Could the state pension ever be removed for people now in there 20s and 30s?

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Just wondering if this would ever be possible and if so would it be replaced with anything similar. Talking about the pension that everyone is entitled to.

SuperSean11

They'll just push it back. I expect to need to live to 100 before getting a cent.

HONKEY TONK

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Just wondering if this would ever be possible and if so would it be replaced with anything similar. Talking about the pension that everyone is entitled to.

Yes. I have to wait another 30 years so you never know how it’s going to be financed by the time to claim your entitlements

I have a private pension and god only knows where that investment will be gone

Geuze

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Just wondering if this would ever be possible and if so would it be replaced with anything similar. Talking about the pension that everyone is entitled to.

Everybody is not entitled to a State Pension.

I know plenty of people over 66 not in receipt of State Pensions.

dotsman

There's no pension that everybody is entitled to. There's one based on prsi payments which is paid out as long as you meet the contributions criteria and another that is for everybody else (but is means tested, so only applicable to folk with no/little other pension and/or wealth).

To answer your question, I don't see them ever getting rid of the state pensions. However, it is likely, over time, they will need to do one, some or all of the following:
1. Increase the minimum age before you are entitled to claim the pension;
2. Decrease the amount payable;
3. Increase the number of required prsi contributions for the contributory pension;
4. Apply means testing (so people sensible enough to have their own pension get punished!); and/or
5. Increase the prsi/usc rates.

Ultimately, there will always be enough money to have some sort of state pension scheme, just nowhere near enough to run it at its current rates/funding.

skippy2

If I was 20 again :-).......I would plan on the basis that there will be no/little public pension available and if there is when you get there treat it as a nice bonus......I can see it more and more getting means tested for both

Geuze

dotsman wrote: »

To answer your question, I don't see them ever getting rid of the state pensions. However, it is likely, over time, they will need to do one, some or all of the following:
1. Increase the minimum age before you are entitled to claim the pension;

Yes, this has happened, already legislated to move to 68.

2. Decrease the amount payable Political suicide.

3. Increase the number of required prsi contributions for the contributory pension;

Yes, this is likely, the plan is to move from an average conts approach to a total conts approach in 2021


4. Apply means testing (so people sensible enough to have their own pension get punished!); and/or

5. Increase the prsi/usc rates. Yes, 4% PRSI is low.

Ultimately, there will always be enough money to have some sort of state pension scheme, just nowhere near enough to run it at its current rates/funding.

Good points.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Geuze wrote: »

Good points.

Thanks all for the responses! I'm aware the state will struggle to afford the current state pension in 40 years time but surely they couldn't just squeeze it down to 0. The current younger generation would never accept it.

Also curious to see what the current criteria is for a state pension, have to work for a certain number of years and not have lots of savings?

Jim2007

There will be pension reform and most likely it will be along the typical EU member state three pillar system.

Geuze

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Also curious to see what the current criteria is for a state pension, have to work for a certain number of years and not have lots of savings?

http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/State-Pension-Contributory.aspx

Three criteria - you need to:

(1) Have paid social insurance contributions before a certain age

(2) Have a certain number of social insurance contributions paid and

(3) Have a certain average number over the years since you first started to pay

Geuze

1. Paid insurance before a certain age

You must have started to pay social insurance before the age of 56. (The age limit is higher for people born before 1922.)

2. Number of paid contributions

If you reach pension age on or after April 6 2012, you need to have 520 full-rate contributions (10 years contributions). In this case, only 260 of the 520 contributions may be voluntary contributions.

Note that social insurance contributions fall into the four groups below.

Full-rate social insurance contributions are PRSI contributions at Classes A, E, F, G, H, N and S or at the 'ordinary' rate before 6 April 1979.
Modified-rate social insurance contributions are PRSI contributions at Classes B, C and D (paid by civil and public servants).
Voluntary contributions are made by people under age 66 who are no longer covered by compulsory PRSI provided they satisfy certain conditions.
Credited contributions ('credits') are similar to the social insurance contributions you pay while employed and are usually awarded at the same rate as your last paid social insurance contribution. You may get credits when you are claiming a social welfare payment. Credits are not allowed after self-employed contributions (Class S).

Geuze

3. Average number of contributions per year

You must meet the average condition. This is probably the most complex aspect of qualifying for a State Pension (Contributory).

Normal average rule

The normal average rule states that you must have a yearly average of at least 10 appropriate contributions paid or credited from the year you first entered insurance or from 1953, whichever is later to the end of the tax year before you reach pension age (66). An average of 10 entitles you to a minimum pension; you need an average of 48 to get the maximum pension.

Alternative average rule

This alternative average only applies to people who reach pension age on or after 6 April 1992.

It requires that you have an average of 48 Class A, E, F, G, H, N or S contributions (paid or credited) for each contribution year from the 1979/80 tax year to the end of the tax year before you reach pension age (66). This average would entitle you to the maximum pension. There is no provision for a reduced pension when this alternative average is used.

So, if you reach the age of 66 on or after April 6 1992, your average will be looked at in two ways - the usual average will be assessed and the alternative average will be assessed. Most employed or formerly employed people will be able to meet the alternative average. The alternative average will probably be looked at first because it is easier to assess. If you do not have an average of 48 contributions from 1979 then the normal method of assessing the average will be looked at and you may get a reduced pension (if you do not meet the alternative average, it is virtually impossible for you to have an average of 48 using the normal average rule).

Geuze

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Also curious to see what the current criteria is for a state pension, have to work for a certain number of years and not have lots of savings?

There are two State Pensions:

(1) contributory, based on PRSI conts

(2) non-contributory, which is means-tested


You can have millions of wealth, and get a cont SP, as you have paid PRSI.

CEO on 1m salary will get the State Pension, as they pay PRSI.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Jim2007 wrote: »

There will be pension reform and most likely it will be along the typical EU member state three pillar system.

Interesting, what is the three pillar system? Surely the pension couldn't be reset to 0 for younger generations in 40 years time?

Geuze

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Interesting, what is the three pillar system? Surely the pension couldn't be reset to 0 for younger generations in 40 years time?

1st pillar = State Pension

2nd pillar = work pension [optional in Ireland, except in PS]

3rd pillar = personal, private pension, between worker and pension co. [e.g. self-employed people]

The mix between the three pillars varies from country to country.

Sue Pa Key Pa

I've always planned on not being reliant on the State for income in my later years. If it is there when I retire it will be a nice little bonus

scheister

Like others I'm working off the basis that my private pension will cover me when i retire. The state pension will be a added bonus if i get it.

As it stands at the moment i can access my private pension from 60 but state pension i will need to be 68 (based on known age increases)
My current job contract states i have to retire at 65.

Also i think the state pension should equal the AMRF amount which i always assumed was the point