To wean or not to wean

grassroot1

Hi all a question for debate, I have weaned my calves before sale for the last few years. I take the drop in performance, loss of weight and loss of bloom. I am being paid no more for weaned weanlings (a good deal less to be fair) than the animals taken off the cow and into the mart. Why should I bother?

cacs

grassroot1 wrote: »

Hi all a question for debate, I have weaned my calves before sale for the last few years. I take the drop in performance, loss of weight and loss of bloom. I am being paid no more for weaned weanlings (a good deal less to be fair) than the animals taken off the cow and into the mart. Why should I bother?

100% don't

High bike

cathal irwin wrote: »

100% don't

sure every weanling that goes through the ring is weaned and on meal:rolleyes:

Bullocks

grassroot1 wrote: »

Hi all a question for debate, I have weaned my calves before sale for the last few years. I take the drop in performance, loss of weight and loss of bloom. I am being paid no more for weaned weanlings (a good deal less to be fair) than the animals taken off the cow and into the mart. Why should I bother?

You have it in a nutshell , maybe the exporters keep an eye out for well weaned animals but what I see in the ring if they are bawling or not the buyers like the fresh lads with a bit of bloom on them .
I think its still fair on the animal to have them on maybe six weeks of nuts before weaning or at least selling .
I was leafing through the farmers journal beef and sheep and they have a rake of things to get your animal ready for sale , I was nearly waiting for them to ask the producer to throw £100 luck money back to the buyer so he could have more success in his end

sandydan

have 10 cows with March lim x bull calves . housed 4 weeks ago while neighbour was on night shift, gave up after day six, nearly gave me tinitus in right ear all the bawlin,
Anyways they all ate nuts by end of week and will spend next week inside again just to remind how , as some have forgotten , cows reddened half acre of ground trying to find out if fence was off, so after that it may be sale time and barley straw only for cows for 2 weeks

sonnybill

I weaned two Nov born heifers there that I keeping, they ate meal last spring and nothing since ... Straight in, 1/2 bale hay and trough out and they wiring into meal... Not a loo out of them !

It's great to have them eating , I'll have them back out by Monday on bit of meal, cows can be let off as calving again in January !

grassroot1

I did wean all mine after when I weighed them I was disappointed with ADG.
They seem to be doing well now grass is ok and they are on a lick of meal so should be ok for sale in 2 to 3 weeks

bogman_bass

Try weaning them with QuietWean paddles. I've weaned mine with them the past couple of seasons and it's a much better job

blue5000

How much are they;)?

whelan2

blue5000 wrote: »

How much are they;)?

Where could we get them ?

blue5000

There's a boardsie selling them, I think we'll allow him to send you a PM, or he could stick an ad on adverts.ie and link it here.

Water John

Used the paddles last year. Not a peep.
Neighbour used always do very good weanlings. Weaned and eating meals. No more meals, he said, buyers couldn't care less.

squinn2912

What about getting calves to go into a creep gate, forward graze and get a handful of meal, cut them to once a day with the cow for a suck for a week or so and then take them off altogether. We just weaned this week but hadn't a routine like that set up. Lesson learned the noise would deafen you.

Water John

Put on the paddles. Left them just over a week and removed them.

pure breed

bogman_bass wrote:

Try weaning them with QuietWean paddles. I've weaned mine with them the past couple of seasons and it's a much better job

Tried this this summer with Autumn calves and it worked a treat ðŸ‘

RobinBanks

I've been using these for the last few years without issue but this year one calf managed to suck with it on. He figured out how to flip it up over his nose so he could suck.

squinn2912

RobinBanks wrote: »

I've been using these for the last few years without issue but this year one calf managed to suck with it on. He figured out how to flip it up over his nose  so he could suck.

That's impressive! We've never used them. Seems like a fair bit of handling taking them off again afterwards. Are there no issues when you actually separate the calves from the cows? Part of our reasoning for taking them away in one act this year was to reduce the amount of them on fields at one time. They're ploughing it.

patsy_mccabe

In Ennis mart last Tuesday, weanling sale full to hilt with freshly weaned calves. God, the noise would deafing you. I'd safely say at least 80% of them taking off the cow that morning.
I used to wean mine years ago but if anything it ended up costing me money as calves lost that bloom. I still feed them meal though.

Hard Knocks

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

In Ennis mart last Tuesday, weanling sale full to hilt with freshly weaned calves. God, the noise would deafing you. I'd safely say at least 80% of them taking off the cow that morning.
I used to wean mine years ago but if anything it ended up costing me money as calves lost that bloom. I still feed them meal though.

What about cutting down to OAD sucking using the leader system?

patsy_mccabe

Hard Knocks wrote: »

What about cutting down to OAD sucking using the leader system?

Can only do that if I house the cows. Land is fragmented and wet now. Also a lot of of it bounded by deep trenches. Put freshly weaned cows on some land years ago, away from the house and they came through 3 farms on their way home. Never again.

squinn2912

A lot of fellas don't like to admit it on sale day but I'd say 80% is conservative there. Almost all calves weaned that day. Last year we sold weanlings and cut them down to once a day and then weaned them that morning. We used a yard so didn't have to house anything. Surprisingly they were silent that morning in the mart. I'd rather hang on to weanlings and sell them as forward stores but either way I think it's madness not to meal them. Never used the paddles I think it looks like even more work. 
Haha we argued about whether or not to put them straight on the trailer and keep the calves at home and in the end the oul fella won the argument and we let the cows mark up a field across the lane. He was right of course but I'm not telling him that!

kerry cow

I have a few aa bulls and heifers born In Feb March off grass with 2 week on meal all summer indoors on silage and meal .hoping to go to mart 10 days .meaning they are housed almost a month on tmr.
They are grand weanlings but dirty .if I were a buyer I would rather my stock over calves weaned that day .
You'd image you should get a good few Bob extra for it .they can go in to any slatted house and upwards and onwards .???

