Fire bird exhaust

larrymiller

Hi.

I recently got a new firebird installed and there's something annoying me about it.

Now I asked the plumber installing and he said it's ok but I'm looking for a 2nd opinion.

Anyway

Should the exhaust be facing up and letting water in or should be facing to the side?

Wearb

Thats fine. Dont answer if you dont want to, but what is that wavin pipe doing there. I presume it hasnt anything to do with boiler.

Wearb

Wearb wrote: »

Thats fine. Dont answer if you dont want to, but what is that wavin pipe doing there. I presume it hasnt anything to do with boiler.

Just dawned on me. Is it carrying the heating pipes?

larrymiller

Yep the hot press is up stairs over the boiler. The pipes are in the pipe and insulated.

Does that sound ok?

agusta

larrymiller wrote: »

Hi.

I recently got a new firebird installed and there's something annoying me about it.

Now I asked the plumber installing and he said it's ok but I'm looking for a 2nd opinion.

Anyway

Should the exhaust be facing up and letting water in or should be facing to the side?

I would prefer if it was tilted at 45 degrees upwards away from the house.It will swivel so its easy turn it.
When rainwater goes into the flue,it will go out the condensate pipe.Although in your picture i dont see the condensate pipe or the remote acting firevalve,they are probably there though

Wearb

larrymiller wrote: »

Yep the hot press is up stairs over the boiler. The pipes are in the pipe and insulated.

Does that sound ok?

Sounds fine.

larrymiller

agusta wrote: »

I would prefer if it was tilted at 45 degrees upwards away from the house.It will swivel so its easy turn it.
When rainwater goes into the flue,it will go out the condensate pipe.Although in your picture i dont see the condensate pipe or the remote acting firevalve,they are probably there though

The condensing pipe is at the back. And I haven't a clue what fire valve is but it not visible from the outside anyway

agusta

larrymiller wrote: »

The condensing pipe is at the back. And I haven't a clue what fire valve is but it not visible from the outside anyway

Where is the condensate discharging to

Tom44

agusta wrote: »

I would prefer if it was tilted at 45 degrees upwards away from the house.It will swivel so its easy turn it.
When rainwater goes into the flue,it will go out the condensate pipe.Although in your picture i dont see the condensate pipe or the remote acting firevalve,they are probably there though

No

90° elbow vertically is another attempt to produce a trouble free photo cell and should be left at 90°



But hell, we all have our simular professional opinions. :eek:

Tom44

All future technical questions, please pm "Andy from Sligo"

agusta

Tom44 wrote: »

No

90° elbow vertically is another attempt to produce a trouble free photo cell and should be left at 90°



But hell, we all have our simular professional opinions. :eek:

I disagree,its a matter of opinion, but then again i dont have any trouble with sooting up photocells .

jimf

agusta wrote: »

I disagree,its a matter of opinion, but then again i dont have any trouble with sooting up photocells .

how dare you disagree with the master :eek:

as for sooting cells how could you when its all my customers you are robbing


mind them new tyres once you pass the bridge

agusta

jimf wrote: »

how dare you disagree with the master :eek:

as for sooting cells how could you when its all my customers you are robbing


mind them new tyres once you pass the bridge

You can have some of mine

jimf

no thanks I don't do Barbie houses

Tom44

agusta wrote: »

I disagree,its a matter of opinion, but then again i dont have any trouble with sooting up photocells .

Vertical chimney has less wind affection compaired to the 45°


But who gives a toss about these revenue producing upside down boiler that help my faviourate pension schemes. Mine.

jimf

Tom44 wrote: »

Vertical chimney has less wind affection compaired to the 45°


But who gives a toss about these revenue producing upside down boiler that help my faviourate pension schemes. Mine.

ignore him tom somebody called him an engineer recently and its gone to his head :P:P

agusta

Tom44 wrote: »

Vertical chimney has less wind affection compaired to the 45°


But who gives a toss about these revenue producing upside down boiler that help my faviourate pension schemes. Mine.

