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Underrated players

  • 05-03-2018 6:36pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,560 ✭✭✭ thesultan


    Since we had overrated I'm going for Underrated.
    Brick Walsh. A centre foward, midfield, centre back full back and wing foward for his county. All stars in three positions (Ken got the same but was midfield for his club the year he got the all star there . As a midfielder I remember him bettering Kenny O'connor axis.

    Paddy mcbreaty possibly the best foward in the game at present. For me he has taken over from mcmanus as the best man that is at times double marked. Donegals poor form.in championship has hidden his greatness


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 13,306 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious


    thesultan wrote: »
    Since we had overrated I'm going for Underrated.
    Brick Walsh. A centre foward, midfield, centre back full back and wing foward for his county. All stars in three positions (Ken got the same but was midfield for his club the year he got the all star there . As a midfielder I remember him bettering Kenny O'connor axis.

    Paddy mcbreaty
    possibly the best foward in the game at present. For me he has taken over from mcmanus as the best man that is at times double marked. Donegals poor form.in championship has hidden his greatness

    But he is well recognised as a top class forward, he is hardly "underrated"

    Underrated is some guy who works flat out but rarely gets much notice.

    Personally I can't think of anyone right now.

    Donnacha Walsh for Kerry used to be underrated until everyone realised he was underrated and then he ended up overrated.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,727 ✭✭✭ WesternZulu


    Kevin McLoughlin for Mayo is slightly under rated I feel.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭ robbiezero


    Michael Fitzsimons of Dublin maybe.
    McMahon and Cooper get most of the plaudits in that line for Dubs. I think he is a quietly hugely effective defender.

    Tom O Sullivan the Kerry corner back of the last decade was a superb defender I thought, but maybe overshadowed by the silkier Marc O'Se and the superb Moynihan.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,306 ✭✭✭✭ Fr Tod Umptious


    robbiezero wrote: »
    Michael Fitzsimons of Dublin maybe.
    McMahon and Cooper get most of the plaudits in that line for Dubs. I think he is a quietly hugely effective defender.

    Tom O Sullivan the Kerry corner back of the last decade was a superb defender I thought, but maybe overshadowed by the silkier Marc O'Se and the superb Moynihan.

    Tom O'Sullivan got MOTM in the 2009 Final.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,665 ✭✭✭ Fann Linn


    Paddy Andrews


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭ TCDStudent1


    Going back a few years but Neil Finnegan was a criminally under-rated player for Galway. Played on a team with Joyce, Fallon, Donnellan, Savage. However, he is rarely mentioned in comparison to those guys when people talk about that team.

    In the current day, I think Jason Doherty is somewhat under-rated for Mayo. He is a fantastic player but doesn't get much limelight.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,687 ✭✭✭ corny


    James McCarthy. Got an All Star last year because he scored a couple of points, which admittedly were important, but if he doesn't score them its just another year where his all round excellence is ignored.

    Brilliant player attack and defence and been playing to that standard for Dublin since he was 20.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭ The_Honeybadger


    Barry John Keane, not a top class forward by any means but very much under appreciated by Kerry fans, I have heard numerous calls for him to be dropped off the panel for example. I don’t think he is a starter but he regularly kicks points off the bench, most other counties would be glad to have him.

    Not sure that James McCarthy is underrated, he was in the shakeup for POTY last year meaning he is regarded among the best in the country. The lack of all stars up to last year is probably due to the fact that he always played in the half back line and was competing with the likes of Keegan, Mccaffery, Murphy, Cian O’Sullivan, Boyle, Higgins, Lacey etc for awards. Many of the best players in the country play or played in that line. He excelled in midfield last year and is probably one of these guys that could play anywhere.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,687 ✭✭✭ corny


    mickeyk wrote: »
    Barry John Keane, not a top class forward by any means but very much under appreciated by Kerry fans, I have heard numerous calls for him to be dropped off the panel for example. I don’t think he is a starter but he regularly kicks points off the bench, most other counties would be glad to have him.

