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People with driving licences who never sat a test:

  • 05-11-2017 6:34pm
    #1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭


    The driving test was only introduced in Ireland in 1964. This means it is highly likely that anyone who was 17 or older in 1964 who has a driving license never actually sat a driving test (anyone born before 1947).

    There was also an amnesty in 1979 whereby licenses were just handed out!

    Should these people have to sit a test before having their licenses renewed again?


Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,069 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    The driving test was only introduced in Ireland in 1964. This means it is highly likely that anyone who was 17 or older in 1964 who has a driving license never actually sat a driving test (anyone born before 1947).

    There was also an amnesty in 1979 whereby licenses were just handed out!

    Should these people have to sit a test before having their licenses renewed again?

    No, that would be unfair.
    Either introduce retest for everyone at renewal or for no one.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭Gerrup Outta Dat!


    CiniO wrote: »
    No, that would be unfair.
    Either introduce retest for everyone at renewal or for no one.

    Would you agree with retesting for all? If someone has all categories, retesting would be time-consuming and expensive.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,831 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    My mam has one of those 1979 amnesty licences...
    Can't say she's any worse a driver than anyone else around her age...
    . . I'm sure there are more practical ways of improving road safety

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,095 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    My husband had one of the freely issued licenses from the early days. He gave up driving in his latter years but until then was an entirely safe and conscientious driver with no claims or points.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,467 ✭✭✭jimmynokia


    I think they should have to do test and we we all resit our test every 10 years or 5 after 65 to put a resaonable time frame on it,we all pick up bad habits.
    Think about it you pass test once and thats it.... Its wrong needs to be looked into.
    I have discussed this on twitter and facebook and most agree.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,637 ✭✭✭brightspark


    Anyone who was 17+ in 1964 is now 70+, their driving abilities are probably more determined by their health than anything else. I'm guessing the numbers of them are in decline so hardly worth making them sit tests etc.

    Those who got the amnesty are at least 55+, probably older as I think you needed to be on your second provisional at the time.

    It's more than 25 years since I passed my driving test.

    You could argue that everyone should be retested, say every 5 years? Or perhaps a CPC course similar to truck drivers would be better.


    The pass rate however would need to improve substantially to facilitate increasing the numbers tested each year, (or will the roads be full of people doing driving tests).
    The standard of those applying to do the test needs to improve.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    There was also an amnesty in 1979 whereby licenses were just handed out!


    Make someone who's been driving for 40 years to sit a test? That doesn't make sense. They have experience behind the wheel.

    I would go for having to resit the test after a ban. Also the family GP should not be allowed to certify over 70 year old. Too many oaps still driving and are an obvious danger to others. They should have to go to an independent doctor or a doctor.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,069 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Would you agree with retesting for all? If someone has all categories, retesting would be time-consuming and expensive.

    Probably you're right that it would be overkill.

    I like the system in Poland, where you're obliged to resit your driving test if you exceed penalty points.
    And considering penalty points there are issued for most traffic offences, like inappropriate usage of lights, no using indicators, incorrect lane discipline, obviously speeding, dangerous overtaking, driving unroadworthy car, and million others, as well as causing road collision (even minor one like bumper to bumper fender benders), then exceeding penalty point limit is actually quite likely and happens a lot, especially for someone who can't be bothered about driving correctly.

    In Ireland, I don't know what would you need to do to exceed penalty points limit. I don't know anyone who would be even close.
    I Poland I know fair amount of people who were forced to resit driving test for exceeding penalty points limit.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Sleeper12 wrote: »
    Make someone who's been driving for 40 years to sit a test? That doesn't make sense. They have experience behind the wheel......

    No problem passing then would they ?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 492 ✭✭Gerrup Outta Dat!


    CiniO wrote: »
    Probably you're right that it would be overkill.

    I like the system in Poland, where you're obliged to resit your driving test if you exceed penalty points.
    And considering penalty points there are issued for most traffic offences, like inappropriate usage of lights, no using indicators, incorrect lane discipline, obviously speeding, dangerous overtaking, driving unroadworthy car, and million others, as well as causing road collision (even minor one like bumper to bumper fender benders), then exceeding penalty point limit is actually quite likely and happens a lot, especially for someone who can't be bothered about driving correctly.

