nozzle size Euroflame outdoor boiler

Andy From Sligo

I was giving our oil boiler (euroflame 70-90 condensing) a good clean out a couple of days ago - took the baffles out and brushed off the soot, took the tuberlators or whatever they are called and brushed the soot off them, took out the RDB 2.2 burner, took off the blast tube and cleaned soot off that, brushed soot off jet and electrodes.

Got myself a magnifying glass and noted down the nozzle fitted - it was a Danfoss 60's KG/H2.37

On looking at the specs of the boiler it can take 3 different nozzles

0.60/80EH -
0.65/80EH -
0.75/80EH

With the factory fitted default one being 0.65/80EH - so I am just wondering why the installer when he installed the boiler would have taken out the 80'EH nozzle and replaced it with a 60's Nozzle?

That would have a different spray pattern and different heat output wouldnt it?

Looking at the spec sheet I cannot find any model in the Euroflame boiler using a 60's nozzle.

Can anyone advise please?

Andy From Sligo

always the way isnt it, after posting the question I found a PDF on the internet explaining about Danfoss Nozzles
http://heating.danfoss.com/PCMPDF/DKBGPG060A802.pdf

So, if I have understood it right 60 denotes its a longer reach spray pattern than the 80 , but 80 is wider spray pattern than 60

The s & h stamped on the nozzle denotes the kind of spray it gives out

Am still yet to find out what the 'E' stands for in a 80'EH

Still at a loss why the installer has put a 60's nozzle in it instead of the 80'EH nozzle though - why that on our particular installation?

jca

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

always the way isnt it, after posting the question I found a PDF on the internet explaining about Danfoss Nozzles
http://heating.danfoss.com/PCMPDF/DKBGPG060A802.pdf

So, if I have understood it right 60 denotes its a longer reach spray pattern than the 80 , but 80 is wider spray pattern than 60

The s & h stamped on the nozzle denotes the kind of spray it gives out

Am still yet to find out what the 'E' stands for in a 80'EH

Still at a loss why the installer has put a 60's nozzle in it instead of the 80'EH nozzle though - why that on our particular installation?

EH= Extra Hollow.
S= solid.
It's the shape of the flame.

Andy From Sligo

jca wrote: »

EH= Extra Hollow.
S= solid.
It's the shape of the flame.

ah right thank you

EHP

Andy From Sligo wrote:

Still at a loss why the installer has put a 60's nozzle in it instead of the 80'EH nozzle though - why that on our particular installation?

Is it the same nozzle since day one or have you had others service the boiler before. Many so called service guys will put whatever nozzle they have in. EH nozzles can be harder to get.

K.Flyer

Now after all of that, you need to be able to check the fuel pump pressure and carry out a combustion analysis amongst other things while you're there.

Andy From Sligo

EHP wrote: »

Is it the same nozzle since day one or have you had others service the boiler before. Many so called service guys will put whatever nozzle they have in. EH nozzles can be harder to get.

thanks, for day one we moved in dec 2017 and the boiler was never turned on (only to set it up / tune it up / commission it I suppose)

Ah right, harder to get I see. But Grant would have (should have) supplied the 80'EH as default from the factory, so I was just wondering why the installer would have thought the need to change the nozzle... unless he couldnt get the parameters of mixture right maybe, and thats why maybe he changed it , or as you say he only had a ES nozzle in his kit

Tom44

Good service engineers fit the appropriate size nozzle for the size of house, mainly going by their experience + what they have in stock.
A larger nozzle at a lower pressure can have the same output as a smaller nozzle at higher pressure, so basically you leave it up to the service engineer.
Andy, you should NEVER have soot in a boiler if it's running correctly :eek:
.6 = .6 of a US Gallon per hour, and so on.
80° = Angle of flame / spray. (Some are 60°, but rare)
H = hollow flame (cone shape)
S = solid cone shape flame

E is just a slightly better nozzle type for kero, but I wouldn't loose sleep over it.

Andy From Sligo

Tom44 wrote: »

Good service engineers fit the appropriate size nozzle for the size of house, mainly going by their experience + what they have in stock.
A larger nozzle at a lower pressure can have the same output as a smaller nozzle at higher pressure, so basically you leave it up to the service engineer.
Andy, you should NEVER have soot in a boiler if it's running correctly :eek:
.6 = .6 of a US Gallon per hour, and so on.
80° = Angle of flame / spray. (Some are 60°, but rare)
H = hollow flame (cone shape)
S = solid cone shape flame

E is just a slightly better nozzle type for kero, but I wouldn't loose sleep over it.

