Six cylinder petrol BMW hunt. Help me cast my net.

milltown

Ownership of an F10 520d for a year has pretty much confirmed what I suspected all along, before I bought onto the diesel bandwagon:

That I don't do the amount or type of driving to fully benefit from diesel economies. Fuel economy isn't leagues ahead of petrol and my EGR valve needs to be taken out and cleaned soon.

And

I'm too much of a petrolhead for a 4 cylinder oil burner to be a replacement for a 6 cylinder petrol engine.

So...

I'll shortly be in the market for a 325i. Not too fussed about the year once it's post '08. Spec and condition are more important for me. Has to be auto and has to have xenons and leather at a minimum. 2012/13 is probably the upper end of the search. The real kicker is, I'm looking for a saloon though.
They all seem to be 205bhp but I haven't figured out why some seem to hit the magic 170 mark for CO2, for €570 tax, whereas some nudge just over into the €750 bracket.

Barring a miracle, I'll be off to the UK to purchase. I'm watching Autotrader and Pistonheads. Are there any other sites I should be keeping an eye on?

bazz26

The lower co2 models are probably the newer 3.0 litre that replaced the older 2.5 litre engine in late 2007. 2012/2013 would be the change over to the newer F30 model and I don't think I've ever seen a seen a 6 cylinder petrol F30 for sale in Ireland. Even the F30 328i/330i were 2.0 litre 4 cylinder, you have to go to the 335i/340i for a 6 cylinder F30.

I'd say the UK is best choice in those.

Leonard Hofstadter

Good luck trying to find an F30 335i in the UK, I could count on one hand the number of times I've seen one unfortunately.

There should be a few E90 325is and 330is around, though - these are also special being the last ever naturally aspirated straight six petrols BMW ever made.

Autos are higher on tax than manuals, from memory a manual 325i is 170 g/km so just scrapes into the lower tax (and VRT) band.

I wouldn't completely discount a manual either; I can't speak for the E90s but with the E46s there is a lovely gearbox buried underneath the clutch delay valve! Remove it (10 minute job max at a garage) and it transforms the gearbox; much smoother takeoffs (because the clutch bites and disengages when you want it to not up to half a second later) and gearchanges are much sweeter, especially first to second. The notchiness disappears as well.

I found the automatic in the E46 to be worse than useless (even with the clutch delay valve, the manual is miles better in them) but I completely accept that things have moved on a lot since that car was made.

tedpan

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710130243953?search-target=usedcars&maximum-badge-engine-size=3.0&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2011&postcode=hp30bu&sort=atcustom&price-from=500&version=b&fuel-type=Petrol&minimum-badge-engine-size=3.0&model=3%20SERIES&page=6&make=BMW&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New

tedpan

There are a few more on autotrader, that one above is in the north. The jump to the latest model is quite significant with the previous 325/335i 3.0l petrols around 10-12k GBP for a 2010.

Here's another sweet one in England

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710120209258?search-target=usedcars&maximum-badge-engine-size=3.0&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2011&postcode=hp30bu&sort=atcustom&price-from=500&version=b&fuel-type=Petrol&minimum-badge-engine-size=3.0&model=3%20SERIES&page=6&make=BMW&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New

tedpan

This looks nicely priced..

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201705095267675?search-target=usedcars&maximum-badge-engine-size=3.0&advertising-location=at_cars&year-from=2008&postcode=hp30bu&body-type=Saloon&sort=atcustom&price-from=500&version=b&fuel-type=Petrol&minimum-badge-engine-size=3.0&model=3%20SERIES&page=2&make=BMW&year-to=2011&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New

tedpan

tedpan wrote:

This looks nicely priced..

