What happens when flights resume

milhous

So Ryanair and Aerlingus cancelled most flights until saturday morning. Will this have a knock on affect to already planned flights for Saturday or do they keep them on track and fit more flights in around them?

Or do they give preference to people who have possibly been sitting in a terminal for 12 hours and delay the planned ones?

Just curious as I'm supposed to fly into Dublin on Saturday with the babies and I think I'd rather stay here an extra few day than spend an unknown amount of hours in an airport trying to amuse the lads.!

JCX BXC

The point of completely postponing flights tomorrow is to have a smother return to ops Saturday. Most aircraft should be in place for operations to resume Saturday, except the EI LH fleet, which most of is currently in North America.

Jamie2k9

Those booked to fly on Saturday will fly while those who have had flights cancelled will be accommodated on flights pending availability and/or some additional flights added which should not impact existing schedules. There should't be major delays provided there is a smooth start to the day.

except the EI LH fleet, which most of is currently in North America.

Will fly back tomorrow night...

People who have paid and booked to fly Saturday fly Saturday. Others will fit in on spare seats or carriers will add extra flights (where possible) or use a larger aircraft (where possible).

Fred Swanson

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Irish Steve

A lot will depend on what the weather is doing on Saturday, the models are not clear at the moment, there is a strong chance that significant cold from the East may reload and keep the sort of weather we've had for the last few days going, if that is the case, it will all be down to how much snow falls tonight and tomorrow, and how quickly it can be cleared, from both the airport and the roads, as the airport can't operate without staff, who have to be able to get there, safely

The Veteran

Irish Steve wrote: »

A lot will depend on what the weather is doing on Saturday, the models are not clear at the moment, there is a strong chance that significant cold from the East may reload and keep the sort of weather we've had for the last few days going, if that is the case, it will all be down to how much snow falls tonight and tomorrow, and how quickly it can be cleared, from both the airport and the roads, as the airport can't operate without staff, who have to be able to get there, safely

All the airport agencies etc are now focused on resumption on Saturday from very early (for most people). That actually means some being in and working fully from 8/9pm tomorrow.

Lots of the hotels around the airport are busy with airport staff where employers are keeping essential crews and staff close by to remove the dependency on commuting.

The point made already is very important and that is that staff need to be able to get in safely and operate safely once in (that’s fine for those in the Terminal but those who work outside need to be very careful).

There will also be issues with making sure equipment doesn’t freeze over and that aircraft are not “parked” in the way of snow ploughs. That’s why all the moving parts have to work together.

Airport folk are a funny bunch - staff turned in yesterday and today and stay the distance.

I know several airlines were talking about bringing in larger aircraft to lift everyone on saturday. Others are running on low loads at present with room to cater for good numbers who need to rebook. For others there will be no point in travelling as the reason for travel is now “gone” (for example if you needed to be in London today for a meeting, you won’t travel on Saturday - no need).

Pat Dunne

The Veteran wrote: »

All the airport agencies etc are now focused on resumption on Saturday from very early (for most people). That actually means some being in and working fully from 8/9pm tomorrow.

My understanding is that most operational staff would be at least two thirds the way through their normal early shift by that stage?

The Veteran

Pat Dunne wrote: »

My understanding is that most operational staff would be at least two thirds the way through their normal early shift by that stage?

Pat - security points are to reopen so staff can get airside in the normal way (not all points open now); then there is a major de-icing needed (not aeroplanes but the walkways and the like) etc

Normal shifts and hours are not being applied by most agencies. Some are on “24 hours” albeit staying in hotels at the airport somas to be available.

Airport is absolutely dead airside at the moment (in the Terminals).

milhous

So it depends on if there is a thaw by tmo. Which is unlikely? I wonder if or when they'll announce an extension to closure of operations?

Jamie2k9

milhous wrote: »

So it depends on if there is a thaw by tmo. Which is unlikely? I wonder if or when they'll announce an extension to closure of operations?

