New Bus design ideas - Singapore and Berlin

bk

Singapore is trialling some nice looking triple door, tri-axle, dual stiars buses.

https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/three-door-bus-hits-roads-six-month-trial

These would be a great replacement for the DB VT's

The video on the above page is very interesting. Note the green directional symbols on the floor at the front door, making it clear that it is entry only.

bk

Also interesting to note that in Berlin, VDL are trialing new dual-axle, dual-door, single stairs buses. The difference? The stairs is at the back of the bus instead of the front to try and increase passenger flow through the bus in even smaller double deckers, a very interesting idea:

http://www.vdlbuscoach.com/News/News-Library/2015/VDL-Bus---Coach-levert-eerste-Citea-Low-Floor-dubb.aspx?lang=pl-PL

boombang

Interesting. I see great potential for improved passenger flow and had though two staircases could be an advantage.


I realise I've totally hijack these nice pictures from the OP with the following observations. Sorry.

I don't like the bus, but I think my objections are based on very simple issues:

1. I thinks massive difference to bus comfort would be localised airvents (like on a coach), to avoid squabbles over the windows and the smell of the occasional fellow passenger who stinks of stale cigarettes .

2. a dehumifier to keep windows clear in cold weather.

3. a mandatory clean of the bus at each turn around, supported by fines to leap cards for passengers spotted on CCTV for littering.

4. accelerometers that provide bonuses for drivers who achieve train-like gentle motion at all times.

Stephen15

boombang wrote: »

Interesting. I see great potential for improved passenger flow and had though two staircases could be an advantage.


I realise I've totally hijack these nice pictures from the OP with the following observations. Sorry.

I don't like the bus, but I think my objections are based on very simple issues:

1. I thinks massive difference to bus comfort would be localised airvents (like on a coach), to avoid squabbles over the windows and the smell of the occasional fellow passenger who stinks of stale cigarettes .

2. a dehumifier to keep windows clear in cold weather.

3. a mandatory clean of the bus at each turn around, supported by fines to leap cards for passengers spotted on CCTV for littering.

4. accelerometers that provide bonuses for drivers who achieve train-like gentle motion at all times.

Your never gonna get DB drivers to agree to clean buses and rightly so it's their job is to drive buses not clean them. As long as buses are reasonably clean which DB vehicles are it's not going to put people off. Fines for people who litter aren't going to work either as it would probably cost to implement such software than the revenue lost due to littering.

The main thing putting people off buses is reliability, journey time and frequency of buses while passengers comforts such as clean buses are also important they are secondary issues rather than primary issues for most people.

Stephen15

bk wrote: »

Singapore is trialling some nice looking triple door, tri-axle, dual stiars buses.

https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/three-door-bus-hits-roads-six-month-trial

These would be a great replacement for the DB VT's

The video on the above page is very interesting. Note the green directional symbols on the floor at the front door, making it clear that it is entry only.

I would would prefer if the second stairs was at the rear of the bus and the third door should be there too similar to a standard Berlin double decker. What are the NTA planning to replace the VTs with anyway? More SGs?

bk

Stephen15 wrote: »

I would would prefer if the second stairs was at the rear of the bus and the third door should be there too similar to a standard Berlin double decker. What are the NTA planning to replace the VTs with anyway? More SGs?

Yes, I'm not sure which one is better. I've always really liked the Berlin buses.

However the big deal about this bus is that it is left hand drive, unlike the Berlin bus. So if Singapore buys these in large quantities, then it would make it much easier for us to buy some too.

They might be a slight compromise compared to the Berlin buses, but they would still be WAY better then the single door, single stairs VT's.

I don't think there has been any rumours about replacements for the VT's yet. I suspect they will replace all the other single door buses with SG's first, before turning their attention to the VT's. I'd say the VT's will ironically be the last single door bus!

goingnowhere

The tri axle BVG bus is king, stairs front and back, three doors, low floor.

One thing the BVG has going for its is a bit of horsepower, the buses are noticeably quicker off the line

Now you wouldn't want to be tall... Upstairs has a lot less headroom than any bus in Dublin, quite strange up there

boombang

Stephen15 wrote: »

Your never gonna get DB drivers to agree to clean buses and rightly so it's their job is to drive buses not clean them. As long as buses are reasonably clean which DB vehicles are it's not going to put people off. Fines for people who litter aren't going to work either as it would probably cost to implement such software than the revenue lost due to littering.