    Not sure that James McCarthy is underrated, he was in the shakeup for POTY last year meaning he is regarded among the best in the country. The lack of all stars up to last year is probably due to the fact that he always played in the half back line and was competing with the likes of Keegan, Mccaffery, Murphy, Cian O’Sullivan, Boyle, Higgins, Lacey etc for awards. Many of the best players in the country play or played in that line. He excelled in midfield last year and is probably one of these guys that could play anywhere.

    Yeah he's better than all them. Underrated in that not many would agree though.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 10,934 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Stoner


    mickeyk wrote:
    The lack of all stars up to last year is probably due to the fact that he always played in the half back line and was competing with the likes of Keegan, Mccaffery, Murphy, Cian O’Sullivan, Boyle, Higgins, Lacey etc for awards.

    He's a better player than all of them IMO including Keegan. His reading of the game and ability to turn it on is better than any Dublin defender. He was moved back into the half back line for the final last year, didn't score a goal like Keegan did, but showed up for the last 10 minutes to dismantle the Mayo kickout and imo win the game for Dublin.
    It's not a popular opinion in the Mayo camp but his ball winning ability was Imo the main factor in David Clarkes lack of options and his effective collapse in the final last year

    Keegan is also a great reader of momentum, but McCarthy has influenced the bigger games better than Keegan in the last 15 minutes imo.

    Higgins, McCaffery (technically), Keegan, Boyle, Cian O'Sullivan all played and simply didn't do what he did. The Mayo bench had no time to respond to it.

    He's had just turned 21 when he won an AI in 2011. He's marked P Galvin very tightly in more than one game.

    He's picked up Michael Murphy very effectively too.

    Midfield is not his position imo, he does not dominant there and wouldn't contribute enough in the early stages against a Mayo midfield with AOS and SOS. Altough he started there in a few games last year he wouldn't be there if Fenton or MDMA we're fully fit.
    He was patching a hole there last year imo
    In many games he switched back to the half backs including the final (where Flynn came into midfield early and had a poor game there )

    Speaking of Mayo midfielders Parsons is overshadowed in the Mayo team Imo. However if you start AOS SOS and Parsons he's the only one capable to still have juice left in the "Championship quarter". He doesn't score a lot, that imo holds him back too much in some people's eyes.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭ The_Honeybadger


    Stoner wrote: »
    He's a better player than all of them IMO including Keegan. His reading of the game and ability to turn it on is better than any Dublin defender. He was moved back into the half back line for the final last year, didn't score a goal like Keegan did, but showed up for the last 10 minutes to dismantle the Mayo kickout and imo win the game for Dublin.
    It's not a popular opinion in the Mayo camp but his ball winning ability was Imo the main factor in David Clarkes lack of options and his effective collapse in the final last year

    Keegan is also a great reader of momentum, but McCarthy has influenced the bigger games better than Keegan in the last 15 minutes imo.

    Higgins, McCaffery (technically), Keegan, Boyle, Cian O'Sullivan all played and simply didn't do what he did. The Mayo bench had no time to respond to it.

    He's had just turned 21 when he won an AI in 2011. He's marked P Galvin very tightly in more than one game.

    He's picked up Michael Murphy very effectively too.

    Midfield is not his position imo, he does not dominant there and wouldn't contribute enough in the early stages against a Mayo midfield with AOS and SOS. Altough he started there in a few games last year he wouldn't be there if Fenton or MDMA we're fully fit.
    He was patching a hole there last year imo
    In many games he switched back to the half backs including the final (where Flynn came into midfield early and had a poor game there )

    Speaking of Mayo midfielders Parsons is overshadowed in the Mayo team Imo. However if you start AOS SOS and Parsons he's the only one capable to still have juice left in the "Championship quarter". He doesn't score a lot, that imo holds him back too much in some people's eyes.