Jim and i had to get a block hammer to get the baffles out of one of these one evening.No guesses as to who was on the block hammer and who was directing:).

DGOBS

@Tom, it's a stack effect thats more the issue with the PE cell, but see where your coming from (hence a vehicle plume kit resolves, as does my digital control box with post purge, 4 years and still PE cell clean as a whistle)

agusta

DGOBS wrote: »

@Tom, it's a stack effect thats more the issue with the PE cell, but see where your coming from (hence a vehicle plume kit resolves, as does my digital control box with post purge, 4 years and still PE cell clean as a whistle)

On a firebird silverpac,
Tom argument has no logic, but how does a digital control box with post purge help?.i havent seen the digital control box yet

Tom44

Wind didn't blow back as much through boiler with elbow been flat on top.
45° more susceptible to wind, the recommendation was to fit an extra 45° bend on the older boilers with existing 45s, and now they send out boilers with 90° elbows.
Firebird wouldn't do that unless they thought it was better.
So don't shoot the messenger

As for digital boxes with post purge, their a godsend for Firebird boilers if they have them and you know how to adjust the time sequence.
I learned a lot on Firebirds blue flame course about that .

After September 2018 all new boilers will be blue flame with digital boxes, so you'll need to be up to speed.
New photocells will be pricy and seem to be causing a few headaches with our friends across the water.

agusta

Firebird have changed there baffles, brought in a graphite board, changed the condensate trap,flue etc.Its not that firebird are improving their boiler,but fixing design faults with their boiler.Yet grant boilers didnt have to do any of the above.

agusta

Tom44 wrote: »

Wind didn't blow back as much through boiler with elbow been flat on top.
45° more susceptible to wind, the recommendation was to fit an extra 45° bend on the older boilers with existing 45s, and now they send out boilers with 90° elbows.
Firebird wouldn't do that unless they thought it was better.
So don't shoot the messenger

As for digital boxes with post purge, their a godsend for Firebird boilers if they have them and you know how to adjust the time sequence.
I learned a lot on Firebirds blue flame course about that .

After September 2018 all new boilers will be blue flame with digital boxes, so you'll need to be up to speed.
New photocells will be pricy and seem to be causing a few headaches with our friends across the water.

why does the firebird plume kit have a 45 degree elbow at the top.there must be some reason for it

DGOBS

The emission target for 2018 will not require all boilers to be blue flame, riello have an adapted blast tube set up that achieves the correct emissions with a yellow flame, AFAIK is 2022 before blue flame will be required on all new boilers.

Also, I much prefer to work on the Riello blue fame burner that the older rocket burner (new riello has mostly common parts to the RDB so will keep van stock down! and also uses a standard nozzle, same issue with the expensive PE cell though!)

Agusts, I have an RDB 2.2 with a digital control box, it carries a live and sw live, to allow the burner to post purge for 30seconds on shutdown, this removes any soot etc. created during shutdown of the burn via the flue.

With the firebird design, the restrictive nature of the down firing boiler/heat exchanger means any particles of soot created during shut down are naturally convected back through the air intake (via the blast tube) rather than via the flue (as you would get with the natural stack effect of a traditional burner at the bottom type boiler)

Firebird have tried to tackle this issue several times, 1st by fitting a vertical plume kit, increasing the stack effect, which draws to the flue on shut down rather than the air intake. 2nd, they introduces the air intake flap, so when the fan stops it closed the air intake, preventing the draw in that direction. 3rd, introduced the electronic Riello control box with post purge (which they developed hand in hand with Riello)

With the advent of blue flame, it shouldn't really be an issue anyway, as soot production is practically eliminated anyway, and as Tom pointed out, these are also going to post purge.

I would always have assumed the 45º angle at the top of the plume kit was fo directional purposes (as it is with gas) but you guys maybe right that the wind is still an issue on the terminal even with a plume kit fitted (but I would have assumed a straight vertical end would promote a stack effect, rather than hinder it)