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Fridge freezer issue

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  • 09-09-2017 2:20pm
    #1
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭


    I purchased a branded fridge freezer from a large chain of electrical stores in July of 2015, with a two year warranty. In June of this year the food in the fridge started to freeze.
    I went into the shop where I had purchased, who logged a call with the authorised service agent for the brand in Ireland.
    It was fixed in July (replacement parts fitted). Great! Now, fast forward 8 weeks, and the food in the fridge is freezing again. Not so great!
    I went into the shop, where I was told they would phone the authorised service people again, and she also gave me a phone number to phone the brand directly myself.
    So I phoned, and explained my plight. I was told that my appliance is out of warranty, but she would try to get authorisation to get a "good will" repair on it. I'm a bit concerned that a) this might not happen, or b) if they do come, the issue will continue to recur, and I will have run out of goodwill gestures from the manufacturer.
    I would have thought that because this problem predates the end of the warranty, that it should still be covered, and that they should be obliged to fix it, or replace the appliance, rather than carrying on like they're doing me some huge favour, and expecting me to be grateful.
    I phoned the shop, and while they said that they understand where I'm coming from, I don't think they did really. They said they'd make a few phone calls and see what the story was.

    I'm just looking to arm myself with some knowledge before I hear from anyone again!
    Any insight wise boardsies?


Comments

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    #2
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    Any repair should be permanent, it wasn't so they have to either replace or refund it.

    It's also not up to you to chase anyone, the retailer needs to sort this out ASAP with as little disruption to you as possible and they can forget words like goodwill, it's consumer law that items are fit for the purpose they are sold for and yours wasnt if the food is freezing inside the fridge!

    The cpcc.ie website is the best place for you to get info.


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    #3
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    Any repair should be permanent, it wasn't so they have to either replace or refund it.

    It's also not up to you to chase anyone, the retailer needs to sort this out ASAP with as little disruption to you as possible and they can forget words like goodwill, it's consumer law that items are fit for the purpose they are sold for and yours wasnt if the food is freezing inside the fridge!

    The cpcc.ie website is the best place for you to get info.

    Thanks. That's exactly what I thought. The person I spoke to in the shop was like, what's your problem, they're sending someone, aren't they? Gah! He couldn't grasp why the words "goodwill gesture" were getting my goat.
    It's a massive chain of shops. I don't get how they don't know the process.


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    #4
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    Appliance manufacturers (and many others including cars) use the "goodwill" gesture line to make you think you are getting more than you are entitled to.

    Once they mention the goodwill gesture you can take it that there will be no charge.

    Samsung had such an issue a few years ago and were doing "goodwill" repairs 8 years after the fault appeared.


    Its a temperature control issue which is almost certainly a manufacturing defect and would be covered under the SOG act for a "reasonable life" of the product - for a fridge freezer, this would be 5-6 years.

    Legally its the retailer that is responsible, but usually the direct route is the optimum manner in getting it repaired as it cuts out a layer of contact and is more efficient. It does not absolve the retailer, but does make repairs far quicker.


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    #5
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    Appliance manufacturers (and many others including cars) use the "goodwill" gesture line to make you think you are getting more than you are entitled to.

    Once they mention the goodwill gesture you can take it that there will be no charge.

    Samsung had such an issue a few years ago and were doing "goodwill" repairs 8 years after the fault appeared.


    Its a temperature control issue which is almost certainly a manufacturing defect and would be covered under the SOG act for a "reasonable life" of the product - for a fridge freezer, this would be 5-6 years.

    Legally its the retailer that is responsible, but usually the direct route is the optimum manner in getting it repaired as it cuts out a layer of contact and is more efficient. It does not absolve the retailer, but does make repairs far quicker.

    The problem in my eyes is more that they are talking about a second repair, OP is entitled to a replacement now and should make sure s/he gets one.


