax, going to the Tax Office to tax the car. I used have to show insurance cert.
I can't find anything to prove it, but I was always under the impression, that you couldn't, legally, tax a vehicle, without having a valid certificate of insurance, covering that vehicle.

Edit:
Would there be an offence there of making a false declaration, if you put down an insurance policy number, that didn't exist?

CramCycle

Eamonnator wrote: »

I remember, in the days before online tax, going to the Tax Office to tax the car. I used have to show insurance cert.
I can't find anything to prove it, but I was always under the impression, that you couldn't, legally, tax a vehicle, without having a valid certificate of insurance, covering that vehicle.

I taxed mine about a month ago and I had the cert with me, filled out the form but they never asked. Once its online you just seem to have to fill in a random field with whatever you want.

I do remember having to do this years ago but again, not sure if it is bureaucracy for the sake of it, I cannot find anything in law or in regards legally taxing to say you couldn't.

The only example of something you have to do is if it is commercial, they are linked to the DOE and they won't tax unless your DOE is in date. I think they are linked to the NCT as well but that only throws up a warning they can go past in the office.

Eamonnator

https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/pdf/RF100A_en.pdf

See section 5 of this form.
Declaration, stating all information is true.
If you sign it, knowing it to be false, are you committing an offence?

Edit:
Ive just read the notes. "heavy penalties for false declaration"

CramCycle

Eamonnator wrote: »

https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/pdf/RF100A_en.pdf

See section 5 of this form.
Declaration, stating all information is true.
If you sign it, knowing it to be false, are you committing an offence?

Edit:
Ive just read the notes. "heavy penalties for false declaration"

Damn it, the cars I have been taxing have always been insured so it would have been a clerical error and one that could have been corrected if it was ever flagged.

This on the other hand does seem to imply that it has to be insured by someone at the time of taxing, although note C3 could be argued that if you use a policy number in your name (as in one from another car) that allows you to drive other road worthy vehicles.

531

Is it not a legal requirement to have a valid (relating to that car) insurance disk (even though they are square!) on a car?

jimmycrackcorm

531 wrote:

Is it not a legal requirement to have a valid (relating to that car) insurance disk (even though they are square!) on a car?

It is. Also many, if not all own insurance policies allowing driving of other cars require that car to have is own insurance.

The easiest way to get a club car insured is via a commercial sponsor who actually owns the car and has a fleet insurance policy. These are normally open driver with the permission of the owner. The driver is also not required to have their own personal insurance, just a driving licence.

I'll actually be driving a vehicle this weekend under those circumstances.

Eamonnator

CramCycle wrote: »

Damn it, the cars I have been taxing have always been insured so it would have been a clerical error and one that could have been corrected if it was ever flagged.

This on the other hand does seem to imply that it has to be insured by someone at the time of taxing, although note C3 could be argued that if you use a policy number in your name (as in one from another car) that allows you to drive other road worthy vehicles.

Nah, you're clutching at straws now.
And I'm firmly of the opinion, that 10,000 angels can fit on the head of a pin.

yop

Ok....

So get a car sponsored which will be insured by the garage. OR get a garage to take the club car onto their insurance.
Then for races, the drivers have to have "Can drive other cars" on their insurance.

So who wants to sponsor us a car!