Is my rare breed (Bó riabhach) in calf ?

GreatOaktree

I am an archaeologist and rare breeder. I have one Droimeann cow with calf at foot and a Bó riabhach (less than 12 of the breed survive). Bó riabhach translates as brindle cow, she is red with black stripes. The Bó riabhach has aborted her last two calves, one at 3 months and the other at 7 months, this was before I bought her. She should be due the first week in January as the previous owner watched her being bult.

I do not want to scan her for fear she may abort again so I do not know for sure that she is in calf. She has a massive belly but it hasn't gotten any bigger all summer and is big to one side. She is running with the bull and has not come into heat. I noticed here teat are clean this last two weeks but no calf has been sucking her, she has been cleaning them herself. She has had 7 calves before I bought her.

If she is in calf and due in the first week of January when can I expect her to spring ?

Has she started to spring already seeing as she has been cleaning her teat ?

If she is in calf shouldn't she have a massive belly on both sides ?

Is it possible that she is not in calf and not coming in heat ?

Never wrestle with pigs

Is it bigger to the left as you stand behind her? That would suggest that she may be incalf. If you look at her for 5/10 minutes on the same side just behind her hips and down a bit you should see the calf jumping in her every few minutes.

tanko

Anything is possible with cows. Get a vet to handle or scan her, it wont do any harm if done properly, if shes in calf she'll need pre calver minerals or a bolus from six or eight weeks before calving.
Put an anti sucking device in her nose to stop her suckling herself.

GreatOaktree

Never wrestle with pigs wrote: »

Is it bigger to the left as you stand behind her? That would suggest that she may be incalf. If you look at her for 5/10 minutes on the same side just behind her hips and down a bit you should see the calf jumping in her every few minutes.

Yes she is big to the left and I have seen some movement at the location you described, thanks for the speedy reply.

GreatOaktree

tanko wrote: »

Anything is possible with cows. Get a vet to handle or scan her, it wont do any harm if done properly, if shes in calf she'll need pre calver minerals or a bolus from six or eight weeks before calving.
Put an anti sucking device in her nose to stop her suckling herself.

She has a bucket of lifeline at the min. She's not sucking herself just cleaning a wee bit. Is this a good sign given that she only started doing it recently. Thanks for the reply.

patsy_mccabe

Put up a Picture of her. Have you a Bo Riabhach bull too?

GreatOaktree

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Put up a Picture of her. Have you a Bo Riabhach bull too?

http://www.thatsfarming.com/news/farmer-focus-24th-sept

I partly own one of only two bulls left alive. Please God she has a bull because he may save the breed.

Limestone Cowboy

Would it be worth getting semen frozen and stored from the bull if hes one of only two left alive in case anything happens to him.

GreatOaktree

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Would it be worth getting semen frozen and stored from the bull if hes one of only two left alive in case anything happens to him.

Thats the plan, we are in the process of forming a society and are currently waiting on results from genetic testing.

Limestone Cowboy

GreatOaktree wrote: »

Thats the plan, we are in the process of forming a society and are currently waiting on results from genetic testing.

Best of luck with it, may be worth taking embryos off a suitable cow/heifer too. You're starting from a very small base.

White Clover

Some scanning operators can scan externally. It is not stressful on the animal at all. Maybe check if there's someone local that you could get to do this.

Mooooo

Did they test her for anything after previous abortions? As said above she can be scanned externally. Hopefully she'll hold for you this time but perhaps no harm to blood test her if the vet is out, neospora picked up from dogs and foxes can cause cows to abort

patsy_mccabe

Are you getting all the support you need for this? Have you talked to other breed societies? I'm sure they would be glad to help you.
Embyro transfer and collecting semen straws would seem the best way to go, with such a small number of animals.

greysides

Never wrestle with pigs wrote: »

Is it bigger to the left as you stand behind her? That would suggest that she may be incalf. If you look at her for 5/10 minutes on the same side just behind her hips and down a bit you should see the calf jumping in her every few minutes.

GreatOaktree wrote: »

Yes she is big to the left and I have seen some movement at the location you described, thanks for the speedy reply.

Looking at the cow from behind, the left side of the abdomen is taken up with the rumen (the big stomach of the cow), the uterus is predominantly on the right. That a caesarian is done on the left is confusing but its easier to get around the one big organ than it is to get through the mesentery and intestines approaching from the right.