    Hard to argue with a lot of that, I think half backs these days are a key part of the attack and are often judged on what they do on the overlap rather than their reading of the game and more traditional defensive qualities. Not saying McCarthy isn’t very good going forward, but Keegan and Mccaffery would be more dynamic in that respect.

    He probably was under appreciated for some time but I thought he got a lot of kudos last year and was one of only two outfield players selected for POTY. He probably was the difference in the final and you could make a strong argument that he was POTY.

    Also agree he is not a midfielder but he solved an issue for the team by slotting in there. I think he would be comfortable in a lot of positions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,687 ✭✭✭ corny


    Stoner wrote: »
    He's a better player than all of them IMO including Keegan. His reading of the game and ability to turn it on is better than any Dublin defender. He was moved back into the half back line for the final last year, didn't score a goal like Keegan did, but showed up for the last 10 minutes to dismantle the Mayo kickout and imo win the game for Dublin.
    It's not a popular opinion in the Mayo camp but his ball winning ability was Imo the main factor in David Clarkes lack of options and his effective collapse in the final last year

    Keegan is also a great reader of momentum, but McCarthy has influenced the bigger games better than Keegan in the last 15 minutes imo.

    Higgins, McCaffery (technically), Keegan, Boyle, Cian O'Sullivan all played and simply didn't do what he did. The Mayo bench had no time to respond to it.

    He's had just turned 21 when he won an AI in 2011. He's marked P Galvin very tightly in more than one game.

    He's picked up Michael Murphy very effectively too.

    Midfield is not his position imo, he does not dominant there and wouldn't contribute enough in the early stages against a Mayo midfield with AOS and SOS. Altough he started there in a few games last year he wouldn't be there if Fenton or MDMA we're fully fit.
    He was patching a hole there last year imo
    In many games he switched back to the half backs including the final (where Flynn came into midfield early and had a poor game there )

    Speaking of Mayo midfielders Parsons is overshadowed in the Mayo team Imo. However if you start AOS SOS and Parsons he's the only one capable to still have juice left in the "Championship quarter". He doesn't score a lot, that imo holds him back too much in some people's eyes.

    Its his running off the ball thats always impressed me. His timing in arriving on the shoulder at just the right moment is amazing.

    Just cause i thought it was great and its fresh in my mind :).....



    4.28 he makes one run thats shut off by the Mayo defenders. Ball goes wide, comes back in and he's the only one alive to making another. He times it perfectly and takes two defenders out just by timing it right. Diarmuid O Connors reaction (where the **** did he go) is priceless btw.

    When it leads to goal chances that type of stuff is memorable but he's forever doing that and creating chances for others. Its easily glossed over in general play. He'd be a nightmare to mark.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,277 danganabu


    From my own county I would say James Barry, nothing spectacualr but an incredibly solid full back, as all counties, with the notable exception of Galway have discovered full back is the hardest position on the team to fill, Barry went back there for Tipp having traditionally been a centre back/wing back simply because we had no one else but has done a very good if unspectacular job.

    Outside my own county I would say that Conor Fogarty Kilkenny is extremly underrated as is Shane Dowling of Limerick.

    From days gone by there were two centre backs that were criminally over looked and that was Tipp's Conor O'Mahoney and Kilkenny's Brian Hogan both changed the way centre backs play and in particular Hogan, ask any full back that played behind either how good they were, Noel Hickey in particular was only half the hurler without Hogan in front of him.

