Sweden are leading the way (as usual)

ED E

Poached from LTT

Swedish ISP Banhof announced today that it is going to offer broadband with speeds of up to 10Gbit/s for private individuals and up to 100 Gbit/s for businesses.

The speeds have been achieved by building out their core fiber network, "Northern Light" throughout Sweden. The price is set out to be around 60 USD per month for 10Git/s.

Quote
Sweclockers´ Article (Translated)

In a press release, the Bahnhof announced that they are now starting to offer speeds of up to 10,000 Mbit / s (10 Gbit / s) to private individuals. Besides beating competing suppliers, the speed is a hundred times higher than the national broadband target of 100 Mbit / s (0.1 Gbit / s) for the year 2020.

Quote
For companies, the Bahnhof speeds up speeds further and, in addition to new 10,000 Mbit / s, offers 100,000 Mbit / s (100 Gbit / s). The speeds are enabled by Bahnhof's new fiber network Northern Light, which was put into operation in 2017. Accessing the new speeds thus requires that the town and the subscriber's property be connected to the new fiber network.

The cost of the Bahnhof 10,000 Mbit / s is SEK 498 (~60 USD) a month, which is discounted to SEK 298 (~37 USD) in the first half of the year.



Source´s (swedish): https://www.sweclockers.com/nyhet/25269-bahnhof-slapper-bredband-pa-10-000-mbit-s-for-privatpersoner

https://www.bahnhof.se/press/press-releases/2018/02/21/bahnhof-lanserar-10-000-mbit-s-till-privatpersoner-for-298-kr-man

Oat23

If this was Ireland they would still cap usage at 1TB/month.

jca

Pointless really when most home hardware can only handle 1 gig.

ED E

jca wrote: »

Pointless really when most home hardware can only handle 1 gig.

10Gb NICs are now very affordable (two years ago they were crazy). QNAP and Synology sell units with them, gaming mobos come with them.

Really the big limit is finding a home/office router with the NATing capability.

jca

ED E wrote: »

10Gb NICs are now very affordable (two years ago they were crazy). QNAP and Synology sell units with them, gaming mobos come with them.

Really the big limit is finding a home/office router with the NATing capability.

I suppose it's all relative, it's only a few years ago there was no need for gigabit NIC's

Charles Babbage

jca wrote: »

I suppose it's all relative, it's only a few years ago there was no need for gigabit NIC's

PCs came to have the ability to do wordprocessing, powerpoint, email etc about 15 years and a lot of people would never really use a lot of the power of a modern PC. Likewise with network connections, once you can stream 4K content and update your software, a lot of people will not move on to use more bandwidth. Of some people need as much as they can get.

Cuddlesworth

jca wrote: »

Pointless really when most home hardware can only handle 1 gig.

They probably supply a gig unless 10gig is requested. Nice backbone though.

Marlow

ED E wrote: »

10Gb NICs are now very affordable (two years ago they were crazy). QNAP and Synology sell units with them, gaming mobos come with them.

Really the big limit is finding a home/office router with the NATing capability.

You can actually get single and dual PCIe NICs that take SFP+ modules even. Don't cost a fortune anymore.

As for a home/office router with NATing, that will do 10gig ... no problem: https://mikrotik.com/product/CCR1009-7G-1C-1SplusPC .. Retails at about 300+ VAT in Ireland.

Now .. that one will only take 10gig in and then deliver multiples of 1gig out.

If you want 10gig in and out, you're looking at about 750 EUR+VAT, but even that can be got. Another 400 EUR for a 16port 10gig switch and Bob's your uncle.

/M

jca

Marlow wrote: »

You can actually get single and dual PCIe NICs that take SFP+ modules even. Don't cost a fortune anymore.

As for a home/office router with NATing, that will do 10gig ... no problem: https://mikrotik.com/product/CCR1009-7G-1C-1SplusPC .. Retails at about 300+ VAT in Ireland.