A cow 'looking in-calf' and being in-calf are two very different things at times. When a cow 'looks in-calf' to me, there's a bulge around 4 o'clock to 6 o'clock as you observe from behind. Balloting the abdomen from about 7 months on should work fairly well to identify a calf. Basically you put your fist to the skin in the area mentioned above and push hard in and try to hold it. If you feel a 'fairly solid lump' inside it should be the calf. You have to try around the area from the udder up about midway and from the backleg to the ribs as the calf could be anywhere in that area.

If memory serves there's a blood sample for oestrone sulphate that can be done to check if she's in-calf. Handling or scanning should be perfectly safe but at this point you're going to find out soon enough...


If she is in calf and due in the first week of January when can I expect her to spring ?

Cows can spring in an instant or for a long time before hand. I suppose you should notice something in the near future.

Has she started to spring already seeing as she has been cleaning her teat ?

She's not being sucked by the other calf, is she? If the teats are enlarging and swelling a little they may look different.

If she is in calf shouldn't she have a massive belly on both sides ?

Not always. Some thin cows can be very deceptive.

Is it possible that she is not in calf and not coming in heat ?

Yes. Cysts, pyometra or a Mummified foetus could cause that. They're a lot more unlikely than her being pregnant though.

Base price

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Are you getting all the support you need for this? Have you talked to other breed societies? I'm sure they would be glad to help you.
Embyro transfer and collecting semen straws would seem the best way to go, with such a small number of animals.

Thinking the same myself. Since there are so few numbers and the breed is on the point of extinction maybe one of the State bodies like the Heritage Council (??) could get involved with either funding or veterinary/scientific backing to help preserve the breed.
I wouldn't mind my tax money spent on a project link this.

kowtow

GreatOaktree wrote: »

http://www.thatsfarming.com/news/farmer-focus-24th-sept

I partly own one of only two bulls left alive. Please God she has a bull because he may save the breed.

Good luck with her in any event, and please keep us updated - good news or bad - I am sure there are plenty on here that would be happy to offer any help they can in keeping the breed going.

whelan2

I remember a farmer in England when I was in college would hit the cows belly with a stick to see if they were in calf. Now they would be well on in calf at this stage. Reckoned he had 99% accuracy

Peter90

Any picture of the bull & cow, interested to see the breed

Base price

Did a bit of rummaging on the net and came across this link from the Dept
https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjXmpvpzLfXAhUHCsAKHagNCD4QFghCMAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.agriculture.gov.ie%2Fmedia%2Fmigration%2Ffarmingschemesandpayments%2Fotherfarmersschemes%2Fconservationgeneticresources%2Fgeneticresourcesprojects%2F2014%2FGenomewidecharactrareirishcattlebreeds060516.doc&usg=AOvVaw3oPQ4hp9xBbeMQ9WakHP2V

Bellview

Did you vaccinate for lepto as that may be cause of issue as sounds like the cow was in another herd for bull so she may have been exposed to it.
Might be worth contacting farmers journal as they were looking for photos of rare breeds . Saw in dealer section a few weeks ago and you would definitely be of interesr

playbull

GreatOaktree wrote: »

I am an archaeologist and rare breeder. I have one Droimeann cow with calf at foot and a Bó riabhach (less than 12 of the breed survive). Bó riabhach translates as brindle cow, she is red with black stripes. The Bó riabhach has aborted her last two calves, one at 3 months and the other at 7 months, this was before I bought her. She should be due the first week in January as the previous owner watched her being bult.

I do not want to scan her for fear she may abort again so I do not know for sure that she is in calf. She has a massive belly but it hasn't gotten any bigger all summer and is big to one side. She is running with the bull and has not come into heat. I noticed here teat are clean this last two weeks but no calf has been sucking her, she has been cleaning them herself. She has had 7 calves before I bought her.

If she is in calf and due in the first week of January when can I expect her to spring ?

Has she started to spring already seeing as she has been cleaning her teat ?

If she is in calf shouldn't she have a massive belly on both sides ?

Is it possible that she is not in calf and not coming in heat ?

I read about you on "That's Farming" and I was fascinated with your story of the Bo Riamhach. Though I had some knowledge of the Droimeann, I though the Bo Riabhach was a bit like Finn MCCool..a relic of folklore and was delighted to find out that they actually exist. I would really like to see this rarest of breeds in the flesh and I would be interested in saving the breed. The problem is there are so few, how can sourcing stock be found or where?

Thanks and best of luck with both breeds. If you have information on a preservation society being set up to save Bo Riabhach, please keep us informed.

jimini0

Hi bigoaktree any update for us?
Sorry for dragging up an old thread but I wanted to find out how the project is goin

jimini0

Just found a newer thread I should have searched longer before posting on this one. Apologies