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    #6
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Me again! I'll double check this with the cpcc tomorrow (they were very helpful when I phoned) but said I'd ask here now.
    The shop where I bought my fridge initially tried to tell me they "had to proceed with a repair". I told them to send someone to assess but that I would not be accepting another repair, I wanted a replacement.
    The engineer called, and was going to replace the same part as previously, and several other parts also. I declined, as I had said I would. Got a call from the manager today, who reports he has been given the go-ahead to replace.
    Here's my question. He said the fridge I bought is discontinued. My fridge has a water dispenser (not plumbed). I spent €699 on it. They have a different brand with no water dispenser which costs €749. He told me I would have to pay the €50 difference to get this. They also have fridges with water dispensers which are plumbed >€1000- I do not want these, because I couldn't plumb them in, as no water pipes close by.
    He also said they would be getting in one that has a water dispenser (not plumbed) in November, but I didn't enquire re:price, as we kind of need a proper fridge now.

    My questions- if they replace the fridge, do I actually have to pay the €50- I feel this might be incorrect.
    I have seen a fridge with an unplumbed water dispenser elsewhere- can I request a refund and buy this


    I'm generally not an awkward cow, but I really liked having a water dispenser!


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    #7
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    In terms of brand- the €749 fridge is a brand I've never heard of, and probably wouldn't buy if I were buying a new fridge without all these issues.


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    #8
    Melendez
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Melendez


    This post has been deleted.


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    #9
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Melendez wrote: »
    Given that you had two years use of your current fridge the store are entitled to discount the amount your fridge is worth. You are not entitled to a brand new replacement fridge if it stops working after 2 years. The store are going well beyond what they are legally required to do by offering the full value you paid for the fridge against a new fridge.

    Thanks for your input.

    Just said I'd update after talking to the cpcc.
    The store are not going well beyond legal requirements with their offer.

    If I choose to seek a refund, that is my right, and I am entitled to a full refund. The fact that I've had two years use out of the fridge is of no consequence. If I seek a replacement, I shouldn't be out of pocket, but equally, if the replacement cost more than what I paid originally, I would have to pay the balance.


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    #10
    donegal.
    Registered Users Posts: 4,635 ✭✭✭donegal.


    what brand/model was your old one and what are you being offered for €50 more ?


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    #11
    Xterminator
    Registered Users Posts: 4,718 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    jlm29 wrote: »
    If I choose to seek a refund, that is my right, and I am entitled to a full refund. The fact that I've had two years use out of the fridge is of no consequence. .

    Hi Jim. you are factually incorrect.

    1st mistake. you have a right to repair(permanent) replace or refund. if the store offers a replacement and you turn it down you could lose in court if you refused a reasonable offer. So there is no automatic right to a refund. Factually incorrect.

    2nd mistake - any refund would be automatically subject to depreciation. Again that's not my opinion, its fact. if you get 2 years from an appliance and award will be of the value of a 2 year old appliance not a new one.

    It sounds to me like you have a good case here, but your hand is stronger if you understand the rights you have.


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    #12
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Xterminator wrote: »
    Hi Jim. you are factually incorrect.

    1st mistake. you have a right to repair(permanent) replace or refund. if the store offers a replacement and you turn it down you could lose in court if you refused a reasonable offer. So there is no automatic right to a refund. Factually incorrect.

    2nd mistake - any refund would be automatically subject to depreciation. Again that's not my opinion, its fact. if you get 2 years from an appliance and award will be of the value of a 2 year old appliance not a new one.

    It sounds to me like you have a good case here, but your hand is stronger if you understand the rights you have.

    If this is the case, I've been misinformed by the cpcc. It doesn't really matter. I will probably, for convenience accept the replacement, and pay the balance.

    The fridge I have currently is a Samsung. The replacement I have been offered is a powerpoint, I think. It's not on their website, and I haven't been into the shop to check it out yet. I'm a bit wary of a brand I've never heard of. Although it's not like buying a reputable brand was much advantage to me the first time!


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    #13
    donegal.
    Registered Users Posts: 4,635 ✭✭✭donegal.


    powerpoint would be on the budget end . But I don't think they do fridges with water dispensers.


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    #14
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    donegal. wrote: »
    powerpoint would be on the budget end . But I don't think they do fridges with water dispensers.

    They don't. Which is my issue. I want a water dispenser. That's why I bought the fridge I bought in the first place, and am considering asking for a refund. They don't have any fridges with water dispensers currently.


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    #15
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    donegal. wrote: »
    powerpoint would be on the budget end . But I don't think they do fridges with water dispensers.

