HKC Quantum 70 desperate help needed

LaceSensor

Dear all, I hope someone will take pity on me. From Google it seems that your forum is the most welcoming and relevant for HKC quantum 70 issues.
Without a life story, we are due to move out in 10 days, and promised the alarm system to our buyer. Sods law, its now playing up. I got a RF issue which meant it would not set, that I resolved by putting fresh batteries in all the remote sensors. Now however, it seems to go off in the middle of the night (tamper, zone 3 kitchen). The previous owner had placed this sensor on top of a kitchen unit / not use it, as they had a dog that stayed in that room. The device is an RF type movement sensor. I put a battery in it where there wasnt one previous in an attempt to "fix" the errors we were seeing that prevented use of the system, and now it seems that device is going haywire. I cannot find a menu to get rid of this device. If I remove the battery is sets the alarm and siren off, saying "advisory" and now has an amber light. It now wont allow me to set the panel and says "RF comms fault again". At my wits end. I tried the "standard" engineer code from my manual and that doesnt seem to work. Please help, and advice is appreciated. thankyou.

KoolKid

You are going to need engineer access to delete the PiR from the system. Unfortunately we are no longer allowed help you here with codes.
Why not try mount the PiR somewhere else in the Kitchen. Once its mounted correctly & the lid closed correctly the tamper fault should disappear.

LaceSensor

Hi that doesnt work. it still setting off the tamper. I have the engineer code from the manual, and that doesnt work.
Why are people no longer allowed to be offering assistance?

thadg

take the pir to the main panel, open the pir and press the 2 tamper switches front and back of the guts of the pir and hold them for 5-10 seconds, if the pir is ok the orange fault light should dissapear

If this is the case you need to sort the tamper spring, and keep that pir in close range of the panel.

Otherwise you may be batter off ringing the company that installed it as they may be the only company that have the engineering code and any other company may have to default the panel/replace the card.

You own the alarm system , so the installer are obliged to give you the code if you ring them

KoolKid

Boards.ie decided we are no longer allowed help you here with engineer codes. That's end of unfortunately.
Most installers would be able to help you with this though if you have no luck with the original installer.
Not sure the you are entitled to it argument will stand up though.
Try using that one with your mobile phone provider or manufacturer and request all access /programming codes.

thadg

to be fair when you get a stand alone alarm system fitted , and you own it outright they shouldnt refuse you the code. A lot of installers take the piss by not giving you the code when you request it.

With your mobile phone provider you are getting a constant connection/service from them so you are tied in with them, Fitting an alarm in your house is a similar service like getting a plumber to install an oil boiler as in that its once off job unless it gives trouble

LaceSensor

Thanks. Problem is the company that installed this system have since been "acquired" by another company, whom I called. They wont help me without a service contract, and I am moving out the house in less than 2 weeks. Sods law that it starts playing up now. Its a PIR that the previous owners took off the wall, I guess I could put it back up. The only reason I put a battery back in it is because, one of the others seemed to develop a low battery / RF fault, so I naively replaced the batteries in all the devices in hope that it would clear the code - which it did of course - problem being now that the system now expects to see this "revived" PIR... and it appears to be faulty.

By default the panel / replace the card, what does the latter imply? replace the main circuit board?

LaceSensor

As I said before also, I have the engineer code from the manual, it says 4567, but that doesnt do anything.

thadg

LaceSensor wrote: »

By default the panel / replace the card, what does the latter imply? replace the main circuit board?

Ya, what usually happens is the installer will bring a blank card for your panel, set up your whole system again and keep your card and get it wiped by hkc. It Card could be up to 150 euro plus the call out and labour.

Can you not just push in the 2 tamper switches on the pir to see if it sorts it like i said or have you tried it already

KoolKid

thadg wrote: »

to be fair when you get a stand alone alarm system fitted , and you own it outright they shouldnt refuse you the code. A lot of installers take the piss by not giving you the code when you request it.

I am not disagreeing with you , just stating the way things are.

thadg wrote: »

With your mobile phone provider you are getting a constant connection/service from them so you are tied in with them, Fitting an alarm in your house is a similar service like getting a plumber to install an oil boiler as in that its once off job unless it gives trouble

Probably not the best analogy . Think of it as a prepay phone or a phone out of contract. Or any other household device for that matter. Most have engineering and manufacturer codes you dont have , and are not entitled to.
Even though we buy and install alarms there would be access codes beyond engineer that we are not entitled to.

