Can't get a game

lfc12345

Hi,

So I'm currently playing minor football with a relatively small (20 player) panel
I havent mised training or a game all year. i also have been training eith the intermediate team for two years, even though i still have another year left of minor after this. the most football ive got all year was one half, in which i scored 1-02 from corner forward but i still got subbed at half time.
today was the final straw as i got brought on for 30 seconds at the end of a well lost game. i was very close to telling the manager where to go.
i feel as if i have no option but to leave the panel

what can i do?

dobbs2210

lfc12345 wrote: »

Hi,

So I'm currently playing minor football with a relatively small (20 player) panel
I havent mised training or a game all year. i also have been training eith the intermediate team for two years, even though i still have another year left of minor after this. the most football ive got all year was one half, in which i scored 1-02 from corner forward but i still got subbed at half time.
today was the final straw as i got brought on for 30 seconds at the end of a well lost game. i was very close to telling the manager where to go.
i feel as if i have no option but to leave the panel

what can i do?

I'm 16 years an experienced hurling coach and manager. I feel very sorry for you. I've seen this many times and it upsets me.

You need to go have a conversation with the coach or manager and be straight and honest but no need to have a blazing disagreement.

Outline you've never missed training. You feel that your attitude, effort and commitment has been excellent thus far and that you've work hard enough to deserve more game time and opportunities.

Also a very good question to ask a coach that many coaches struggle with is "what do you recommend I need to do to improve my game or my improve my game time opportunities".

I really root for the real genuinely committed players.

Onky recently I've noticed my local senior team manager has played two different players that are both 2 stone overweight, only started back training recently having failed to turn up at any coaching sessions or games in the past 6 months but they are now both starting on the senior team ahead of guys who bust themselves since last January.

It's an awful thing and sends out the most horrific messages across a squad that guys can come back at the end of July, unfit, overweight and just walk onto a team.

Reflects very badly on my club and even more badly on the bluffer of a manager.

Keep your head up. Keep me posted on how it develops.

Oldtree

Agreed, it's a very bad message, but sadly a common one.

Underage (up to and including minor) gaa is now about player development and retention, not solely "the win" and that comes from hq, but things are slow to change down the line.

I've even seen it at u12 where a player is left on the bench until the last few minutes of a well won game and it drives me bonkers as it just shows how short sighted the manager is, both in team and club terms.

I would encourage you to keep going to training, to keep up your own skills and fitness levels as you clearly have a passion for the sport and it would be a sad day for you to lose that because of poor management.

Some smaller clubs have little choice but to let anyone that volunteers to do the training. But just by volunteering does not mean that the manager is competent.

Should a chat with the manager not improve things, maby an intermediary like the club secretary or CPO could intervene on your behalf.

beauf

If the manager has been there a long time its seems unlikely to change.

nice_guy80

improve your skillset

improve your workrate

get yourself noticed in games

andekwarhola

nice_guy80 wrote: »

get yourself noticed in games

Like scoring 1-02 in a half game?

nice_guy80

andekwarhola wrote: »

Like scoring 1-02 in a half game?

ok. start doing in games at training too.

techdiver

This is what's wrong with sport at youth levels. The over zealous coaches who want a win at all costs mentality. It puts many kids off playing and they could well have grown up to be the next superstars. Kids develop at different ages etc. I remember when I was young it was always the "big/tall lads" who were picked first as they could rule a game due to their size. More often than not their skillset was muck and the smaller player with potential was left to languish on the bench and eventually give up the sport.

Things need to change.

deadybai

I was in a similar situation a few years ago.

I never made the team ever since minor and one year (I think when I was 20 or 21) I said I will put serious effort to try make it . I didn't miss a training session and did my own ball work and gym work almost every day.

Come championship I was in top shape and hurling well in training. Even some of the lads would say to me your flying this year.

Lo and behold a lad comes back from Australia a week before the first round. He hadn't hurled in about 4 years.

Who gets named full forward? Take a guess. In fact the manager actually shuffled the team around so our regular full forward was moved to full back despite playing FF all year.

I wasnt even named on the bench and given a Jersey with no number . I didn't even put it on .

Needless to say we were knocked out .

I never turned up again after that . Didn't even say I was leaving. It's a shame really cause I really miss it

Oh I forgot to mention , the lad that came back was the managers nephew.

Looking back at it now I think that was disgusting. I was very hard on myself at the time thinking I was sh1te.

I was take Dobbs advice though and see from there how you get on.

big_drive

lfc12345 wrote: »

Hi,

So I'm currently playing minor football with a relatively small (20 player) panel
I havent mised training or a game all year. i also have been training eith the intermediate team for two years, even though i still have another year left of minor after this. the most football ive got all year was one half, in which i scored 1-02 from corner forward but i still got subbed at half time.
today was the final straw as i got brought on for 30 seconds at the end of a well lost game. i was very close to telling the manager where to go.
i feel as if i have no option but to leave the panel

what can i do?

How have you been training with the intermediate side if you've still a year minor to go?