Sorry, not leather. Have a look on autotrader, there's quite a few 3.0 3 series available..

bazz26

The F30 is a good step up from the E90 in terms of refinement and packaging imo.

unkel

Thank the Lord of Petrol that you have seen the light! I was a bit shocked when I saw you in the 4 pot diesel tbh

F30 - don't know too much about these. Hopefully you will find one in the UK

F10 - forget about it. I tried it myself and for all the months I was looking, there was not a single F10 petrol for sale in Ireland. And the ones from the UK were not on the VRT calculator, so a huge risk bringing one in and facing an unknown VRT bill. I went EV instead (and still have a petrol 6-pot Porsche and a petrol 6-pot Mercedes )

Before you bring a car in from the UK, try and get a written VRT quote from the NCTS if your car is not on the calculator...

tedpan

unkel wrote:

F10 - forget about it. I tried it myself and for all the months I was looking, there was not a single F10 petrol for sale in Ireland. And the ones from the UK were not on the VRT calculator, so a huge risk bringing one in and facing an unknown VRT bill. I went EV instead (and still have a petrol 6-pot Porsche and a petrol 6-pot Mercedes )

What Porsche are you driving? My dad had a 928 when I was a kid. Loved that car

unkel

I used to have a 928

Had to give it up during the recession though, which was sad. It was my dream car when I was a boy. Now I have a Boxster 986

commited

I recently had the same epiphany, changing from a Mercedes 5 pot diesel (which I'd always wanted to own) back to what I know - 6 pot BMW petrols. I was pretty fixated on trying to get a 2008+ petrol 3.0 5 series as I wanted the cheaper tax (and I felt the 523i was too slow). In the end after doing a lot of sums and research, I bought a late-2007 BMW 530i LCI which was way below my budget and it is a brilliant car. Tax is €750 more per year but the difference in purchase price means I could run it for 6 years and still be in a better position financially vs a 2008 car. MPG wise, I've averaged a bit over 30mpg which is great for 272bhp on tap. I've seen 37MPG on long runs.

I had an e92 a couple of years ago and I'd suggest that an E90 would be a big step back in refinement from your f10, an f30 less so but still noticeable. Best compromise here is an E60, I hated them for years but the LCI is a much better car and I was surprised how much I like mine having been the biggest E39 fanboy in the world! I tried a couple of diesel f10s also and while the infotainment etc is an improvement I felt the fit, finish, drive and feeling was better on the E60. N53 engine has a lot of horror stories but most issues are well known know and parts are getting cheaper. Xenons are easily retrofit-able on the E60 as they come with projector headlights as standard. The NBT infotainment system from the f10 is also retrofit-able into the E60.

This has "big" tax but is a real bargain imho:
2007 LCI 525i auto, 92k miles, €3750
https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-525i-se-auto-grey-met-cream-leather/16276355

I was shocked when I saw this come to the market, a very low mileage Irish 3.0 petrol on the new tax system. Has comfort seats which are lovely too. It's very expensive when compared to the 2007 cars however:
2008 530i auto, 45k kms, €10,995
https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-5-series-auto-se/16930423

2010 523i auto, 82k miles, €15,999
https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/bmw/5-series/used-2010-bmw-5-series-523i-f-dublin-fpa-95876905294190

UK options:
I personally think the e60 above is better value considering the mileage etc.
E60: 2008 530i auto, 100k miles ~€7,400 + €2151 VRT = €9,500
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710180411021

F10s are an option too if you like them and most are available on VRT calculator.
F10: 2010 523i auto, 89k miles, €9600 + 3700 VRT = €13,300
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201708228570695

commited

If you test drive an e90 and still feels it fits the bill, this looks like a great buy. €570 tax, decent mileage & colour and spec includes pro-CIC navigation, adaptive Xenon headlights, leather heated sport seats, folding seats, steering wheel heater, auto with shift paddles, folding mirrors, upgraded alloys, upgraded wood, high beam assist - huge spec for a 325i, must have been a demo.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710059990629
~€6800 + €2475 VRT = ~€9300

An Ard Ri

I picked up a 2010 E92 330 last year in the UK. Got it from a main dealer with 12k miles. It is very well specced.

As far as i can remember all auto 325/330 are €750 to tax and the manuals are one bracket below.

VRT was expensive last year, but it can be appealed. I got €500 off mine.

There as not as many 325/330 for sale in the Uk as you would think. I found mine on Pistonheads and paid a deposit the day it came up for sale.