    In Ireland, I don't know what would you need to do to exceed penalty points limit. I don't know anyone who would be even close.
    I Poland I know fair amount of people who were forced to resit driving test for exceeding penalty points limit.

    Someone could be caught by a camera doing 54 km/h in a 50 km/h zone 4 times in a 3 year period and end up with 12 points. Points shouldn't apply for beig marginally over the speed limit, but that's for another thread.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Neon_Lights


    I think people should have to sit a motorway test though, people cant drive for the lives of them on motorways


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,430 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    I think people should have to sit a motorway test though, people cant drive for the lives of them on motorways

    Is there a higher rate of accidents/deaths on motorways than normal roads? I would have thought the 'dangerous' places to drive are those places with uncertainty/unpredictability in the road conditions which is not usually the case on motorways. Motorway driving is pretty straight forward imo.
    Someone could be caught by a camera doing 54 km/h in a 50 km/h zone 4 times in a 3 year period and end up with 12 points. Points shouldn't apply for beig marginally over the speed limit, but that's for another thread.

    They're not learning their lesson then are they?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Neon_Lights


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    Motorway driving is pretty straight forward imo.

    you'd think that wouldn't you, go on the m50 or any three-lane carriageway in and out of Dublin and you will see some of the most abhorrent selfish and utterly moronic driving.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    gctest50 wrote:
    No problem passing then would they ?


    What would be the point?
    They don't need to sit a test. They have proven over 40 years of driving that they can drive.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,637 ✭✭✭brightspark


    I think people should have to sit a motorway, test though, people cant drive for the lives of them on motorways

    From what I've seen lane hopping and not being in the correct lane are the biggest problems on motorways.

    Driving out of Dublin in the evenings the "overtaking" lane is effectively just another lane, however if you leave more than the length of a car between you and the car in front you will have the driver behind flashing his lights and/or overtake on the inside. They are still driving at the same speed they were before as there are hundreds of cars ahead of them still, they are just a couple of seconds ahead.

    Approaching the exits I've left a gap ahead that any of the drivers could use to exit, instead they wait until they are about 20m from the exit to switch to the correct lane, delaying all the drivers behind them as they wait for a gap.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,038 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    ...There was also an amnesty in 1979 whereby licenses were just handed out!...
    There is a lot of myths about the 1979 amnesty. The licences weren't simply 'handed out' as such. The 5 month bitter postal strike that year caused havoc with the driver testing system (as most people didn't have telephones) and, as a result the waiting time for a test stretched to over 2 and a half years. As a result the Government of the day made a decision to grant a once off amnesty to people who met a certain set of criteria.

    1. Those who held a 2nd Provisional Licence in Category C (now Category B)
    2. Those who had applied for a driving test by a date in March that year.


    The Minister of the day (Sylvester Barrett I think?) made the announcement in the Dail in September and, as it only applied to those who were already on the waiting list the previous March, the closing date was 6 months closed. All those stories you hear about people rushing out the next day to get a provisional licence to exchange for a full licence are rubbish as are those about people getting truck and bus licences - it only applied to category C, you had to be on your 2nd provisional and already be on the waiting list.

    There was a legal requirement at the time to be accompanied on the 1st, 3rd and subsequent provisional licence - hence the reason the amnesty was offered to those on their 2nd provisional only.

    In relation to the pre 1964 people, I'd say they represent a very small proportion of drivers now - probably less than 1 or 2% and they are statistically very safe drivers having a minuscule amount of claims which is even more significant given that, pro rata, olders drivers are much more likely to make a claim compared to younger drivers.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,430 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    you'd think that wouldn't you, go on the m50 or any three-lane carriageway in and out of Dublin and you will see some of the most abhorrent selfish and utterly moronic driving.

    The M50 is not really a motorway and cannot be treated as one due to the level of congestion.

    Can't say I have noticed too many issues on the other motorways. Sure there are a few who drive too fast and too slow but they are easily avoided.

