Social Welfare inspector anomaly?

eridanus

Hi

About 4 months ago, I received a call from a social welfare inspector who informed me that she was going to call in 2 days time to interview me. She turned up with a folder of papers containing our last 6 months of bank statements already procured. I was not asked to provide statements, I didn’t give any permission for them to be obtained, how does she have them? Is there not a voluntary bank disclosure form to be signed? I would not have refused. Can any government office just get your details? I realise there are people on here, who may work for this or a similar agency. Surely this is not within guidelines and for anyone coming on here to proselytize about good work, tell me this is not normal and now I feel I have to pursue it. I am hoping someone can tell me that this is normal as I don’t want the stress. For what it is worth, nothing abnormal was found and status quo remains.

Thanks in advance. K

Nomis21

When/if you applied for a benefit or allowance you would have been asked to provide bank statements for any accounts that you have. If you filled in the forms but failed at that time to provide statements for any bank accounts that you have then then DSP will have been able to access them themselves.

rsole1

Nomis21 wrote: »

When/if you applied for a benefit or allowance you would have been asked to provide bank statements for any accounts that you have. If you filled in the forms but failed at that time to provide statements for any bank accounts that you have then then DSP will have been able to access them themselves.

So you're saying the DSP has access to all bank accounts, no I don't think that is correct.

Foweva Awone

That doesn't sound right to me at all! Any chance someone else has access to your account, e.g. a disgruntled ex-partner who may have tried to report you for something?

I would assume that there is a mechanism in place for the DSP to gain access to your account history in exceptional circumstances, but I would really hope they'd be expected to at least request them from you first.

Cushie Butterfield

DSP have had these powers since 2009.

http://www.welfare.ie/en/downloads/swact2_09.pdf

Scroll down to Section 17 Information to be furnished by financial institutions.

elperello

Cushie Butterfield wrote: »

DSP have had these powers since 2009.

http://www.welfare.ie/en/downloads/swact2_09.pdf

Scroll down to Section 17 Information to be furnished by financial institutions.

Thanks for the link.
I had a look at S 17 and. It doesn't appear that the correct procedures were followed in OP's case.

trixiebust

Cushie Butterfield wrote:

DSP have had these powers since 2009.

Cushie Butterfield wrote:

Scroll down to Section 17 Information to be furnished by financial institutions.

Crazy the power these people have. I'm currently applying for DA, & 10 months ago I sold an item on Adverts for €50.All my bank statements were returned to me looking for an explanation of that €50 payment. I sold the item to pay a bill, and wrote as such in my reply.

And when I've had issues, they're less than helpful.

Balagan

eridanus wrote: »

Hi

About 4 months ago, I received a call from a social welfare inspector who informed me that she was going to call in 2 days time to interview me. She turned up with a folder of papers containing our last 6 months of bank statements already procured. I was not asked to provide statements, I didn’t give any permission for them to be obtained, how does she have them? Is there not a voluntary bank disclosure form to be signed? I would not have refused. Can any government office just get your details? I realise there are people on here, who may work for this or a similar agency. Surely this is not within guidelines and for anyone coming on here to proselytize about good work, tell me this is not normal and now I feel I have to pursue it. I am hoping someone can tell me that this is normal as I don’t want the stress. For what it is worth, nothing abnormal was found and status quo remains.

Thanks in advance. K

Is your bank account a joint bank account? If yes, then had the other party supplied the bank statements?

Balagan

trixiebust wrote: »

Crazy the power these people have. I'm currently applying for DA, & 10 months ago I sold an item on Adverts for €50.All my bank statements were returned to me looking for an explanation of that €50 payment. I sold the item to pay a bill, and wrote as such in my reply.

And when I've had issues, they're less than helpful.

All social assistance payments are means tested. All payments into accounts, unless already declared and documented, will be routinely queried as part of that means testing.

trixiebust

Balagan wrote:

All social assistance payments are means tested. All payments into accounts, unless already declared and documented, will be routinely queried as part of that means testing.

I understand that. But to query a €50 PayPal payment from 10 months previous is ridiculous. Looking through my statements, anyone could see we live week to week.

splinter65

trixiebust wrote: »

I understand that. But to query a €50 PayPal payment from 10 months previous is ridiculous. Looking through my statements, anyone could see we live week to week.

SW fraud is a huge problem and sometimes the fraud is actually the fault of the Dept for not being thorough enough in its investigations into claims.
The vast majority of claimants have no clue as to their entitlements and may assume that small time buying and selling on Donedeal etc, doing little paid handyman jobs around the area was not going to be taken into account. It is.
Couples living together also quite innocently assume that their OHs income was neither here nor there in their claim. It is.
Sadly for the claimant, if there is an overpayment then mostly the claimant has to pay it back.
That’s why inspectors are so rigorous.
What’s ridiculous to you is actually protecting you in the end.

trixiebust

splinter65 wrote:

SW fraud is a huge problem and sometimes the fraud is actually the fault of the Dept for not being thorough enough in its investigations into claims. The vast majority of claimants have no clue as to their entitlements and may assume that small time buying and selling on Donedeal etc, doing little paid handyman jobs around the area was not going to be taken into account. It is. Couples living together also quite innocently assume that their OHs income was neither here nor there in their claim. It is. Sadly for the claimant, if there is an overpayment then mostly the claimant has to pay it back. That’s why inspectors are so rigorous. What’s ridiculous to you is actually protecting you in the end.

splinter65 wrote:

SW fraud is a huge problem and sometimes the fraud is actually the fault of the Dept for not being thorough enough in its investigations into claims. The vast majority of claimants have no clue as to their entitlements and may assume that small time buying and selling on Donedeal etc, doing little paid handyman jobs around the area was not going to be taken into account. It is. Couples living together also quite innocently assume that their OHs income was neither here nor there in their claim. It is. Sadly for the claimant, if there is an overpayment then mostly the claimant has to pay it back. That’s why inspectors are so rigorous. What’s ridiculous to you is actually protecting you in the end.

They aren't catching much fraud, because that myth was debunked a few months ago with Leo's campaign. I'm aware that doing work of any sort is not allowed - every person collecting money knows that.

The S.W. are a terribly unhelpful Dept. in my experience of them. No knowledge of their own rules & when it is questioned they have even less interest.

elperello

I had a closer look at that link and it appears that the powers to obtain information from financial institutions are limited by -

17 SS 2
...reasonable grounds to believe there has contravention of this act by a claimant or beneficiary.

17 SS 6

...where an authorised officer serves a notice under SS 2 they shall give claimant or beneficiary concerned a copy of the notice.

So it seems DSP don't have a blanket right to look into any claimants bank accounts.

Maybe the OP could clarify how the DSP official handled their particular case and how they knew which institutions to approach?

I have no expertise in SW legislation and would welcome any comment.

Balagan

trixiebust wrote: »

They aren't catching much fraud, because that myth was debunked a few months ago with Leo's campaign. I'm aware that doing work of any sort is not allowed - every person collecting money knows that.

The S.W. are a terribly unhelpful Dept. in my experience of them. No knowledge of their own rules & when it is questioned they have even less interest.

As you've applied for Disability Allowance, you may be interested in this link setting out the situation with regard to work and earnings allowed while on DA and the eligibility factors.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/social_welfare_payments_and_work/disability_payments_and_work.html Citizens Information, both the offices and the website, provides very helpful and relevant information.