My advice would be to buy from a main dealer, as the AUC warranty is covered in Ireland. I had something done on mine and it was done by Frank Keane's with no hassle. Obviously you will pay extra for a main dealer car. Buy as low milage as you can. Nearly all dealers will send you over a video of the car.

They are very nice cars and very rare in Ireland in petrol form.

milltown

commited wrote: »

If you test drive an e90 and still feels it fits the bill, this looks like a great buy. €570 tax, decent mileage & colour and spec includes pro-CIC navigation, adaptive Xenon headlights, leather heated sport seats, folding seats, steering wheel heater, auto with shift paddles, folding mirrors, upgraded alloys, upgraded wood, high beam assist - huge spec for a 325i, must have been a demo.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201710059990629
~€6800 + €2475 VRT = ~€9300

That one you describe sounds like exactly what I'm after. Your spec sounds a lot more juicy than what's in the ad though. Where are you seeing adaptive xenons, heated steering wheel, high beam assist etc.?

milltown

An Ard Ri wrote: »

As far as i can remember all auto 325/330 are €750 to tax and the manuals are one bracket below.

From what I can see, most 325i autos are listed as 170g CO2, with only the odd one showing as 174. I'm not sure why that is. Obviously I'll be making absolutely sure before I pull any triggers though.

I held on to my 6 cylinder petrol E46 for over ten years. It was exactly what I wanted and owed me nothing. I'd like to think I could buy the right car again and hold on for a similar stretch. I don't feel any compulsion to change cars based on age or mileage. Pity the E90s aren't as classy a design as the E46s though.

commited

milltown wrote: »

That one you describe sounds like exactly what I'm after. Your spec sounds a lot more juicy than what's in the ad though. Where are you seeing adaptive xenons, heated steering wheel, high beam assist etc.?

I was feeling generous and ran a vin check

VIN WBAPH32060A506106
Type Code PH32
E Series E90 (MUE)
Series 3
Type LIM
Steering RL
Doors 4
Engine N53
Displacement 3.00
Power 160
Drive HECK
Transmission AUT
Colour SPACEGRAU METALLIC (A52)
Upholstery LEDER DAKOTA/SCHWARZ (LCSW)
Prod. Date 2009-03-20
L812A National version England / Ireland
S1CAA Selection of COP relevant vehicles
S1CBA CO2 package
S1CDA Brake Energy Regeneration
S205A Automatic transmission
S230A Extra package, EU-specific
S248A Steering wheel heater
S258A Tire with run-flat functionality
S2PAA Wheel bolt retainer
S2S1A BMW LA wheel, star spoke 286
S2XAA Sport steering wheel with shift paddles
S302A Alarm system
S313A Fold-in outside mirror
S321A Exterior parts in vehicle color
S423A Floor mats, velours
S428A Warning triangle and first aid kit
S431A Interior mirror with automatic-dip
S441A Smoker package
S465A Through-loading system
S470A Isofix-System
S481A Sports seat
S494A Seat heating driver/passenger
S497A Centre armrest, rear
S502A Headlight cleaning system
S508A Park Distance Control (PDC)
S521A Rain sensor
S522A Xenon Light
S524A Adaptive Headlights
S534A Automatic air conditioning
S544A Cruise control with brake function
S563A Light package
S5ACA High-beam assistant
S5DCA Rear-seat headrests, folding
S609A Navigation system Professional
S694A Provisions for BMW 6 CD changer
S698A Area-Code 2 for DVD
S850A Dummy-SALAPA
S853A Language version English
S863A Retailer Directory Europe
S877A Delete cross-pattern operation
S880A On-board vehicle literature English
S8S2A Coding alarm signal
S8S3A Automatic locking when driving off
S8SCA Telematics access request,country-spec.
S8SMA Car ident. number visible from outside
S8SPA Control unit COP
SXE2A Indi. fine wood quilted maple anthracite

I've only ever seen specs like that on 335i, so I imagine it will go quickly. Only thing it's missing that I'd want is Lumbar support.
Incidentally, my 335i was the best car I ever owned, apart from the ride quality. Make sure that you're happy with E90 refinement as it may be a big disappointment after your F10. As I said in my post, I wouldn't rule out a nice E60.

