Advice: dodgy parts of city centre?

Bambi985

Hi all,

First venture into the Dublin forum, go easy on me! :pac:

So I currently live in London and the company I work for is potentially looking to open an office in Dublin in the year ahead. As the token "Irish girl" and a former Dublin-dweller myself, I've been pulled in to steer and advise along the way as we scout out potential locations around the capital. It'd potentially be a 24/7 operation so things like security and safety during the late hours when people are clocking off-shift would be a big concern.

With that in mind, I thought some people here might be able to help me with any potential "red flag" "avoid like the plague" areas around the city centre - streets that you wouldn't walk down at 2am on your own let's say. I have a few ideas but as someone more than 7 years out of the capital I thought I'd lend on the expertise of boards.ie.

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

mookishboy

The dodgy areas are pretty much still the same.

mookishboy

mookishboy wrote: »

The dodgy areas are pretty much still the same.

Yeah. There's nowhere that wasn't dodgy 7 years ago that has now become so. In fact there's probably a few places where the opposite is the case.

I mean we're talking about Dublin here. There are very few no-go areas.

odyssey06

The area that's changing most is the North Docklands \ East Wall... who would have thought Facebook would be putting 600 staff in East Wall?
Or that pubs and greasy spoons would be getting flattened to build more offices along the quays.

Other than that, if you remember the area is dodgy, you are probably right...

Victor

You need to consider a few main points.

Boisterous locations like Temple Bar.

Areas with a high proportion of street criminals and/or substance abusers. While these areas may seem undesirable, they have a lot less crime than the likes of the O'Connell Street-Grafton street axis. Even in a 'nice' area, you will have street criminals try to blag their way past reception.

Access to support services (bank, post office, professional services, print supplier), transport and importantly these days, housing.

whiskeygirl

Love these threads, you'd swear Dublin is Juarez or somewhere!

Just tell everyone to have a bit of cop on. Don't walk down alleys at night, don't walk around advertising your expensive phone oblivious to your surroundings, and offer a polite "sorry" in response to any beggars looking for money, cigarettes etc. If you're female, don't walk deserted streets at 2/3/4am, like you wouldn't do in any city.

I've followed these simple rules all my life and never had any hassle.

Bambi985

whiskeygirl wrote: »

Love these threads, you'd swear Dublin is Juarez or somewhere!

Just tell everyone to have a bit of cop on. Don't walk down alleys at night, don't walk around advertising your expensive phone oblivious to your surroundings, and offer a polite "sorry" in response to any beggars looking for money, cigarettes etc. If you're female, don't walk deserted streets at 2/3/4am, like you wouldn't do in any city.

I've followed these simple rules all my life and never had any hassle.

Ah I know, and the implication was not that Dublin was downtown Baghdad or anything, but we've had problems in other offices including London and Edinburgh with things like street crime, late night drunks and substance abusers that have caused serious security concerns for employees and caused some accessibility issues during hours that staff really need to be there. Things that weren't flagged when the locations were scouted because they weren't issues visible during the day.

Anyway thanks for the general feedback!

Bambi985

OK I'm going to get more specific to see if anyone has any interesting insights to offer!

Grand Canal Dock
Thomas Street
Tara Street
Georges Quay
Fitzwilliam Square

If you had to pick a location to plant a brand new office, which one would you go with? I'd be thinking Grand Canal Dock or Georges Quay, from what I remember Tara/Thomas street can be a bit dodgy but that might have changed in recent years.

Any input appreciated!

Jimbob1977

The new Luas interchange, access to the DART network and Connolly/Heuston station for mainline railway would make George's Quay and Tara Street the best bet. They are relatively close to all of these transportation hubs and the Port Tunnel. Side by side on a map

If the people were driving to work, all of those office locations you mentioned would be busy. So they cancel each other out car-wise. You'd need to find out about parking or offsite parking.

In terms of 'good vibes', Fitzwilliam Square would be the nicest.

odyssey06

Bambi985 wrote: »

OK I'm going to get more specific to see if anyone has any interesting insights to offer!

Grand Canal Dock
Thomas Street
Tara Street
Georges Quay
Fitzwilliam Square

If you had to pick a location to plant a brand new office, which one would you go with? I'd be thinking Grand Canal Dock or Georges Quay, from what I remember Tara/Thomas street can be a bit dodgy but that might have changed in recent years.

Any input appreciated!

I've worked on Pembroke Street just off Fitzwilliam Square so that'd get my vote.

Plus its close to Dart and one of the Luas lines.

LionelNashe

I'd say the most important thing to consider is ease of access by public transport. Of the ones you've listed, Georges Quay, Tara Street & Grand Canal Dock are the very accessible by train/Dart.

Or, something like this:
http://www.daft.ie/dublin/commercial-property-for-rent/offices-for-rent/the-boat-house-bishop-street-d08-h01f-dublin-8-dublin-306175/
Very central, busy area, 24/7 building.