Now .. that one will only take 10gig in and then deliver multiples of 1gig out.

If you want 10gig in and out, you're looking at about 750 EUR+VAT, but even that can be got. Another 400 EUR for a 16port 10gig switch and Bob's your uncle.

/M

In other words, completely pointless for the average home user. I can't see any isp providing a router for that setup unless you commit to a 5 year contract...

Marlow

jca wrote: »

In other words, completely pointless for the average home user. I can't see any isp providing a router for that setup unless you commit to a 5 year contract...

Not for free anyhow. Lots of power users, that have no problem to fork 200+ EUR out for a very decent router though.

And to be honest, if you go 10+ years back, it wouldn't have been uncommon to pay 300+ to get broadband installed (depending on where you are). I know, that I didn't pay small money for a 512 kbit/s symmetric connection in D18 from Leap in 2004 (can't remember install fee, but it was 99 EUR/month just for that).

The users, that expect the cheapest broadband connection and a free router however will never be the target for a 10 Gbit/s service either.

Any of the current routers used for FTTH (that are of any quality) are also between 100-200 EUR retail.

/M

ED E

TBH I'd much prefer they didnt provide any CPE other than the ONT. Connection for enthusiast should be BYOD.

Marlow

ED E wrote: »

TBH I'd much prefer they didnt provide any CPE other than the ONT. Connection for enthusiast should be BYOD.

Agreed. Or give the user the option of using your own. A few providers do.

/M

jca

Marlow wrote: »

Not for free anyhow. Lots of power users, that have no problem to fork 200+ EUR out for a very decent router though.

And to be honest, if you go 10+ years back, it wouldn't have been uncommon to pay 300+ to get broadband installed (depending on where you are). I know, that I didn't pay small money for a 512 kbit/s symmetric connection in D18 from Leap in 2004 (can't remember install fee, but it was 99 EUR/month just for that).

The users, that expect the cheapest broadband connection and a free router however will never be the target for a 10 Gbit/s service either.

Any of the current routers used for FTTH (that are of any quality) are also between 100-200 EUR retail.

/M

Jesus that was expensive I got my first bb connection from Eircom in 2005 1meg/128, I thought I was the business especially when within the year it was trebled for the same bobs. There was no install fee it wasn't overly expensive, it didn't matter I was getting it anyway. I think the law of diminishing returns sets in very quickly with bb. The few people I know with ftth are on the lowest speed as it just works and everyone's happy, many don't see the need for higher speed they just see it costing extra money.

Marlow

jca wrote: »

Jesus that was expensive I got my first bb connection from Eircom in 2005 1meg/128, I thought I was the business especially when within the year it was trebled for the same bobs. There was no install fee it wasn't overly expensive, it didn't matter I was getting it anyway. I think the law of diminishing returns sets in very quickly with bb. The few people I know with ftth are on the lowest speed as it just works and everyone's happy, many don't see the need for higher speed they just see it costing extra money.

But they don't mind spend 90+ quid for Sky a month ?

It's a matter of priority. Either way, you missed the point entirely. The user type that you refer to just wants basic internet. And yes .. a good VDSL connection or basic FTTH (150 Mbit/s) will always be more than adequate for them.

Plenty of users, that use the internet much more extensively. That's what Virgin aimed at with their 240 and 360 Mbit/s packages. And that's what the 600 and 1000 Mbit/s packages on FTTH aim at.

Bahnhof has always been an ISP for the tech savvy. Same as for example AA ISP in the UK. The average broadband user won't understand it or won't get it.

They also don't understand, that the cr** router Eir or Vodafone are supplying with FTTH even limits them more ... They wouldn't even understand, that the reason they don't get past 100 Mbit/s is the network card in their PC .. They're also the ones, that be happy to drive a Toyota Corolla or Avensis .... opposed to a nice BMW, Merc (at least a 5-series or E-class .. and at least a 3l engine .. not poverty spec) or something even nicer.