Idbatterim

if you have to go from the E570 to E750 rate, its not that big a deal for the right car. less so if buying in ireland, if importing from the uk, of course it will effect VRT...

As far as i can remember all auto 325/330 are €750 to tax and the manuals are one bracket below.

I think you are right, depending on the year. If that is the case, I would absolutely then be going for the 330, assuming purchase price is similar to 325...

its not all about price, its about value...

C0N0R

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e60-5-series-03-10/2008-08-bmw-5-series-3-0-530i-m-sport-4dr/7829524#/home

What about this? I will be in the market for something similar myself and this would tick the boxes for me.

Leonard Hofstadter

That looks lovely, the ride could be rather harsh since it's on 19 inch wheels though, especially as it will have run flat tyres as standard. I've 18s on my E46 and no RFTs and I definitely wouldn't want anything harsher over the bumps.

Apart from that it would tick an awful lot of boxes for me at least.

unkel

C0N0R wrote: »

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/e60-5-series-03-10/2008-08-bmw-5-series-3-0-530i-m-sport-4dr/7829524#/home

What about this? I will be in the market for something similar myself and this would tick the boxes for me.

That is a very nice car. How much are they to tax here on the new regime, surely not just €750?

bazz26

captainspeed wrote: »

That looks lovely, the ride could be rather harsh since it's on 19 inch wheels though, especially as it will have run flat tyres as standard. I've 18s on my E46 and no RFTs and I definitely wouldn't want anything harsher over the bumps.

Apart from that it would tick an awful lot of boxes for me at least.

The E60's suspension is a bit more sophisticated than that on the E46. 3rd generation RFT tyres are way more comfortable these days that they used to be a few years ago too.

commited

unkel wrote: »

That is a very nice car. How much are they to tax here on the new regime, surely not just €750?

Yup €750. VRT is €2337, so car is around €10,500 landed.

No need to continue with runflats with that car as it's been specced with a spacesaver, non-runflat ride is much better.

Its a decent spec:
L812A National version England / Ireland
P337A M Sports package
S1CAA Selection of COP relevant vehicles
S1CBA CO2 package
S2NNA BMW alloy wheel, M double spoke 172
S2PAA Wheel bolt retainer
S2TBA Sport automatic transmission
S300A Emergency spare wheel
S302A Alarm system
S354A Green windscreen, green shade band
S403A Glass roof, electrical
S423A Floor mats, velours
S428A Warning triangle and first aid kit
S431A Interior mirror with automatic-dip
S441A Smoker package
S442A Cup holder
S481A Sports seat
S4BYA Real Bamboo wood-grain trim, anthracite
S502A Headlight cleaning system
S508A Park Distance Control (PDC)
S522A Xenon Light
S524A Adaptive Headlights
S534A Automatic air conditioning
S544A Cruise control with brake function
S661A Radio BMW Business (C43)
S672A CD changer for 6 CDs
S698A Area-Code 2 for DVD
S704A M Sports suspension
S710A M leather steering wheel
S715A M Aerodynamics package
S760A High gloss shadow line
S775A Headlining anthracite
S850A Dummy-SALAPA
S853A Language version English
S863A Retailer Directory Europe
S877A Delete cross-pattern operation
S880A On-board vehicle literature English
S8S2A Coding alarm signal
S8S8A Country-specific nav. system supply
S8SAA Navigation access request,country-spec.
S8SMA Car ident. number visible from outside
S8SPA Control unit COP

I still think that '07 E60 petrols are insane value in Ireland though, would need to run the above car for 8+ years to break even vs the 525i linked in first post. Still plenty of go in a 525i!

C0N0R

commited wrote: »

unkel wrote: »

That is a very nice car. How much are they to tax here on the new regime, surely not just €750?

Yup €750. VRT is €2337, so car is around €10,500 landed.

No need to continue with runflats with that car as it's been specced with a spacesaver, non-runflat ride is much better.