Jimbob1977

Bambi985 wrote: »

Hi all,

First venture into the Dublin forum, go easy on me! :pac:

So I currently live in London and the company I work for is potentially looking to open an office in Dublin in the year ahead. As the token "Irish girl" and a former Dublin-dweller myself, I've been pulled in to steer and advise along the way as we scout out potential locations around the capital. It'd potentially be a 24/7 operation so things like security and safety during the late hours when people are clocking off-shift would be a big concern.

With that in mind, I thought some people here might be able to help me with any potential "red flag" "avoid like the plague" areas around the city centre - streets that you wouldn't walk down at 2am on your own let's say. I have a few ideas but as someone more than 7 years out of the capital I thought I'd lend on the expertise of boards.ie.

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

By the way, does it have to be city centre?

Could you choose a suburban area like Sandyford, Leopardstown or Cherrywood? All have Luas and access to the M50.

I can't speak for North Dublin, but there must be office parks near the M1, M50 and airport.

I assume this is connected to a financial services company that needs an EU base after Brexit.

PhoenixParker

Given your criteria you're looking at Dublin 2.

Beyond that I'd just shortlist whatever looks suitable in the area in terms of size, access and layout and then visit with the top bods and look at those both day and night.

When you're talking 24/7 one street or even one streetlight can make a huge difference. Even the entrance door itself. Most of Dublin 2 will be fine but you won't know until you see the property itself if a particular one will do.

Samuel T. Cogley

I work in one of the nicest offices in D4 at the heart of Ballsbridge. There's more brazzers than you can shake a stick at, Dublin for you.

Victor

Grand Canal Dock - expensive (competing with Google, Facebook, etc.), large offices, some services, mostly quiet in the evening.

Thomas Street - much cheaper, relatively few offices, very working class, popular with small tech start-ups.

Tara Street / Georges Quay - expensive, large offices, lots of services, east of Tara Street is exceptionally quiet in the evening, you have addicts hanging around during the day.

Fitzwilliam Square - expensive, mostly small-medium offices (some large along canal), lots of services, exceptionally quiet in the evening (when often the only people on the square itself are street prostitutes).

Lux23

I think Thomas Street might be dodgy very late at night and Tara Street can feel very secluded. To be fair though I wouldn't be too enamoured with clocking off and walking down any street on my own late at night. Fitzwilliam Square, for example, would be extraordinarily quiet and I would be afraid of a weirdo watching me.

Samuel T. Cogley

Thomas street is grand in fairness. Rough as a badgers ball sack but if you leave the natives alone they'll leave you alone. All the hookers have been cleared out as well so no chance of being mistaken for a working girl, unlike most of D4.

Bambi985

Bambi985 wrote: »

OK I'm going to get more specific to see if anyone has any interesting insights to offer!

Grand Canal Dock
Thomas Street
Tara Street
Georges Quay
Fitzwilliam Square

If you had to pick a location to plant a brand new office, which one would you go with? I'd be thinking Grand Canal Dock or Georges Quay, from what I remember Tara/Thomas street can be a bit dodgy but that might have changed in recent years.

Any input appreciated!

Thomas St is probably the closest to dodgy of those.

Tara St is going to see a lot of development in the coming years, planning permission I think has been granted to knock down Hawkins House and Apollo House to be rebuilt. You're close to the Luas and the DART and O'Connell St so bus, Luas, train, take your pick. Georges Quay is right by Tara St really so same advise applies.

Grand Canal is another good area, loads of multinationals, loads of development going on, even though there's still not enough supply there are plenty of people living in the area so there are always people around, I used to work and socialise around there and it isn't even slightly dangerous. Can't really go wrong.

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

I work in one of the nicest offices in D4 at the heart of Ballsbridge. There's more brazzers than you can shake a stick at, Dublin for you.

I lived in the heart of Ballsbridge for years and would come and go at all hours and this is not even close to being my experience.

Samuel T. Cogley

Braxton Famous Smart-ass wrote: »

I lived in the heart of Ballsbridge for years and would come and go at all hours and this is not even close to being my experience.

The canal near the Mespil. Well known red light area I'm afraid. It's fairly low key.

Victor

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

The canal near the Mespil.

Is the very edge of Ballsbridge.

Samuel T. Cogley

Victor wrote: »

Is the very edge of Ballsbridge.

Fair comment. Huge number of offices though.

MartyMcFly84

My advice would be to look into where the needle exchange and methadone clinics are in the City Centre and avoid those places.

In fairness Junkies rarely pose a serious threat, shambling along like toothless zombies, but its not great for people to see coming into and going from work.

Recently we had a fire drill in work and had to leave through the back fire exit, round the corner there were two junkies, one was puking on his shoes the other lady was shooting up with a needle in her arm. Not exactly a nice thing to see around your place of work.

irlirishkev

Speaking as someone who actually lives on Thomas Street - it's not in the slightest bit 'dodgy' unless I'm misunderstanding the word..

Begging? Yes.
Drinking in public? Sure.

