Metro West replacement

Thrashssacre

With the potential separating of luas lines and general upgrade due to Dublin's public transport for the next 10/15 years, I was wondering if a possible long orbital Luas route would be suitable to provide link up and orbital journeys maybe starting in dundrum or sandyford Luas and working its way to tallaght (red line)- clondalkin (dart/commuter rail) - Liffey valley (Luas Lucan) - porterstown (dart/commuter rail) - finglas (green line) - DCU (metrolink).

I'm hoping it will use metro West allignment from tallaght to porterstown.

I'm sure there are many obstacles to this route choice but just thought I'd throw out the idea.

ohographite

Thrashssacre wrote: »

With the potential separating of luas lines and general upgrade due to Dublin's public transport for the next 10/15 years, I was wondering if a possible long orbital Luas route would be suitable to provide link up and orbital journeys maybe starting in dundrum or sandyford Luas and working its way to tallaght (red line)- clondalkin (dart/commuter rail) - Liffey valley (Luas Lucan) - porterstown (dart/commuter rail) - finglas (green line) - DCU (metrolink).

I'm hoping it will use metro West allignment from tallaght to porterstown.

I'm sure there are many obstacles to this route choice but just thought I'd throw out the idea.

You could start it in brides glen, and it could share the route of the green line until around the sandyford area, and then it could run to tallaght, and then follow the route of the red line from the square to red cow, and then it would continue north as you suggested.

In my opinion, it is very important for Dublin that this, or something like it, goes ahead.

Stephen15

I made a suggestion on another thread about Metrolink that DART underground should be built as a second Metro line from the IFSC to Blanchardstown with a Lucan spur. The route I would suggest is IFSC, Connolly, O'Connell Street (for interchange with current Metrolink proposal and both Luas lines), Christchurch, Hueston, Inchicore, Chapelizod where the line splits with one going over a bridge over the Liffey towards Blanchardstown and another starting on the Southside towards Lucan.

This proposal in my opinion would kill three birds with one stone. 1. DART underground 2. Metro West 3. The need for rail links to Lucan and Blanchardstown. The Blachardstown spur would serve Castleknock, Blackchardstown SC and potentially Damastown. The Lucan one would serve Palmerstown, Liffey Valley and Lucan.

I know it's complete fantasy but in my opinion it would make far more sense than either DU or MW. The money saved by not building DU as heavy rail could be spent on building the line outwards away from the city centre.

n97 mini

Stephen15 wrote: »

I made a suggestion on another thread about Metrolink that DART underground should be built as a second Metro line from the IFSC to Blanchardstown with a Lucan spur. The route I would suggest is IFSC, Connolly, O'Connell Street (for interchange with current Metrolink proposal and both Luas lines), Christchurch, Hueston, Inchicore, Chapelizod where the line splits with one going over a bridge over the Liffey towards Blanchardstown and another starting on the Southside towards Lucan.

This proposal in my opinion would kill three birds with one stone. 1. DART underground 2. Metro West 3. The need for rail links to Lucan and Blanchardstown. The Blachardstown spur would serve Castleknock, Blackchardstown SC and potentially Damastown. The Lucan one would serve Palmerstown, Liffey Valley and Lucan.

I know it's complete fantasy but in my opinion it would make far more sense than either DU or MW. The money saved by not building DU as heavy rail could be spent on building the line outwards away from the city centre.

Blanchardstown is already served by the Maynooth line. Lucan (and Palmnerstown) has the luxury of having good quality dual carriageway with dedicated bus lane from the city centre to Leixlip.

P_1

Stephen15 wrote: »

I made a suggestion on another thread about Metrolink that DART underground should be built as a second Metro line from the IFSC to Blanchardstown with a Lucan spur. The route I would suggest is IFSC, Connolly, O'Connell Street (for interchange with current Metrolink proposal and both Luas lines), Christchurch, Hueston, Inchicore, Chapelizod where the line splits with one going over a bridge over the Liffey towards Blanchardstown and another starting on the Southside towards Lucan.

This proposal in my opinion would kill three birds with one stone. 1. DART underground 2. Metro West 3. The need for rail links to Lucan and Blanchardstown. The Blachardstown spur would serve Castleknock, Blackchardstown SC and potentially Damastown. The Lucan one would serve Palmerstown, Liffey Valley and Lucan.