If that's the case I'd advise you to stop with that training, stick to minor and u21. If you get an injury you won't be covered. You must be in final year minor to train or play with an adult grade team. Rule changed start of last year

Oldtree

looked it up and you are right

a player who turns 17 during the course of the year is not permitted to play adult football.

LGFA has no such rule and its left to club discretion. Not good imo as that allows for small ladies clubs to play a 12 year old with a birthday before Jan 1st to play minor, or even more worrying a 14 year old to play junior.

bruschi

Oldtree wrote: »

Is that not inter county? I thought as long as you are 16 before Jan 1st you can play as an adult in the GAA, so a minor playing a grade above would be covered by insurance. Junior, intermediate and senior are just rankings.

The general rule I thought applying to 2017 is you can play in one age group above, u16 can play u18 and u18 can play adult.

LGFA has no such rule and its left to club discretion. Not good imo as that allows for small ladies clubs to play a 12 year old with a birthday before Jan 1st to play minor, or even more worrying a 14 year old to play junior.

no, the rule is 17. You can only be in your last year of minor to play adult club level.

Oldtree

bruschi wrote: »

no, the rule is 17. You can only be in your last year of minor to play adult club level.

yes i looked it up and changed my post

Bonniedog

I had opposite problem when I was in early 40s and still playing junior. Still enjoyed training but was slowing down dramatically. However, because I was mates with manager I always started, but almost always got subbed! Became a bit embarrassing so suggested to manager that I be sub rather than starter, which suited everyone!

Anyway, point is that personal ties can often, wrongly, be put ahead of the interests of the team. If you scored 1 - 2 in 30 minutes, you had earned another start.

When involved in underage teams I always made a point of giving as many people as possible decent game time. Nothing more depressing than turning up week after week to stand on the sideline watching others. Especially at underage when game time can dramatically bring players on.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Any politics involved?

I remember getting games for my secondary school when I was 16 or 17 but I didn't even get a jersey half of the time for my local club. I was never a great footballer, but there were lads being subbed on instead of me who had the right surname who couldn't kick a ball out of their way.

Put me off club football a bit.

beauf

Have seen this so often over the years. Happens in do sports and work etc. If you are being overlooked unfairly try be noticed, and if that doesn't work you need to see if you can better elsewhere.

Considering the huge effort and time you are putting into it.

duffman13

This stuff is what put me off the GAA, our local school team came 2nd in the all Ireland and only one of our players was on the panel for the local club. We played them in a friendly (which was effectively trials) we put 25-30 points on them and only one player from our squad was picked for the club side. I hit 3 goals and 4 points in one half and didn't even get a call back, I gave up completely when I left school.

One manager can have an awful effect on a club, honestly if your in an area where there is an alternative club I'd look at jumping ship. Your current club has shown you nothing and you deserve a game.

I think the manager should alway pick the team to win, whether that's the player who trains all year, the brilliant type who may be lazy, the fellow who emigrated and just returned etc. Of course the fellow who trains hard should have a natural fitness advantage, but that doesn't mean he should start. Volunteers who manage an underage side have a thankless task, one where they get a lot of abuse and stick both from players and parents. They have the right to call the shots, it won't please everyone, if they call them wrongly too often it may be time for a change.

Oldtree

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think the manager should alway pick the team to win, whether that's the player who trains all year, the brilliant type who may be lazy, the fellow who emigrated and just returned etc. Of course the fellow who trains hard should have a natural fitness advantage, but that doesn't mean he should start. Volunteers who manage an underage side have a thankless task, one where they get a lot of abuse and stick both from players and parents. They have the right to call the shots, it won't please everyone, if they call them wrongly too often it may be time for a change.

So you think a 12 year old shouldn't get any game time. Completely wrong attitude in you post imo and one the gaa are trying to change for all underage teams. Thus their coach education programs.

jackboy

The GAA is a strange sport at underage. Generally, the trainers will do anything to win. However, who the player's daddy is usually trumps ability.

Dirty Dingus McGee

I gave up paying at junior b level in part because of this.

I'd turn up for training every single night work hard and then in the first round of the championship I started the game but was subbed at half time (despite playing reasonably well) for someone who hadn't appeared up in the football field at all that year.It seriously pissed me off and I had a falling out with a management over it.If it had been one of the other players who were training I could have dealt with it but of course it was one of the old guard that were in with the management that got brought on for me.

What the **** is the point of having training if you don't need to actually go to training.

GAA at club level at all grades should first and foremost be about participation and enjoyment and it is for most people but sadly the way some managers act and the way administrators act (by not having anywhere near as many games as there should be) they seem to be under the illusion that enjoying play the games is not the main reason players are involved in the sport.

The GAA could be so much better an organisation if it copped itself on and realised that participation and enjoyment are what matters most and gear everything in the GAA's ethos at club level towards that.

beauf

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I think the manager should alway pick the team to win, whether that's the player who trains all year, the brilliant type who may be lazy, the fellow who emigrated and just returned etc... .

That's the thinking that has so many leaving sport and managers wondering why they can't get enough players.