    From my experience of driving (20 years in 6 or 7 different countries) I would say Irish drivers on general are excellent. Certainly better than UK or US anyway.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    CiniO wrote: »
    Probably you're right that it would be overkill.

    I like the system in Poland, where you're obliged to resit your driving test if you exceed penalty points.
    And considering penalty points there are issued for most traffic offences, like inappropriate usage of lights, no using indicators, incorrect lane discipline, obviously speeding, dangerous overtaking, driving unroadworthy car, and million others, as well as causing road collision (even minor one like bumper to bumper fender benders), then exceeding penalty point limit is actually quite likely and happens a lot, especially for someone who can't be bothered about driving correctly.

    In Ireland, I don't know what would you need to do to exceed penalty points limit. I don't know anyone who would be even close.
    I Poland I know fair amount of people who were forced to resit driving test for exceeding penalty points limit.

    Absolutely brilliant idea. Go Poland!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭MascotDec85


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    The M50 is not really a motorway and cannot be treated as one due to the level of congestion.

    Can't say I have noticed too many issues on the other motorways. Sure there are a few who drive too fast and too slow but they are easily avoided.

    From my experience of driving (20 years in 6 or 7 different countries) I would say Irish drivers on general are excellent. Certainly better than UK or US anyway.

    So let’s not call the M25 around London a motorway.

    Don’t be silly


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Neon_Lights


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    The M50 is not really a motorway and cannot be treated as one due to the level of congestion.

    Can't say I have noticed too many issues on the other motorways. Sure there are a few who drive too fast and too slow but they are easily avoided.

    From my experience of driving (20 years in 6 or 7 different countries) I would say Irish drivers on general are excellent. Certainly better than UK or US anyway.

    The M in the title gives some sort of hint it is classed as such, and to be fair even on a saturday morning for example it is as free flowing as any other, despite the spurious declassment you have given it.

    in my opinion US drivers are terrible and justifiably cannot exchange their licence for ours. especially seeing they find "driving stick" an insidious task. I find uk drivers similar to us, prudent albeit slightly more impatient. I think UK drivers are a german/irish hybrid if you crossed us both.


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    While the act of driving the vehicle doesn't change, there's a lot around it on regulations/legislation/rules of the road that does. I think renewal should require some sort of a course to show a driver has kept up with it. Insisting on sitting a full practical retest is only going to get in the way of someone who's trying to get their initial license.
    I think people should have to sit a motorway test though, people cant drive for the lives of them on motorways

    A motorway isn't anything special. it's just a road that doesn't have traffic lights on it. people make it sound like it's a big deal while really is should be no different than a dual carriageway. The main reason learners don't go on them is due to the typically higher speed limits.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,513 ✭✭✭Melodeon


    Restating stuff I've been banging on about for years:
    Current valid Driver Theory Test Certificate to renew Driving Licence.
    Full Driving Test to reinstate Driving Licence following a revocation or ban.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,430 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    The M in the title gives some sort of hint it is classed as such, and to be fair even on a saturday morning for example it is as free flowing as any other, despite the spurious declassment you have given it.

    Classed as such but not treated as such i.e. 100km/hr zones. It is essentially a commuter ring road. I don't recall ever using cruise control on the M50 for example.
    in my opinion US drivers are terrible and justifiably cannot exchange their licence for ours. especially seeing they find "driving stick" an insidious task. I find uk drivers similar to us, prudent albeit slightly more impatient. I think UK drivers are a german/irish hybrid if you crossed us both.

    UK drivers I have found to be more aggressive than Irish. Also they tend to tailgate a lot closer than the average driver over here. Definitely more nervy on a UK motorway than one in Ireland.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Motorways around major cities often have lower speed limits than the other parts of the network.

    I find that Irish drivers have a shocking approach to land discipline.
    The amount of times the inside lane is empty and there is a line of cars plodding along under the speed limit in the middle lane is a disgrace.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Neon_Lights


    liamog wrote: »
    The amount of times the inside lane is empty and there is a line of cars plodding along under the speed limit in the middle lane is a disgrace.

    Amen.


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