The airport will open for flights tomorrow.

trellheim

The airport will open for flights tomorrow.

How solid is that ?

Jamie2k9

trellheim wrote: »

How solid is that ?

I would say 90%, worst is over for now.

Noxegon

The Veteran wrote: »

I know several airlines were talking about bringing in larger aircraft to lift everyone on saturday. Others are running on low loads at present with room to cater for good numbers who need to rebook. For others there will be no point in travelling as the reason for travel is now “gone” (for example if you needed to be in London today for a meeting, you won’t travel on Saturday - no need).

Yeah, my trip was cancelled outright because the earliest rebooking I could get would have had me at my destination three/four hours after I needed to be there.

Tenger

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The airport will open for flights tomorrow.

Forecast from M.T. Cranium over in the Weather forum:

FORECASTS ...

TODAY will continue to produce locally heavy snowfall in some parts of the southeast, central Leinster, and scattered portions of the midlands and southwest, up into Galway............Further accumulations will therefore vary over a large range, your best bet is to double what you have already had from mid-day yesterday at your location -- this may be anywhere from 2-5 cm in light snow areas, to 30 to 50 cm in heavy snow zones. Winds near the east coast will be easterly 70 to 100 km/hr and these strong winds are making considerable progress inland in central regions, where snow has been heavy, severe blowing and drifting has already begun and will continue. Near the south coast, winds are likely to fluctuate more between 40 and 70 km/hr and drifting will be more moderate.................Temperatures for all will fluctuate between -1 and +1 C. There will be some limited sleet or even rain near south coast and in pockets on the east coast too, but no major changeover is expected, especially with the weaker depictions for storm Emma on the new guidance.

TONIGHT ... Snow will begin to taper off to light snow or flurries except in parts of the inland south and west where a further 10 to 15 cm may occur, however, there could be some ongoing heavy snow streamers in central Leinster. Winds will tend to back to northeast 40 to 70 km/hr. An interval of somewhat stronger winds may brush past Kerry affecting the southern portions as well as southwest Cork. Peak gusts may reach 100 km/hr. Coastal flooding is still possible although the risk seems a bit lower given the weaker circulation around the core of Emma. Lows generally -7 to -4 C north, -3 to +1 C south.

SATURDAY will be mostly overcast with a few sunny intervals developing mostly in the north, moderate northeast winds, and a few outbreaks of sleet or light snow possible in the east and south. Highs 2 to 5 C. There will be some melting of snow in urban and coastal areas, and some ponding of meltwater will begin.

ian_m

Does anyone know any pilots who might have an idea if they will work tomorrow?
First thing on my mind as a pilot would be getting to work safely never mind flying. I really hope there are flights tomorrow.

Bussywussy

Warning extended til 9am..I won't be taking any risks driving in so I'll be pulling the plug

lintdrummer

ian_m wrote: »

Does anyone know any pilots who might have an idea if they will work tomorrow?
First thing on my mind as a pilot would be getting to work safely never mind flying. I really hope there are flights tomorrow.

I'm a pilot. However tomorrow is a day off on my roster. The pilots who are rostered to fly tomorrow have been told to expect a normal operation. I would imagine the situation is very fluid, particularly now that the red warning has been extended to 9am.
If the snow continues into the morning then airport operations will be severely disrupted and at best there will be delays. If it turns to sleet/rain overnight then at least it will provide an opportunity to clear the runway and taxiways of snow. It's anyone's guess at this stage how things will play out, but the airline's are currently planning a full return to normal ops.

Bussywussy

Big issue is staff safety getting to work...guess they just don't care

Locker10a

ian_m wrote: »

Does anyone know any pilots who might have an idea if they will work tomorrow?
First thing on my mind as a pilot would be getting to work safely never mind flying. I really hope there are flights tomorrow.