Players only get better by playing. Don't play them they don't get better.

beauf

Soccer is even worse for GAA for this. Which partly why soccer is struggling for players and interest. Yet the casual 5 aside is massive.

Considering 99% of players will never be in competitive teams the focus on winning is flawed. If it's an important game ok, but like others I've seen games where the outcome is not in doubt and managers won't play some players.

Regardless of sport or work it is really a personality issue with the manager.

Drumpot

It's sad when you have to explain to people why children and teenagers playing Gaa should be rewarded for training , working hard and primarily trained to enjoy the sport...

Personally, I believe anything under 17 should be about fun and skill, with winning and performing well considered a bonus instead of a primary goal.

I have 3 boys one of which is only 6 and has that drive that coaches love. When his younger and older siblings are having fun in the park he wants to train. He has that (what I imagine) Roy Keane focus that would make him potentially a really good player if I wanted to Tiger Woods dad it and push him on...

But I'm focusing primarily on trying to help him enjoy football. I don't believe it's healthy for children to be manipulated and trained into a competitive drive they do not understand. If I can teach my child to relax his drive he may learned the lessons I didn't when I was his age. I actually had trials for Dublin as a minor but hated the way my anger and drive to win was used to make me a "better" (tougher is a better description) player. I don't blame the coaches because that's what was done back then. But I have personally learned it's not good for all children and as such should not be encouraged.

krazyklown

Really hate seeing this type of player treatment and can sympathise with the op as I have been there. Got dropped for a county semi and a guy who hadn't played the game for about five years was brought on after ten mins. It was deeply hurtful that someone who had made zero contribution to the club could waltz in ahead of guys who not alone have been training all year, but also involved in the running of the club coaching, fund raising, pitch maintenance. I quit after having my say at the club agm.

You are in a very difficult situation - say something and you are moaning, say nothing and nothing changes. If you want something a bit different, if it's really pointless you going to games then I suggest you stop making yourself available for matches. But go really hard in training, like crazy hard. You want to stick it to this so called manager then what you want is him coming to you asking why you aren't going to matches. To get to that you need to be the best trainer, the fittest and hungriest, first up and last to leave and be seen to be absolutely loving it. In my opinion you should stay going with the inters - I know the insurance thing is there, but at least it's another group where you might feel a bit more loved and it would drive home the point with the minors.

lfc12345

Oldtree wrote: »

Agreed, it's a very bad message, but sadly a common one.

Underage (up to and including minor) gaa is now about player development and retention, not solely "the win" and that comes from hq, but things are slow to change down the line.

I've even seen it at u12 where a player is left on the bench until the last few minutes of a well won game and it drives me bonkers as it just shows how short sighted the manager is, both in team and club terms.

I would encourage you to keep going to training, to keep up your own skills and fitness levels as you clearly have a passion for the sport and it would be a sad day for you to lose that because of poor management.

Some smaller clubs have little choice but to let anyone that volunteers to do the training. But just by volunteering does not mean that the manager is competent.

Should a chat with the manager not improve things, maby an intermediary like the club secretary or CPO could intervene on your behalf.

Thanks very much, great advice.

big_drive wrote: »

How have you been training with the intermediate side if you've still a year minor to go?

If that's the case I'd advise you to stop with that training, stick to minor and u21. If you get an injury you won't be covered. You must be in final year minor to train or play with an adult grade team. Rule changed start of last year

As true as that is, I feel i have to train with the inters as if I was training with the minors alone i feel i wouldnt have the hunger to be fit enough to play and that would drive me in the opposite direction

Also we dont have an u21 club

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

Any politics involved?

I remember getting games for my secondary school when I was 16 or 17 but I didn't even get a jersey half of the time for my local club. I was never a great footballer, but there were lads being subbed on instead of me who had the right surname who couldn't kick a ball out of their way.

Put me off club football a bit.

Yeah, the minor team is amalgamated and the gaffer is from the other team, and he knows i have a particular dislike for that team...

krazyklown wrote: »

Really hate seeing this type of player treatment and can sympathise with the op as I have been there. Got dropped for a county semi and a guy who hadn't played the game for about five years was brought on after ten mins. It was deeply hurtful that someone who had made zero contribution to the club could waltz in ahead of guys who not alone have been training all year, but also involved in the running of the club coaching, fund raising, pitch maintenance. I quit after having my say at the club agm.

You are in a very difficult situation - say something and you are moaning, say nothing and nothing changes. If you want something a bit different, if it's really pointless you going to games then I suggest you stop making yourself available for matches. But go really hard in training, like crazy hard. You want to stick it to this so called manager then what you want is him coming to you asking why you aren't going to matches. To get to that you need to be the best trainer, the fittest and hungriest, first up and last to leave and be seen to be absolutely loving it. In my opinion you should stay going with the inters - I know the insurance thing is there, but at least it's another group where you might feel a bit more loved and it would drive home the point with the minors.

Thanks krazyklown, thats actually brilliant advice. Love training with the inters as I actually feel as if its worthwhile. Gonna try this and see how it goes