I know it's complete fantasy but in my opinion it would make far more sense than either DU or MW. The money saved by not building DU as heavy rail could be spent on building the line outwards away from the city centre.

Isn't the gradient not way too steep for railway going up from the Liffey towards Blanch?

Stephen15

n97 mini wrote: »

Blanchardstown is already served by the Maynooth line. Lucan (and Palmnerstown) has the luxury of having good quality dual carriageway with dedicated bus lane from the city centre to Leixlip.

Not in its entirety most of Blancharstown is not within walking distance of the rail stations. Bus transport has the disadvantage of both capacity and traffic restrictions. All Lucan bound buses serve Chapelizod Village a serious bottleneck and then suffer further delays in the city centre. They're not that great, Metro would provide far more capacity than buses.

If you built a Metro line to Lucan you terminate the 25/a/b/d, 66/a/b and the 67 at Liffey Valley that free up a lot of capacity and improve services across the board. Likewise with a lot of the Blachardstown routes.

hmmm

n97 mini wrote: »

Blanchardstown is already served by the Maynooth line. Lucan (and Palmnerstown) has the luxury of having good quality dual carriageway with dedicated bus lane from the city centre to Leixlip.

West Dublin buses are blocked quite badly by the M50 roundabout at rush hour, which could do with some form of bus prioritisation.

Irish Steve

P_1 wrote: »

Isn't the gradient not way too steep for railway going up from the Liffey towards Blanch?

It will depend on where they cross the Liffey.

If you want to get depressed, have a look at a report from 2006 about Metro West,
www.mcrit.com/metrozaragoza/documents/europa/options_west.pdf

and see what has been missed out on for too long, this was being proposed over 12 YEARS ago, and not a thing has been done since of note, and the chances of doing this now are probably much reduced due to losing the alignments that would have been available then.

Metro west, linked to the airport, is still needed, and would make a huge difference to massive numbers of people on a daily basis.

daheff

Stephen15 wrote: »

If you built a Metro line to Lucan you terminate the 25/a/b/d, 66/a/b and the 67 at Liffey Valley that free up a lot of capacity and improve services across the board. Likewise with a lot of the Blachardstown routes.

What? :eek:

you know 66 & 67 dont terminate in Lucan, right? So terminating them at Liffey Valley would reduce service to Maynooth /Leixlip/Celbridge.

In any case, why reduce those (or any) bus lines because of a new metro/luas? Surely the plan should be to maximise commuting options & capacity? Give commuters the choice.

Personally i think there should be a luas/metro that goes (roughly) along the perimeter of the M50 (think a C around west Dublin), with lines going into /across the city like wheel spokes.

Carawaystick

Theres a huge need to get some Public transport from the N4 and N7 corridors to Sandyford, and from D15 across the liffey also.

Stephen15

daheff wrote: »

What? :eek:

you know 66 & 67 dont terminate in Lucan, right? So terminating them at Liffey Valley would reduce service to Maynooth /Leixlip/Celbridge.

In any case, why reduce those (or any) bus lines because of a new metro/luas? Surely the plan should be to maximise commuting options & capacity? Give commuters the choice.

Personally i think there should be a luas/metro that goes (roughly) along the perimeter of the M50 (think a C around west Dublin), with lines going into /across the city like wheel spokes.

I do know that I'm not stupid. If someone wants to go to destinations beyond Lucan that those buses serve they could get the get the metro to Liffey Valley and the bus onwards. Shorter journeys mean those buses could be increased in frequency as they wouldn't have to deal with as much traffic congestion.

n97 mini

Stephen15 wrote: »

Not in its entirety most of Blancharstown is not within walking distance of the rail stations. Bus transport has the disadvantage of both capacity and traffic restrictions. All Lucan bound buses serve Chapelizod Village a serious bottleneck and then suffer further delays in the city centre. They're not that great, Metro would provide far more capacity than buses.

If you built a Metro line to Lucan you terminate the 25/a/b/d, 66/a/b and the 67 at Liffey Valley that free up a lot of capacity and improve services across the board. Likewise with a lot of the Blachardstown routes.

Blanchardstown village itself is served by Castleknock station, a 5 minute walk away (station used to be called Blanchardstown station). Feeder buses could link places like the shopping centre and the NAC to the nearest rail station.

The 25a/b don't serve Chapelizod. They have free running (almost) from Lucan to Hesuton.

