Borealius Portus Cale

Deep Thought

am so tempted by this... $ 320, has to be worth it

https://www.borealiswatch.com/store/Pre-Order-Borealis-Portus-Cale-Black-Version-C1-Dial-Old-Radium-No-Date-p97430198/?mc_cid=1b0b4ac76f&mc_eid=6d0c14a60d

Ionised

Think 160 is the deposit with another 160 to pay.
Borealis do make a nice watch though and even at 320 it's good value

Deep Thought

Ionised wrote: »

Think 160 is the deposit with another 160 to pay.
Borealis do make a nice watch though and even at 320 it's good value

yeah, try to modified it, just done it now

Thirdfox

I had a Borealis sea-hawk but sold it to get the Tudor Pelagos (the sea-hawk was the homage).

Liked it a lot but I see that clasp has been downgraded in the Cale. The double dome sapphire crystal in the sea-hawk was a nice touch too - flat crystal in this watch seems "boring" in comparison (but a safe option I admit).

I highly recommend their rubber straps though - great value/price. Their version 2 of the strap is very comfortable and I bought one for a diver of mine (after finding version 1 to be just ok).

One thing to note - the 320 price doesn't include 20% VAT I think - you'll need to add that for shipping within the EU. So the final price rises to $384 - at that price point I think I would want the watch to have some standout features to differentiate itself from other 300-350 euro dive watches.

Plus...I have too many (7) dive watches now - it's a no from me

Ionised

Call me shallow, but I'm a sucker for an offset crown.

Thirdfox

Citizen NY0040 - lots of variants including a full dial lume one - I was looking to get one before the Pelagos arrived.

They've gone up in price since being discontinued - used to cost 100ish and now seem to be around 200.

Which makes the 360 for the Cale harder to swallow - it's a microbrand (with sapphire and lumed bezel I realise) but costs around double the Citizen or a nice Seiko diver...

I see they've moved away from a ceramic bezel also (which was in the sea-hawk) in favour of a PVD stainless steel one. Another minus in my book (without a corresponding drop in price for the piece).

art

Thirdfox wrote: »

One thing to note - the 320 price doesn't include 20% VAT I think - you'll need to add that for shipping within the EU. So the final price rises to $384 - at that price point I think I would want the watch to have some standout features to differentiate itself from other 300-350 euro dive watches.

23% = 393 euros and duty too will put it up over €400!

Thirdfox

You only pay 20% (Portuguese VAT rate not Irish vat rate) and no duty as it's within the EU.

So not quite as bad as over 400 but yeah it'll be around €364. This will be a problem once it comes to resale - as US buyers etc. will look at the €320 original price and wonder why you are saying the original price is $400 (I've had that issue when trying to sell the Sea-hawk).

...so ideally - you can try and purchase the Cale (if you like it) 2nd hand from a US seller - getting the benefit of the seller having not paid VAT on the sale and being in with a chance that you won't get VAT or duty applied on your purchase.

goose banker

They changed the VAT rules a while ago as far as I know. You now pay the VAT of your own country, not the country where the item is for sale. So even if the VAT rate in Portugal is 20%, you get the Irish rate of 23% applied.

For example, if you look at the Borealis watch in question, the deposit price is $160.00, if you were to buy it you would be charged $196.80 - which is $160.00 + 23%

Thirdfox

VAT rules only change if the company in question does enough business with the recipient country - I do not imagine Borealis would hit that mark.

However you're right about the 23% rate - and it appears that Portugal has changed to a 23% standard VAT rate also.

You'll see the change in VAT rate most often when buying from Amazon.co.uk - if they find the shipping address is in Ireland the 20% VAT rate gets changed to 23% and the price of a good goes up.

Very dry stuff I admit but it's my day job - btw for anyone interested the distance selling rules are €35,000 for goods in any particular year - sell more than that to Ireland and you'll need to charge Irish VAT. Amazon obviously does more business than 35k but I doubt Borealis does

Looking back - I see Portugal hasn't had a 20% VAT rate since 2010! Apologies for the confusion. But that does make sense that I would associate the sea-hawk with a 20% VAT rate.

The world of VAT is very interesting (to me at least) - almost as interesting as watches

goose banker

Thanks for the VAT info. I often get bike parts from a couple of German online shops and I noticed a while back that where I used to get charged the German 19% VAT rate, now I was getting charged the Irish 23% rate. I guess they must exceed the €35k sales to Ireland.

HDMI

For $320 I'm tempted, but it's just another black bezel diver, not sure I would give it much wrist time.

The Steinhart Ocean One green looks a nicer watch.

Thirdfox

Or what about the Christopher Ward divers? They have a nice in-house movement at least right? - I see their price is 800-900 - that means once it's 50% off it'll be €450 - not too far off $380.

art

Thirdfox wrote: »

Or what about the Christopher Ward divers? They have a nice in-house movement at least right? - I see their price is 800-900 - that means once it's 50% off it'll be €450 - not too far off $380.

The models in the 8 to 900 range, are not using their in house movement, as far as I know, that's over 2000.

(I see they’ve gone and changed their logo again! +:: )