    Another one from the past and I'm not sure if you could clasify him as underrated as most recognise that he was a top player but for me Ollie Canning is the best corner back I ever seen and doen't get anywhere near the recognition his younger brother does and for me he was every bit as good if not better but because he was a corner back didnt always grab the headlines.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,930 jr86


    MDMA for me. Yes, he got FOTY a few years back but there's a lot out there who don't rate him simply as he's not the most graceful footballer

    He's been one of the most effective players of the decade for me, his cameos off the bench against mayo in 2015 and 2016 replays stick in the memory (sadly :) ), and that's not to mention his pomp years. You don't have to be the most talented player to have the most influence on the game

    Saying that, I'd be very interested to see his pass conversion ratio, he very seldom does anything stupid with the ball and it may not be pretty to watch but he generally always finds a man with his kick passes

    Agree with Fitzsimons reference above

    Brendan Harrison for Mayo who you'll rarely see singled out for praise ahead of the more renowned names.

    Eamonn Brannigan for Galway but it looks like he's starting to get the praise his work-rate and application merits.

    I don't think jason Doherty is under-rated anymore


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,797 ✭✭✭✭ PARlance


    I was going to mention Parsons but I said I would wait till a non-Mayo poster did. Even better that it was a Dub ;)

    Definitely an underrated player imo, to focus in on one particular skill of his, there's not many better at "ripping" a ball out of opposition hands. I still can't figure out how he does it, ripping is not the best term... he just seems to have a nack of taking the ball of someone without much contact at all.

    I would agree with BJK as being underrated. In the same breath, I'll say that he seems to be a better sub / impact player. I don't think there's a forward in the Country hungrier to get scores.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,930 jr86


    But he is well recognised as a top class forward, he is hardly "underrated"

    Probably (strictly speaking) a "doesn't get the universal praise I feel he deserves" is a more suitable title


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,763 ✭✭✭ castletownman


    From my own county, Aidan Nolan. Chin gets the plaudits for his occasional flashes of brilliance and athleticism, Dee O'Keeffe for his consistent score-getting, but neither would be as effective without Nolan doing the donkey-work in the middle third. The ultimate team player for Wexford and well able to play if allowed (one of the best dual players in the local championship). I have likened him to N'Golo Kante before in terms of his importance to the "system" and still consider it lunacy that he was dropped for the All-Ireland QF last year.

    From the outside looking in, Mick Fitzsimons and Brendan Harrison have already been mentioned but I would add Karl O'Connell and Fintan Kelly to the list. O'Connell is consistenly one of Monaghan's best performers every week, can play in a host of different positions but goes totally under the radar, while Kelly is as good a scoring back as anyone in the game. I think he scored three goals in the championship last year which must surely be a record for a player nominally named at corner-back. Aidan Breen of Fermanagh strikes me as another player with consistent excellence that goes unheralded as he plays for a "lesser" county.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,925 ✭✭✭ aidan24326


    danganabu wrote: »
    Another one from the past and I'm not sure if you could clasify him as underrated as most recognise that he was a top player but for me Ollie Canning is the best corner back I ever seen and doen't get anywhere near the recognition his younger brother does and for me he was every bit as good if not better but because he was a corner back didnt always grab the headlines.

    In fairness I think Ollie is widely regarded as one of the best defenders of his generation, though I suppose he does get a bit overshadowed by Joe. But I'm not sure he'd qualify as under-rated since most people would have him up there with the best defenders of the last 20 years. In the 2014 club final he still looked the best player on the pitch even at almost 38, and playing in the forwards.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,696 ✭✭✭ Always_Running


    Donie Smith Roscommon, his younger and taller brother Enda grabs more of the media attention but Donie is probably a harder worker and better all round footballer than him. His current management seem to underrate him also by giving him very few starts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    Mick Fitzsimons for me. Closest thing Dublin have to old fashioned corner back: tough, and efficient and rarely ventures too far from home. We are fortunate that Cuala never got him playing senior hurling!