Not meaning to be derisory, but you don't seem very familiar with transport in west Dublin.

n97 mini

hmmm wrote: »

West Dublin buses are blocked quite badly by the M50 roundabout at rush hour, which could do with some form of bus prioritisation.

There is no roundabout where the N4 meets the M50. However, the bus lanes could be done better.

yabadabado

DB should be setting up routes to the stations and have linked in fares with the other forms of PT.
Hopefully this happens that regular buses loop around catchment areas and feed the PT routes that are more suitable into the city centre.

It works in other countries and needs to be done in Dublin.

Stephen15

n97 mini wrote: »

Blanchardstown village itself is served by Castleknock station, a 5 minute walk away (station used to be called Blanchardstown station). Feeder buses could link places like the shopping centre and the NAC to the nearest rail station.

The 25a/b don't serve Chapelizod. They have free running (almost) from Lucan to Hesuton.

Not meaning to be derisory, but you don't seem very familiar with transport in west Dublin.

I'm not that familiar with really but surely a Metro line to there would make sense many people who use. I would obviously preference the current Metrolink and DART expansion proposals over my ideas.

My ideas could start to be implemented 20-30 years down the tracks (pardon the pun) once Metrolink is up and running and there is a desire for a second Metro line. I think my proposals are better than both the DART underground and Metro West proposals.

My idea rolls DART underground and Metro West into one and if the government ever had any desire to build either or both they should my proposal instead. Blanchardstown is a lot more than just the village and Shopping Centre its one of the largest urban areas in the country and growing thats like saying Tallaght is just the Square and the village.

Stephen15

yabadabado wrote: »

DB should be setting up routes to the stations and have linked in fares with the other forms of PT.
Hopefully this happens that regular buses loop around catchment areas and feed the PT routes that are more suitable into the city centre.

It works in other countries and needs to be done in Dublin.

DB don't call the shots the NTA do. Is your suggestion not very similar to Leap 90.

roadmaster

Thrashssacre wrote: »

With the potential separating of luas lines and general upgrade due to Dublin's public transport for the next 10/15 years, I was wondering if a possible long orbital Luas route would be suitable to provide link up and orbital journeys maybe starting in dundrum or sandyford Luas and working its way to tallaght (red line)- clondalkin (dart/commuter rail) - Liffey valley (Luas Lucan) - porterstown (dart/commuter rail) - finglas (green line) - DCU (metrolink).

I'm hoping it will use metro West allignment from tallaght to porterstown.

I'm sure there are many obstacles to this route choice but just thought I'd throw out the idea.

it might not be a bad idea, i can only speak from the northern side of the liffey but there is just about room i think to fit a luas line in from porterstown up to blanch shopping center Starting at Luttrellstown school all the land behind it has being zoned for residential development so there alone is a need for public transport .

Across the road from st mochtas soccer club there a square piece of land that i have being told was left for a metro station you could build a luas station here and maybe a new rail station ? Again it will be tight but you can run the luas line along the south side of clonsilla road/r121 up to the shopping center for a stop.

Then continue along the R121 stopping at ITB with further stops serving all the business parks out there and the developing housing estates at tyrellstown and hollystown then swinging back either for connection at a future park and ride for the Finglas line. It may seam that i am sending it through a lot of unused space particularly near hollystown but ten years from now these areas will be flooded with houses.

hmmm

n97 mini wrote: »

There is no roundabout where the N4 meets the M50. However, the bus lanes could be done better.

OK Mr Pedantic. The buses are blocked quite badly at the point where the N4 meets the M50, where the roundabout used to be.

There is no bus lane there.

Lots of people seem to think that just because a bus lane exists in places, the bus lane is free moving. The quays should give a lie to this.

n97 mini

hmmm wrote: »

OK Mr Pedantic. The buses are blocked quite badly at the point where the N4 meets the M50, where the roundabout used to be.

There is no bus lane there.

Lots of people seem to think that just because a bus lane exists in places, the bus lane is free moving. The quays should give a lie to this.

I did agree that the bus lanes could be done better.

ignorance is strength

The Bus Connects project will replicate that route with a continuous bus lane, done in conjunction with better buses and standardised tickets.

Lord Glentoran

n97 mini wrote: »

I did agree that the bus lanes could be done better.

A long way from freeflowing. Let's not pretend that buses are as good as trams or trains.