Airlines sometimes put their crews up in an airport hotel in cases like this to avoid them driving in on bad roads and potentially not making it on time/if at all. I don’t know however if Aer Lingus or Ryanair have done this.

lintdrummer

Bussywussy wrote: »

Big issue is staff safety getting to work...guess they just don't care

To be fair it's up to each individual to assess whether they can make it to work safely or not once the red warning has expired. Can't blame the airlines for trying to operate if they believe it's feasible. Air travel these days is an essential service, I think staff in the aviation sector aren't too far below emergency personnel in that regard. Rightly or wrongly there's an expectation that they will make every effort to get to work even under these challenging circumstances. Plenty of passengers have and will manage to get to the airport after all.

Locker10a wrote: »

Airlines sometimes put their crews up in an airport hotel in cases like this to avoid them driving in on bad roads and potentially not making it on time/if at all. I don’t know however if Aer Lingus or Ryanair have done this.

This does happen, I'd say the airport hotels are probably fairly full with stranded passengers already though.

The Veteran

There are plenty of airport staff in airport hotels, using maximum capacity of rooms. We have staff in a hotel and we have changed shift times to avoid people travelling during the red warning as much as possible.

Need to have people on site or close because of people can’t get out of their houses that’s the end of it.

I’d say there will be ops tomorrow but as said above delays etc

rio1

Don’t see them back to normal tomorrow, Aer Lingus seem to have cancelled a number of morning flights to Europe already.

Irish Steve

update on news bulletins earlier is that Aer Lingus have cancelled 50 flights before 1100, and Ryanair are "expecting disruption" to their morning program, with the details being available on their web site.

The weather is not going to improve as quickly as was forecast, there is still significant snow falling in the area of the Airport and South Meath, there are still substantial issues with road closures off the main M and N roads, with many minor roads blocked by drifts of up to 4 Ft depth, so I suspect that the reductions in the programmes are due to concerns about travel to and from the airport, and the anticipated state of the airfield after overnight snow that may not stop until 0900.

milhous

So flight cancelled. Can't get through to aerlingus helpline, seems shut. Next available rebook is next friday which I've booked provisionally. Stranded and confused as to what is covered by airline. Insurance says onus is on airline. Is there a limit on spending for accomm? Or is there aerlingus designated hotels. Any chance they might charter a flight in the meantime? Ahhh!

Locker10a

milhous wrote: »

So flight cancelled. Can't get through to aerlingus helpline, seems shut. Next available rebook is next friday which I've booked provisionally. Stranded and confused as to what is covered by airline. Insurance says onus is on airline. Is there a limit on spending for accomm? Or is there aerlingus designated hotels. Any chance they might charter a flight in the meantime? Ahhh!

They’ll reimburse reasonably expenses for food and accodation. Doubt they’ll charter a flight, the problem is not lack of aircraft it’s the ones they have can’t move

milhous

They cant move at present.. but next friday is a bit far away, like a full week is taking the piss a bit.

Who decides what is reasonable? We're in a five star atm, should we check out and book into a three star like?

Graham

Locker10a wrote: »

They’ll reimburse reasonably expenses for food and accodation.

Is that still the case where flight disruptions are a result of bad weather?

codrulz

Don’t think you’ll get any compensation as the cancellations are due to extreme circumstances outside the control of the airline.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/air_travel/compensation_for_overbooked_and_delayed_flights.html#l7e93e

JCX BXC

Incorrect, you will get hotel expenses in all circumstances of weather delays, strikes, etc. You just won't get the other compensation.

acquiescefc

Graham wrote: »

Is that still the case where flight disruptions are a result of bad weather?

Because of weather you don’t get the eu261 compensation but the airline has a duty of care to feed, water, house you.

Imagine they would organise this at the airport and it will be struggle to claim what you’ve arranged yourself outside of this.

codrulz

JCX BXC wrote: »

Incorrect, you will get hotel expenses in all circumstances of weather delays, strikes, etc. You just won't get the other compensation.