    I would also agree with Dangan on Ollie Canning. Similar in a way to Fitzsimons. Job was to stop opposing player doing much damage and he did that mostly. Always got the impression he would have played a year or two more if had not been annoyed by some of what happened in last season, indeed might even have been his last game for Galway.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,831 ✭✭✭ billyhead


    Would Paul Mannion be considered under rated? I think he is a really classy footballer but a lot of the attention and plaudits are on Ciaran Kilkenny, Dermot Connoly when actually playing and Dean Rock


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭ Bonniedog


    billyhead wrote: »
    Would Paul Mannion be considered under rated? I think he is a really classy footballer but a lot of the attention and plaudits are on Ciaran Kilkenny, Dermot Connoly when actually playing and Dean Rock

    He has really started to come into his own and is holding his place. Was inclined a bit to put the head down and run into blind alleys, but is getting a lot cleverer in his use of the ball. Only really hitting the age now when forwards develop the guild and maturity to become even more effective.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,831 ✭✭✭ billyhead


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    He has really started to come into his own and is holding his place. Was inclined a bit to put the head down and run into blind alleys, but is getting a lot cleverer in his use of the ball. Only really hitting the age now when forwards develop the guild and maturity to become even more effective.

    True. He had a great championship last year


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,238 ✭✭✭✭ Diabhal Beag


    Colm Boyle doesn't really get enough credit. Hard as nails and can take his points. Always a pain in the arse when he plays Galway too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 984 ✭✭✭ manofwisdom


    Colm Boyle doesn't really get enough credit. Hard as nails and can take his points. Always a pain in the arse when he plays Galway too.
    Don't think you can call a 4 time All Star winner underrated. A better pure footballer than some of the more high profile Mayo players IMO.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,238 ✭✭✭✭ Diabhal Beag


    Don't think you can call a 4 time All Star winner underrated. A better pure footballer than some of the more high profile Mayo players IMO.
    That's a fair shout


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 4,627 Mod ✭✭✭✭ tedpan


    Éanna Ó Conchuir


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,282 ✭✭✭✭ bucketybuck


    Aidan Breen of Fermanagh strikes me as another player with consistent excellence that goes unheralded as he plays for a "lesser" county.

    In fairness he is only on the panel a few seasons and perhaps only in his 2nd season as a regular, in a team that got relegated last year you can't really expect much heralding.

    It does though lead to the player that was consistently overlooked and underrated for his entire career, Ryan McCluskey.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,702 ✭✭✭✭ keane2097


    In the current day, I think Jason Doherty is somewhat under-rated for Mayo. He is a fantastic player but doesn't get much limelight.

    He is a baller. Serious big game player. First person to come to mind when I see 'underrated'.
    corny wrote: »
    James McCarthy. Got an All Star last year because he scored a couple of points, which admittedly were important, but if he doesn't score them its just another year where his all round excellence is ignored.

    Brilliant player attack and defence and been playing to that standard for Dublin since he was 20.


    This guy is a colossus. In my eyes the clear MVP on one of the greatest teams of all time, at least as far as outfield players are concerned. If Kerry are playing Dublin in an All Ireland final and I can pick one guy to be missing it's James McCarthy.

    I would suggest that Paul Murphy is still underrated. The guy is mind-bogglingly good in every game.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,275 Mod ✭✭✭✭ seligehgit


    keane2097 wrote: »
    He is a baller. Serious big game player. First person to come to mind when I see 'underrated'.




    This guy is a colossus. In my eyes the clear MVP on one of the greatest teams of all time, at least as far as outfield players are concerned. If Kerry are playing Dublin in an All Ireland final and I can pick one guy to be missing it's James McCarthy.

    I would suggest that Paul Murphy is still underrated. The guy is mind-bogglingly good in every game.

    Murphy would probably be the first player to spring to mind for me.Immense player for Kerry every day out and I'd never have thought he'd the physique to be the player he is.

    McCarthy is Dublin's MVP when it comes to those clutch moments when a tight game is on the balance.

    He seems to particularly drive on when it's most needed.

    I only think he's underrated in terms of a team that is laden with all time greats.

    What team wouldn't give you their right arm to have a Brian Fenton in their team?


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