/M

jca

Marlow wrote: »

But they don't mind spend 90+ quid for Sky a month ?

It's a matter of priority. Either way, you missed the point entirely. The user type that you refer to just wants basic internet. And yes .. a good VDSL connection or basic FTTH (150 Mbit/s) will always be more than adequate for them.

Plenty of users, that use the internet much more extensively. That's what Virgin aimed at with their 240 and 360 Mbit/s packages. And that's what the 600 and 1000 Mbit/s packages on FTTH aim at.

Bahnhof has always been an ISP for the tech savvy. Same as for example AA ISP in the UK. The average broadband user won't understand it or won't get it.

They also don't understand, that the cr** router Eir or Vodafone are supplying with FTTH even limits them more ... They wouldn't even understand, that the reason they don't get past 100 Mbit/s is the network card in their PC .. They're also the ones, that be happy to drive a Toyota Corolla or Avensis .... opposed to a nice BMW, Merc (at least a 5-series or E-class .. and at least a 3l engine .. not poverty spec) or something even nicer.

/M

Oops my mistake I thought I was dealing with an adult I didn't realise you need to brag first, kind of a show and tell of bb. I have vm 360 using my own router, cabled network to a gigabit switch, wireless AC cards in the laptops to get the best speeds. I'm on a 6 months half price deal I suppose that lowers my chances of being accepted, I pay for sky too, I'm such a pleb. P.S. I didn't miss your point at all.

Marlow

jca wrote: »

Oops my mistake I thought I was dealing with an adult I didn't realise you need to brag first, kind of a show and tell of bb. I have vm 360 using my own router, cabled network to a gigabit switch, wireless AC cards in the laptops to get the best speeds. I'm on a 6 months half price deal I suppose that lowers my chances of being accepted, I pay for sky too, I'm such a pleb. P.S. I didn't miss your point at all.

No.

The ones that brag buy poverty spec, that look flash.

The power users that buy above have no need to tell anybody about it.

But you managed to read my post just about the way I figured you'd do, if you don't get it. It's not about acceptance.

Give you an example: I've had to jump through hoops to get 300 Mbit of some kind. It's not the download that matters to me. It's the 60 Mbit/s upload. Because I do large file transfers. I'd be delighted with the a GigE FTTH.

And I'm again paying near enough 100 eur/month for that. But I've paid a lot more for what I had the last years with only 10 Mbit upload.

/M

Praetorian

I built a new PC recently and bought a new NAS and it was incredibly expensive to build 10gig (which I considered), at the time you were talking €500 extra for a compatible mobo, router, and the more expensive Synology Nas.

Aquantia are doing "affordable" addon cards / options for mobo makers. The pricing on the routers is the main issue. The mainstream jump from 100m/bit to 1000m/bit was a long time ago and it's frustrating that the next jump is taking so long. Wireless 801.11 ax could be widespread before 10gbe home networking is.

ECO_Mental

Im not a network engineer etc so excuse me if im talking rubbish. But I have 1 Gb/s FTTH and I think 10Gb/s is a bit or over kill at the moment because I have noticed from downloading stuff over the last 2 years that I never get above 200-300 mb/s on anything I DL. Isn't it the back haul that will limit you on your DL speed. I have tested this with HEANET files etc downloading on my xbox X on major software company servers etc.

On average when finished it will always average out about 200-300 mb/s

Now there are other advantages I suppose if there are loads of people accessing the net all at once etc.

Will eir's FTTH be able to ramp up the 10Gig easy enough, I think its just upgrading the ONT on the client side

ED E

Pime for PFSense

ECO_Mental wrote: »

Im not a network engineer etc so excuse me if im talking rubbish. But I have 1 Gb/s FTTH and I think 10Gb/s is a bit or over kill at the moment because I have noticed from downloading stuff over the last 2 years that I never get above 200-300 mb/s on anything I DL. Isn't it the back haul that will limit you on your DL speed. I have tested this with HEANET files etc downloading on my xbox X on major software company servers etc.