Its a decent spec:
L812A National version England / Ireland
P337A M Sports package
S1CAA Selection of COP relevant vehicles
S1CBA CO2 package
S2NNA BMW alloy wheel, M double spoke 172
S2PAA Wheel bolt retainer
S2TBA Sport automatic transmission
S300A Emergency spare wheel
S302A Alarm system
S354A Green windscreen, green shade band
S403A Glass roof, electrical
S423A Floor mats, velours
S428A Warning triangle and first aid kit
S431A Interior mirror with automatic-dip
S441A Smoker package
S442A Cup holder
S481A Sports seat
S4BYA Real Bamboo wood-grain trim, anthracite
S502A Headlight cleaning system
S508A Park Distance Control (PDC)
S522A Xenon Light
S524A Adaptive Headlights
S534A Automatic air conditioning
S544A Cruise control with brake function
S661A Radio BMW Business (C43)
S672A CD changer for 6 CDs
S698A Area-Code 2 for DVD
S704A M Sports suspension
S710A M leather steering wheel
S715A M Aerodynamics package
S760A High gloss shadow line
S775A Headlining anthracite
S850A Dummy-SALAPA
S853A Language version English
S863A Retailer Directory Europe
S877A Delete cross-pattern operation
S880A On-board vehicle literature English
S8S2A Coding alarm signal
S8S8A Country-specific nav. system supply
S8SAA Navigation access request,country-spec.
S8SMA Car ident. number visible from outside
S8SPA Control unit COP

I still think that '07 E60 petrols are insane value in Ireland though, would need to run the above car for 8+ years to break even vs the 525i linked in first post. Still plenty of go in a 525i!

I can't access donedeal, is the 525i in the first post a msport?

The only thing I would fault that 530i on is I'd rather tan leather than black!

Leonard Hofstadter

bazz26 wrote: »

The E60's suspension is a bit more sophisticated than that on the E46. 3rd generation RFT tyres are way more comfortable these days that they used to be a few years ago too.

It's a fair point about the RFTs, nobody complains about them now but there was a huge fuss when the E60 came out about how bad the ride was unless it was in SE spec on 16 inch wheels and no RFTs.

I'm still sceptical that an E60 sport on 19s is going to be any more comfortable than an E46 on 18s though, but the OP should by all means try it, that 530i looks like a lovely car as long as he/she is happy with the ride comfort.

Mr.David

I've had an e90 325i now for 4.5yrs, its the 2.5 and its 2007 so the tax is a bit of a stinger at nearly 1100. Apart from that though its lovely, I understand your desire for an auto but don't rule out the manual it works pretty well with a 6cyl petrol.

Ride is harsh on m sport would be my biggest criticism, mine is on 18 inch alloys and I certainly wouldn't want 19s. Its 10 years old now and still feels tight as a nut, only issues I have had are two coil packs failing (90quid each) and a solenoid requiring cleaning.

I have been meaning to change for a while now but I just don't know what to. Plus the fact that my car is now worth so little due to the tax, it just feels like its worth more to me than the market value given I know the condition, history etc. Decisions, decisions!

Idbatterim

Mr.David wrote: »

I've had an e90 325i now for 4.5yrs, its the 2.5 and its 2007 so the tax is a bit of a stinger at nearly 1100. Apart from that though its lovely, I understand your desire for an auto but don't rule out the manual it works pretty well with a 6cyl petrol.

Ride is harsh on m sport would be my biggest criticism, mine is on 18 inch alloys and I certainly wouldn't want 19s. Its 10 years old now and still feels tight as a nut, only issues I have had are two coil packs failing (90quid each) and a solenoid requiring cleaning.

I have been meaning to change for a while now but I just don't know what to. Plus the fact that my car is now worth so little due to the tax, it just feels like its worth more to me than the market value given I know the condition, history etc. Decisions, decisions!

I'm the same with my e46 325 ci. I see no value in changing. The 2.5 on old system is good balance between power and tax... you're not saving anything by moving to lower tax, or at least break even pont would be many years. That said. Driving anything more than the 2.5 and I probably wouldn't feel that way..