    They don't. Which is my issue. I want a water dispenser. That's why I bought the fridge I bought in the first place, and am considering asking for a refund. They don't have any fridges with water dispensers currently.


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    #16
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    jlm29 wrote: »
    Thanks for your input.

    Just said I'd update after talking to the cpcc.
    The store are not going well beyond legal requirements with their offer.

    If I choose to seek a refund, that is my right, and I am entitled to a full refund. The fact that I've had two years use out of the fridge is of no consequence. If I seek a replacement, I shouldn't be out of pocket, but equally, if the replacement cost more than what I paid originally, I would have to pay the balance.

    You aren't entitled to a refund.

    The shop has the right to offer a replacement, refund or repair. You can't demand a refund.


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    #17
    F34
    Registered Users Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭F34


    They are leading you on a merry dance here I think you would be pushed to find a PowerPoint fridge/freezer at that price as already mentioned they are very much a budget brand.


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    #18
    Melendez
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Melendez


    This post has been deleted.


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    #19
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Melendez wrote: »
    I'm not finding any €700 Powerpoint fridge freezers. Do you have a model number?

    No. I didn't ask, just said I'd go into the shop as soon as I get a chance to.


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    #20
    Melendez
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Melendez


    This post has been deleted.


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    #21
    donegal.
    Registered Users Posts: 4,635 ✭✭✭donegal.


    jlm29 wrote: »
    They don't have any fridges with water dispensers currently.


    I don't see why their current stock would be of any relevance.
    I sell fridge freezers and if a customer wanted a particular model I would just add it to my next delivery.
    If it was from a distributor that I wasn't due a delivery from for a while I'd simple order the single machine but it would cost about €20 more for the courier. max wait 2/3 days.


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    #22
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    donegal. wrote: »
    I don't see why their current stock would be of any relevance.
    I sell fridge freezers and if a customer wanted a particular model I would just add it to my next delivery.
    If it was from a distributor that I wasn't due a delivery from for a while I'd simple order the single machine but it would cost about €20 more for the courier. max wait 2/3 days.

    The store manager told me that the one I have is end of line. He said that they would have one in on November 10th. Other retailers have one similar to what is broken (with water dispenser) for a similar price point, which is why I was wondering about getting a refund, and purchasing elsewhere. There was no mention of ordering anything in.

    Does anyone have a link to some document that outlines my consumer rights in this situation. As previously mentioned, I checked with the cpcc, but either the information the man I spoke to was incorrect, or the info on this thread is. I don't want anything I'm not entitled to, and I don't want to be awkward, but I would like to know what I'm talking about when I'm again speaking to the store manager


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    #23
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    jlm29 wrote: »
    The store manager told me that the one I have is end of line. He said that they would have one in on November 10th. Other retailers have one similar to what is broken (with water dispenser) for a similar price point, which is why I was wondering about getting a refund, and purchasing elsewhere. There was no mention of ordering anything in.

    Does anyone have a link to some document that outlines my consumer rights in this situation. As previously mentioned, I checked with the cpcc, but either the information the man I spoke to was incorrect, or the info on this thread is. I don't want anything I'm not entitled to, and I don't want to be awkward, but I would like to know what I'm talking about when I'm again speaking to the store manager

    The cpcc.ie are correct.


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    #24
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    Just to update, I called into the shop today. Initially I was offered store credit towards a replacement, but when I asked them to double check, they contacted someone in head office who agreed that I am entitled to a full refund.


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    #25
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    jlm29 wrote: »
    Just to update, I called into the shop today. Initially I was offered store credit towards a replacement, but when I asked them to double check, they contacted someone in head office who agreed that I am entitled to a full refund.

    That's fantastic so glad you got it sorted in the end!!


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    #26
    Xterminator
    Registered Users Posts: 4,718 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    that's great. shows a little perseverance can really pay off.


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    #27
    jlm29
    Registered Users Posts: 3,818 ✭✭✭jlm29


    I was more than happy to take a replacement, only they had nothing in a similar price range, other than the power point one. The selection was poor- I'd have had to pay at least €800 to get something other than that, because we can't plumb ours in.
    I'll be glad to be able to do a full shop again without worrying that I'll come back and find all my meet frozen


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