On average when finished it will always average out about 200-300 mb/s

Now there are other advantages I suppose if there are loads of people accessing the net all at once etc.

Will eir's FTTH be able to ramp up the 10Gig easy enough, I think its just upgrading the ONT on the client side

You may need to upgrade your storage medium.

Marlow

ECO_Mental wrote: »

Im not a network engineer etc so excuse me if im talking rubbish. But I have 1 Gb/s FTTH and I think 10Gb/s is a bit or over kill at the moment because I have noticed from downloading stuff over the last 2 years that I never get above 200-300 mb/s on anything I DL. Isn't it the back haul that will limit you on your DL speed. I have tested this with HEANET files etc downloading on my xbox X on major software company servers etc.

Even 1000 Mbit/s FTTH is overkill, if it's just for one user.

The assumption with the big connections .. be it GigE or 10Gig is that you have multiple users, a lot of IOT devices, Smart TVs and XBox/Playstation in every room, etc etc etc.

So the combined usage of all of these devices will be able to utilize the 10Gig .. eventually.

/M

Grab All Association

Marlow wrote: »

No.

The ones that brag buy poverty spec, that look flash.

That’s so true. I’ve a 2007 L200 which I love and hasn’t let me down yet. The people who look down their noses to you all drive poverty spec 2018 Corollas with hubcaps.

There was a great post a number of years ago on here about how the Corolla is a 3rd world country car sold for 2-3x times the price to stupid people in this country.

Marlow

Grab All Association wrote: »

That’s so true. I’ve a 2007 L200 which I love and hasn’t let me down yet. The people who look down their noses to you all drive poverty spec 2018 Corollas with hubcaps.

There was a great post a number of years ago on here about how the Corolla is a 3rd world country car sold for 2-3x times the price to stupid people in this country.

A budget car (Corolla, Micro, Note etc.) with the newest reg, BMWs or Mercs with the smallest engine, that you can find, a big internet connection without having the hardware even to utilize it's capabilities (like a 35 EUR budget router, with the processing power of 20-30 Mbit/s max on a 100 Mbit/s internet connection) .... or a connection from Eir or Vodafone with the most crummiest Huawei router you can lay your fingers on.

The L200 wouldn't be my particular choice, but it serves a purpose. And it does very well at that.

Just my 2c.

And I'll survive on whatever broadband I can get my hands on ... until I can either buy something better or build something to work around, to get something better. (OpenEIR FTTH is available across the field from me )

/M

Nollog

Marlow wrote: »

A budget car (Corolla, Micro, Note etc.) with the newest reg, BMWs or Mercs with the smallest engine, that you can find, a big internet connection without having the hardware even to utilize it's capabilities (like a 35 EUR budget router, with the processing power of 20-30 Mbit/s max on a 100 Mbit/s internet connection) .... or a connection from Eir or Vodafone with the most crummiest Huawei router you can lay your fingers on.

The L200 wouldn't be my particular choice, but it serves a purpose. And it does very well at that.

Just my 2c.

And I'll survive on whatever broadband I can get my hands on ... until I can either buy something better or build something to work around, to get something better. (OpenEIR FTTH is available across the field from me )

/M

I'm just lazy is all okay

KeRbDoG

Marlow wrote: »

And I'll survive on whatever broadband I can get my hands on ... until I can either buy something better or build something to work around, to get something better. (OpenEIR FTTH is available across the field from me )

/M

Time to find a willing farmer/landowner to get FTTH installed in their shed and get some magic installed to get it to you Would you go the point-2-point route or direct bury fiber?

Marlow

KeRbDoG wrote: »

Time to find a willing farmer/landowner to get FTTH installed in their shed and get some magic installed to get it to you Would you go the point-2-point route or direct bury fiber?

I've got a friend across the field. It's even the only 2 story house on that entire stretch of the road.

Getting a FTTH connection in his place, then stick a 17 or 24 GHz link up across the field.

Job done.

/M