Thanks for the reply Tom - not caked in soot (well its only been in operation for 9 months from new) but enough where I brushed it off with a clean dry paint brush and hoovered it up

So, if it had a 80'EH fitted in the burner from the factory, I am still trying to get my head around why he would whip it out and put the 60'S in its place, maybe as you say he must have deemed the 60'S was more suited to the house .. or only other thing I can think is maybe the supplied 80EH was maybe blocked or faulty?

When I come to get it serviced in the future is it worth telling the man that calls out that it has a different nozzle in it or will he realize himself? - Do boiler engineers still change the nozzle as part of the yearly service these days?

EHP

Andy From Sligo wrote:

When I come to get it serviced in the future is it worth telling the man that calls out that it has a different nozzle in it or will he realize himself? - Do boiler engineers still change the nozzle as part of the yearly service these days?

Any good service guy will know the correct nozzle and never go on the one in the burner. I would change the nozzle every year and if its my first time serviceing it i change the oil hose, on a boiler I do every year I change the oil hose every second year.

Andy From Sligo

EHP wrote: »

Any good service guy will know the correct nozzle and never go on the one in the burner. I would change the nozzle every year and if its my first time serviceing it i change the oil hose, on a boiler I do every year I change the oil hose every second year.

i have 2 hoses on mine cause it has a tigerloop - when they fail do they normally just normally weep, or do they split right open?

EHP

Andy From Sligo wrote:

i have 2 hoses on mine cause it has a tigerloop - when they fail do they normally just normally weep, or do they split right open?

Very rarely split just tend to weep. I think most manufacturers recommend changing every year.

jimf

andy please dismantle the microwave they are far more complicated and tom knows them like the back of his hand he should as he told me every dinner in his house comes from one


but anyway as you asked for some reason or other that is not the factory fitted nozzle

and as you know at this stage soot in an oil boiler is technically fuel that has not vapourised/atomised properly for whatever reason

so im afraid its time for the man with all the gear to set it up properly

Andy From Sligo

i have been trying to convert KG/H2.37 to US/ G/h to see if its 0.60 or 0.65 or 0.75 but i am not having much luck converting it

KG/H2.37 seems to equate to 2370 G/hr when I do it

Andy From Sligo

according to the spec sheet if it was the factory fitted nozzle in the burner it should be:

22.7kw - 77,500BTU - 0.65 80'EH - 8.5 bar pressure - 1.95kg/h Nozzle

But the Burner is currently fitted with:

60'S - 2.37Kg/h Nozzle

Andy From Sligo

jimf wrote: »

andy please dismantle the microwave they are far more complicated and tom knows them like the back of his hand he should as he told me every dinner in his house comes from one


but anyway as you asked for some reason or other that is not the factory fitted nozzle

and as you know at this stage soot in an oil boiler is technically fuel that has not vapourised/atomised properly for whatever reason

so im afraid its time for the man with all the gear to set it up properly

Haha hello Jim - I wondered how long it would take you to answer

Well, you know me by now - I cannot un-see what I have seen, so when the Grant Euroflame tech documents say a 60's Nozzle should be fitted in there and I see a 80'EH Nozzle fitted in its place then I wont be able to sleep soundly until this is corrected or I am satisfied as to reason why the installer decided to fit (what I see) a completely different Nozzle

jimf

andy oil boilers are not rocket science at the end of the day

most boilers that I know of come with 3 different out puts from the same boiler at preset settings recommended by the manf this to include nozzle size and pump pressure these are then set up on site location remember the same boiler 2 doors away could have a different damper setting to achive the same fga readings

as boiler service engineers we determine the nozzle that should be in situ for a particular boiler anybody worth his salt will either know or have access to it in his van or if all that fails grant in particular have a little label attached with this info

it gives us a starting point to start setting up your boiler nothing more if the recommended nozzle isn't in a boiler the biggest danger is the cowboys just replace like with like correct or not

now in off to dissect the cat his arse is making a funny noise and I need to get to the bottom of it

jimf

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Haha hello Jim - I wondered how long it would take you to answer

Well, you know me by now - I cannot un-see what I have seen, so when the Grant Euroflame tech documents say a 60's Nozzle should be fitted in there and I see a 80'EH Nozzle fitted in its place then I wont be able to sleep soundly until this is corrected or I am satisfied as to reason why the installer decided to fit (what I see) a completely different Nozzle

andy don't ever change I enjoy ur posts :D

Andy From Sligo

I can see I can pick up a standard 80'EH nozzle off ebay for peanuts. If I bought one, then gave it to installer - would he fit it, then adjust oil pressure, and air damper/smoke test and Co2 test or do the installers want to supply their own nozzles normally?