One may find it difficult to be compensated for their own expenses if their airline has made available accommodation and food etc that they chose not to avail of.

milhous

codrulz wrote: »

JCX BXC wrote: »

Incorrect, you will get hotel expenses in all circumstances of weather delays, strikes, etc. You just won't get the other compensation.

One may find it difficult to be compensated for their own expenses if their airline has made available accommodation and food etc that they chose not to avail of.

If only they did. Can't even get talking to anyone in or representing aerlingus.. Numbers are down, no response from Twitter and their legal position they linked on terms of compensation is vague.

JCX BXC

codrulz wrote: »

One may find it difficult to be compensated for their own expenses if their airline has made available accommodation and food etc that they chose not to avail of.

Ah jaysus me head is fried from answering questions a simple Google of EU261 could answer.

Yes of course, however I've not read of one scenario where the airline organised someone a hotel themselves through this cold weather, it seems to only ever happen when a delay/cancellation is isolated.

milhous

I know it's unprecedented weather conditions, but barr an email with a cancellation there is no available contact with aerlingus. I'm not sure what I expect but this is madness.

Fred Swanson

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dball

i'm to fly into Dublin at 9.00 PM tonight. what are my chances of airport being open tonight

Locker10a

milhous wrote: »

I know it's unprecedented weather conditions, but barr an email with a cancellation there is no available contact with aerlingus. I'm not sure what I expect but this is madness.

You’re one of probably over 100,000 passengers all trying to contact Aer Lingus with the same sort of issues and questions, I wouldn’t expect much if I was you

milhous

I'm in Lanzarote, I just want to make my own way to fuerteventura and avail of an aerlingus flight there on Tuesday so I can get home. I'll save receipts, alth ough theyhll prob tell me to deck off when they realise I'm staying somewhere decent.

Fred Swanson

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Locker10a

milhous wrote: »

I'm in Lanzarote, I just want to make my own way to fuerteventura and avail of an aerlingus flight there on Tuesday so I can get home. I'll save receipts, alth ough theyhll prob tell me to deck off when they realise I'm staying somewhere decent.

If your hotel is outrageously expensive they may just reimburse a percentage of the cost deemed reasonable

trellheim

Aer lingus are trying to get the fleet up and running at the moment as are FR , as someone said upthread you'd be number 5,000 on hold if you rang in now

bikeman1

I have experience of a snow claim with Wizz Air a few years ago.

After my flight was cancelled, and 3 hours of queuing to get an answer at the desk, they were able to give me a flight in one weeks time, which was a day before I was due to return.

As I was in Eindhoven, they were able to book me on another flight the following day from Dortmund in Germany. They said I would have to make my own way there and sort everything out myself. I said that would be fine.

Wizz Air (after a bit of explaining) paid back my food, hotel expense (4 star hotel), trains (x 4) 2 x airport buses and my mobile Internet and calls during the 30 hour delay period.

I did of course keep copies of all receipts, and scanned them in nicely with a cover letter and a breakdown of the expenses. I.e I made it easy for them.

The duly refunded every cent back.

So, my advice is keep a receipt of EVERY expense. Pay with card if you can, to back that up. Don't worry if it is the Crowne Plaza 4 star beside the airport that you stay in. You don't have to eat in Subway or tesco while you're delayed. Follow the claims process from the airline and make it easy for them.

The money will come back in due course. The caveat is that you have to have the money to fund this while you're out if pocket, Mr. Credit card usually helps with this.

trellheim

This is very true; make it easy for people to help you with copious records of expenditure .

milhous

Mr. credit card indeed.!

Elirlandes

JCX BXC wrote: »

Ah jaysus me head is fried from answering questions a simple Google of EU261 could answer.

Yes of course, however I've not read of one scenario where the airline organised someone a hotel themselves through this cold weather, it seems to only ever happen when a delay/cancellation is isolated.

Aer Lingus put my group of 32 (U14 rugby team) up in the Burlington from Weds 28th to Sunday 4th - bed, breakfast & dinner, and transfers to and from the airport. We only had to sort lunches.