LaceSensor wrote: »

Thanks. Problem is the company that installed this system have since been "acquired" by another company, whom I called. They wont help me without a service contract, and I am moving out the house in less than 2 weeks. Sods law that it starts playing up now. Its a PIR that the previous owners took off the wall, I guess I could put it back up. The only reason I put a battery back in it is because, one of the others seemed to develop a low battery / RF fault, so I naively replaced the batteries in all the devices in hope that it would clear the code - which it did of course - problem being now that the system now expects to see this "revived" PIR... and it appears to be faulty.

By default the panel / replace the card, what does the latter imply? replace the main circuit board?

You wouldn't have to replace the card or the panel just default it & reprogramme it.

fred funk }{

Card? Think you mean the panel. Any decent installer will reset your existing panel.

thadg

KoolKid wrote: »

You wouldn't have to replace the card or the panel just default it & reprogramme it.

I thought them panels couldnt be defaulted, as they are engineer locked like the 10/70 panel?

KoolKid

thadg wrote: »

I thought them panels couldnt be defaulted, as they are engineer locked like the 10/70 panel?

Any good installer can reset them.

kub

thadg wrote:

to be fair when you get a stand alone alarm system fitted , and you own it outright they shouldnt refuse you the code. A lot of installers take the piss by not giving you the code when you request it.

It is a security system, well that is the idea but standalone ones in this day and age are a farce.
Are you aware that settings on a system can be completely changed and reprogrammed especially by someone who has limited knowledge of what they are doing and the possible effects that someone like that could have on a system?
Are you also aware that most companies have the same engineer code for all of their systems?

So that code will grant engineer access to all their systems, imagine the effects of that in the wrong hands?

Also a legal disclaimer would have to be signed so that if some body reprogrammed the system after the company programming it and if there was a break in and the system failed to activate then the company would need to be covered in this eventuality.

Stoner

kub wrote:

Also a legal disclaimer would have to be signed so that if some body reprogrammed the system after the company programming it and if there was a break in and the system failed to activate then the company would need to be covered in this eventuality.

A legal disclaimer does not have to be signed.
An installer can request it and it's a good compromise imo.

Also the installer can give you a unique code if you ask for it. It's the installers choice and possibly a poor one to use the same security code everywhere. Staff move around, people share them etc.

It is possible to ask for your own code.
You can sign the disclaimer if it's the only way to get it.
You can get the alarm installed, get your code and not bother with the certificate if you don't intend to state you have an alarm on your insurance form. As discussed many times here before many, including me have always had an alarm and never used it to get a reduction.

IMO with these steps there is no reason why a compromise can't be made between the customer and client.

thadg

kub wrote: »

It is a security system, well that is the idea but standalone ones in this day and age are a farce.
you are aware that settings on a system can be completely changed and reprogrammed especially by someone who has limited knowledge of what they are doing and the possible effects that someone like that could have on a system?
Are you also aware that most companies have the same engineer code for all of their systems?

So that code will grant engineer access to all their systems, imagine the effects of that in the wrong hands?

Also a legal disclaimer would have to be signed so that if some body reprogrammed the system after the company programming it and if there was a break in and the system failed to activate then the company would need to be covered in this eventuality.

settings cant be changed easily unless you have the usercode and the engineering code
alot of companies use a different engineering code for every system and rightly so,

You still cant do much with an alarm system unless you have the engineering and user code

i know of a few companies that used to put in there own user code to every alarm system they fitted for access which is totally illegal.

thadg

Stoner wrote: »

Also the installer can give you a unique code if you ask for it. It's the installers choice and possibly a poor one to use the same security code everywhere. Staff move around, people share them etc.

It is possible to ask for your own code.

What is supposed to be done is when you set up the alarm, when it comes to the stage of setting up a user code, you get the home owner to type in the user code, but the installer looks away while he/she types it in

KoolKid

Most home owners will just tell you the user code they want, whats the big deal?
They can change it if they want to afterwards.

kub

thadg wrote: »

settings cant be changed easily unless you have the usercode and the engineering code
alot of companies use a different engineering code for every system and rightly so,

You still cant do much with an alarm system unless you have the engineering and user code

i know of a few companies that used to put in there own user code to every alarm system they fitted for access which is totally illegal.

:D:D:D You might link to that law please :rolleyes:

2011

kub wrote: »

:D:D:D You might link to that law please :rolleyes:

An installer that does this without the owners permission is in my opinion acting illegally. You may disagree, but you can not deny that it is dishonest and compromises the customers security.

Most people would be reluctant to employ an installer that they suspect behaves in this manner.