And if they do it (with accepting me supplying nozzle) how much should I be realistically looking at charge? - I know you cannot be precise because I suppose different engineers across the country charge different prices, but what could we be talking? 40/50eur maybe for callout and do that? - no cleaning out boiler, no replacing flexible hoses - just fit supplied nozzle and tune/set up the boiler - or is 40/50eur being unrealistic?

I reckon I could even be competent enough to fit the correct nozzle myself to save installers time (and save me money) if needs be

Andy From Sligo

jimf wrote: »

andy oil boilers are not rocket science at the end of the day

most boilers that I know of come with 3 different out puts from the same boiler at preset settings recommended by the manf this to include nozzle size and pump pressure these are then set up on site location remember the same boiler 2 doors away could have a different damper setting to achive the same fga readings

as boiler service engineers we determine the nozzle that should be in situ for a particular boiler anybody worth his salt will either know or have access to it in his van or if all that fails grant in particular have a little label attached with this info

it gives us a starting point to start setting up your boiler nothing more if the recommended nozzle isn't in a boiler the biggest danger is the cowboys just replace like with like correct or not

now in off to dissect the cat his arse is making a funny noise and I need to get to the bottom of it

- you need a Vet .. we have a great one in Sligo

jimf

no no no no and no again

im only speaking from been a grumpy old ballcocks as im sure plenty on here will testify

we need to check baffle position door seal integrity overall condition of boiler external/internal do you see where im coming from

turbulators have to be fitted in the vertical format as per manf ins

so 80/100 eu would be more realistic price wise


unless ur in cork where dick tom turpin operates now theres a 50 pager

Andy From Sligo

jimf wrote: »

no no no no and no again

im only speaking from been a grumpy old ballcocks as im sure plenty on here will testify

we need to check baffle position door seal integrity overall condition of boiler external/internal do you see where im coming from

turbulators have to be fitted in the vertical format as per manf ins

so 80/100 eu would be more realistic price wise


unless ur in cork where dick tom turpin operates now theres a 50 pager

ah right - it was worth a punt

I made sure I put baffles back correctly and turbulators vertical , boiler hasnt even been used a year - yeah i see where your coming from .. installers have to put bread on the table and diesel for their van.

I better start saving up. I gotta get this bloody thing tuned up right this winter once an for all, been putting it on long finger for long enough

jimf

if you bring it to limerick I will do it for you foc

haha

Andy From Sligo

jimf wrote: »

if you bring it to limerick I will do it for you foc

haha

good man yerself - I will load it on the trailer tomorrow. Is the atmospheric temperature different down there different to Sligo? - dont want you setting it up down there to find I get it back to Sligo and its all out of kilter again

do you want me to bring down the kerosene tank too?

jimf

off course bring your own oil were a tight shower down this side

Tom44

Andy
If house is rented, landlord is responsible for annual servicing.

Andy From Sligo

Tom44 wrote: »

Andy
If house is rented, landlord is responsible for annual servicing.

Its a council house, and apparently the owner is responsible for it - I think if its like in the winter and it packs up altogether and you havent got any heating in the house at all they will send out one of their chaps. This is what one of the neighbours told me anyway.

Her oil pump packed up in the middle of the winter and had 5 people in the house and no heating, her immersion wasnt working as well so she had no hot water and someone came out from the council to fit one , but he was telling her that she should have had it serviced and that it was her responsibility. Its because its an outdoor boiler as well. - I think I heard that if its an Inside boiler or an inside range its a different story , I think then they will service because its inside the house.

Andy From Sligo

according to the danfoss nozzle literature it reads

Note!
Regarding the choice of spray angle and pattern; when there is no
information available it is best to start with a nozzle having a 60° spray
angle of pattern S.

So maybe this is why the installer originally chose a 60°S nozzle, because he didnt have no information available?