Water John

If the weanlings are old enough, they kick up little disturbance on being separated, it's the cows do the bawling.

squinn2912

kerry cow wrote: »

I have a few aa bulls and heifers born In Feb March off grass with 2 week on meal all summer indoors on silage and meal .hoping to go to mart 10 days .meaning they are housed almost a month on tmr.
They are grand weanlings but dirty .if I were a buyer I would rather my stock over calves weaned that day .
You'd image you should get a good few Bob extra for it .they can go in to any slatted house and upwards and onwards .???

When did you wean them?

Limestone Cowboy

The auld fella used to put on those anti suckling devices with the spikes for about a week before weaning calves for years which is much the same principle to the paddles i guess. We had a load of them but between getting lost, broken and neighbours borrowing them they disappeared I guess and we stopped doing it, he reckoned it was a lot easier to break the bond when it actually came to weaning after using them. Often seen a cute one flick it up too and stay suckling but the vast majority wont do that.

Hard Knocks

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Can only do that if I house the cows. Land is fragmented and wet now. Also a lot of of it bounded by deep trenches. Put freshly weaned cows on some land years ago, away from the house and they came through 3 farms on their way home. Never again.

Have similar, put all on land beside shed for week, then cows in shed for 4 days on hay, where calves can get access to opposite side but still access to field through yard, day 2 close yard gate, day 3 move calves further from yard on same plot, say 4 move cows.
Have heard lots on about the leader, where they just drop the wire & keep moving the calves further away from the cows each day

Who2

I wean all bulls as they hit the trailer. No point in fooling yourselves thinking lads will pay more, they don't.i vaccinate all my own too but won't the ones that go. I did for long enough and never got any extra.

squinn2912

Who2 wrote: »

I wean all bulls as they hit the trailer. No point in fooling yourselves thinking lads will pay more, they don't.i vaccinate all my own too but won't the ones that go. I did for long enough and never got any extra.

I think you're dead right. We sold weanlings last year and did well but I think there was another 30 quid a beast in them and after that work wondered why bother the dealers don't care much. A big problem is not making a decision stay or go early enough

patsy_mccabe

What would be normal routine for lads buying them? Into shed I suppose, for a few days anyway.

squinn2912

Yea I'd be very surprised if it was anything else. I think even the boys buying autumn weanlings in spring time give them a few days inside to get them settled.

squinn2912

Yea I'd be very surprised if it was anything else. I think even the boys buying autumn weanlings in spring time give them a few days inside to get them settled.

freedominacup

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

What would be normal routine for lads buying them? Into shed I suppose, for a few days anyway.

My neighbour farming directly across the road from us finishes around 120 E/U grading bulls every winter. All gone under 16 months. Buys them in smallish batches, 10-20 at a time. Never any bawling so I assume he's very particular about ensuring as best he can that they are well weaned before he buys. They go out onto fairly strong covers of after grass strip grazed and get meal immediately. He's buying since August. I think he has started to house them this weekend. I think he said to me that his spend from the mart ring to the field was €30/head between haulage and meds. Very particular about the stock he buys and how he manages them. All stock gone by late May most years.

Hard Knocks

freedominacup wrote: »

My neighbour farming directly across the road from us finishes around 120 E/U grading bulls every winter. All gone under 16 months. Buys them in smallish batches, 10-20 at a time. Never any bawling so I assume he's very particular about ensuring as best he can that they are well weaned before he buys. They go out onto fairly strong covers of after grass strip grazed and get meal immediately. He's buying since August. I think he has started to house them this weekend. I think he said to me that his spend from the mart ring to the field was €30/head between haulage and meds. Very particular about the stock he buys and how he manages them. All stock gone by late May most years.

Fair play to him
Would their be any benefit if next summer he contacted some of the owners & forward purchased the weanlings & for €X/Kg they had to be .....

Cavanjack

When buying weanlings here from marts usually buy at least 10 - 20 at a time. It's more the time associated with the mart rather than anything else.
Aim for over 350kg as more chance they are weaned. House them for a few days to settle and outside then, unless it's Nov-march. Everything vaccinated a day or two after arrival.
Lads not weaned are a disaster. They melt and they would melt your head. Usually go for a rougher type of weanling if I can that isn't full of meal.

grange mac

Cavanjack wrote: »

When buying weanlings here from marts usually buy at least 10 - 20 at a time. It's more the time associated with the mart rather than anything else.
Aim for over 350kg as more chance they are weaned. House them for a few days to settle and outside then, unless it's Nov-march. Everything vaccinated a day or two after arrival.
Lads not weaned are a disaster. They melt and they would melt your head. Usually go for a rougher type of weanling if I can that isn't full of meal.

V true...bought "weaned" bulls & bullocks over last few days....Ear muffs required in shed as they will be there for week. Some differences between kenmare macroom & skibb....all depends on who is at ringside

squinn2912

Neighbour of mine turns over a lot of cattle and he talks about the in between one being the best return. Other fellas reckon the reared fresian bullocks are best.
When I look at the work gone into cows I despair. Called into weanling sale and watched around 20 heifers sell for 500 stg at around 240-260 kgs. How on earth does that keep a cow?