The main thing putting people off buses is reliability, journey time and frequency of buses while passengers comforts such as clean buses are also important they are secondary issues rather than primary issues for most people.

I agree that reliability is an probably the main issue, but littering is element part of the comfort aspect that puts me off taking the bus. As for the attitude that it's not the drivers job, well I think there's no reason why they shouldn't clean the buses between runs, with appropriate compensation. The attitude that making the environment more pleasant for the paying customer isn't possible is what keeps people in cars. I'd love to see competition between bus firms with alternatives offering better standards. Currently it's a very uncomfortable way to travel.

Stephen15

boombang wrote: »

I agree that reliability is an probably the main issue, but littering is element part of the comfort aspect that puts me off taking the bus. As for the attitude that it's not the drivers job, well I think there's no reason why they shouldn't clean the buses between runs, with appropriate compensation. The attitude that making the environment more pleasant for the paying customer isn't possible is what keeps people in cars. I'd love to see competition between bus firms with alternatives offering better standards. Currently it's a very uncomfortable way to travel.

But sure trains and the Luas are equally as clean or as dirty if you like and people would use them ahead of driving in fact public transport vehicles are probably cleaner than most people's cars as they are cleaned every night as opposed to once a month/year if cleanliness if making people favour they're cars over public transport then most people are hypocrites as they're cars should be spotless if they want to complain about dirty buses.

Most drivers wouldn't have time to clean buses anyway as they have to go back out on the next departure, finish their shift or take one of their legally required breaks.

The reason it is uncomfortable is because of older buses such as EVs which feel like they are going to fall apart every time they hit even the slightest bump in the road. In fact if you go to cities with far better public transport than here you'd find that most of their vehicles are equally as littered/dirty or graffited as here but people use them as they provide a better alternative to car travel.

LeinsterDub

Doors front and back? Pfft that fad will never catch on

boombang

I reckon a lot of comfort has to do with driver skill and attention. Some guys drive like they're transporting 10,000 eggs. I always compliment these fellows as I get off. They're clearly conscious that they're doing it and it must take effort.

...__...

I can see the Berlin one now in Dublin.
20 people all standing on the stairs waiting for the bus to stop the driver should open the doors when he sees the stop and watch as all the people get flung out!

loyatemu

...__... wrote: »

I can see the Berlin one now in Dublin.
20 people all standing on the stairs waiting for the bus to stop the driver should open the doors when he sees the stop and watch as all the people get flung out!

it would reduce dwell times!

Del2005

boombang wrote: »

I agree that reliability is an probably the main issue, but littering is element part of the comfort aspect that puts me off taking the bus. As for the attitude that it's not the drivers job, well I think there's no reason why they shouldn't clean the buses between runs, with appropriate compensation. The attitude that making the environment more pleasant for the paying customer isn't possible is what keeps people in cars. I'd love to see competition between bus firms with alternatives offering better standards. Currently it's a very uncomfortable way to travel.

And when is the driver supposed to get a break? It's not easy to drive a bus through city traffic and if the driver then has to tidy the bus before completing the return journey there'll be an increased risk to everyone due to fatigue of the driver.

thereality

boombang wrote: »

3. a mandatory clean of the bus at each turn around, supported by fines to leap cards for passengers spotted on CCTV for littering.

Ah here, I would be happy with a daily cleaning of the bus. I have gotten the bus some mornings, where it was the first journey of the day and it had clearly not been cleaned the night before

bk

Excellent video here showing the interior and flow of the above Singapore bus:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=80&v=WwFeiZcSl_8

I really recommend people watch it. They have bright green arrows on the floor directing people through the bus, through the front door, up the front stairs, then along upstairs and thne exit down the rear stairs and they then get to go out their own dedicated rear door, which is separated from the rest of downstairs by a flappy gate. Seems like a really great design to me.

If you pause the video as he is going upstairs you will also notice another great feature, a simple LCD display showing the number of free seats upstairs! Brilliant, there most be sensors upstairs detecting the number of free seats. What a simple and great idea. All double deckers should have that. Imagine a DB driver being able to see how many seats are free upstairs at a glance and being able to direct people upstairs. Nice.

cherryghost

Very well thought out. One can dream