However..

It's always busy, even at night. Between the shops and pubs, student accommodation, The Digital Hub, Vicar Street, the Tivoli, the ever present Taxis, market traders, tourist flow to/from Guinness, It's never that quiet. It's a bustling lively street. I've walked up and down it at all hours, in all states of sobriety, and have never seen or had trouble.

It may not look as pretty as some areas, but having lived in a few of those places in the city, that suits me fine.

Dr Crayfish

GCD and Fitzwilliam Square are not in the least bit dodge. The others aren't bad really apart from a few junkies here and there. Tara St and George's Quay are pretty much the same place, and it's fine, maybe a few zombies around during day but nothing too bad.

Wheety

Just stick to Dublin 2 and you'll be fine.

irishguy

Bambi985 wrote: »

Hi all,

First venture into the Dublin forum, go easy on me! :pac:

So I currently live in London and the company I work for is potentially looking to open an office in Dublin in the year ahead. As the token "Irish girl" and a former Dublin-dweller myself, I've been pulled in to steer and advise along the way as we scout out potential locations around the capital. It'd potentially be a 24/7 operation so things like security and safety during the late hours when people are clocking off-shift would be a big concern.

With that in mind, I thought some people here might be able to help me with any potential "red flag" "avoid like the plague" areas around the city centre - streets that you wouldn't walk down at 2am on your own let's say. I have a few ideas but as someone more than 7 years out of the capital I thought I'd lend on the expertise of boards.ie.

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

It really depends on your circumstances, how much the company is willing to pay i.e. are you looking for Grade A office space in prime D2,D4, D1? What type of employee are you trying to hire i.e. there are certain clusters around the city that would attract employee from Tech, Finance, Accounting/Law, Pharma etc. Do you need lots of office space or just a small office? Most larger/medium companies would hire a commercial estate agent to shortlist properties for them if they are not familiar with the City/Country (Does the office have to be in Dublin?). Dublin like London has a very competitive office market, so you're better off looking at available office options first as there may not be a lot of options free for what you want.

Ireland (as you may know) has a fantastic government department that specializes in attracting foreign companies to Ireland, they even have a office in London (westend). They will help you with these decisions, legal, tax and possibly lucrative government grants. They should be your first point of contact, they will make the whole move (no just finding an office) a lot smoother.

http://www.idaireland.com/

Bambi985

Cheers everyone! Really helpful. I'll be back in Dub at the end of August with a team of execs to scout out locations and introduce a few yanks to REAL Guinness.

irishguy as it happens we're already working with IDA and the locations I listed all have available office spaces. I've been pulled in as more of a sort of anecdotal advice-giver based on what the official government types are telling them.

This is all really helpful and has served to re-jog my memory among everything else. I get back semi-regularly enough but frequent the same small parts and don't feel as if I know the place like i once did.

any further ideas are helpful anyway. It's a US tech company by the way.

irishguy

Bambi985 wrote: »

Cheers everyone! Really helpful. I'll be back in Dub at the end of August with a team of execs to scout out locations and introduce a few yanks to REAL Guinness.

irishguy as it happens we're already working with IDA and the locations I listed all have available office spaces. I've been pulled in as more of a sort of anecdotal advice-giver based on what the official government types are telling them.

This is all really helpful and has served to re-jog my memory among everything else. I get back semi-regularly enough but frequent the same small parts and don't feel as if I know the place like i once did.

any further ideas are helpful anyway. It's a US tech company by the way.

Very good you're on the right track then. The main Tech area would be Grand canal dock, but the whole area within the Grand canal dock, Tara Street, Georges Quay, Fitzwilliam Square would all be within a square 1 mile of each other and most large tech companys would be located in that area. They would all have very good transport links, cafes, restaurants etc and would make it easier to hire Tech staff in those areas, as they already live in commuting distance of there.

You could also consider Sandyford/Central Park if your looking for a larger office with cheaper rent (C.50% less than D2/D4). There are quite a few tech companies out there too Microsoft, Salesforce, Mastercard. Having worked for tech companies in both areas I would prefer the D2 area, more restaurants, cafes, bars and younger people what to work there.
The main thing in Dublin is being near the Luas or Dart (which all your shortlisted areas are) to attract staff as the transport system isn't as good in some areas.

Best of luck with your search

hatrickpatrick

None of the areas you've mentioned have anything dodgy about them. Thomas Street does intersect with one or two dangerous streets though as you get further from the city centre end, which it might be easy to wander into by mistake - Basin Street / View adjacent to the Guinness Storehouse is a scary place even for some Dubliners so I'd learn where the turn-off for that street is and avoid it like the plague if you're unfamiliar with the city, there is (or at least was 3-4 years ago, maybe somebody can update me here?) one apartment complex there with a serious drug-gang feuding problem. In and around 2012 there were almost nightly shouting matches and stone throwing contests between these gobsh!tes according to friends I had living nearby. I've also heard from others that Watling and Bridgefoot Streets can attract gobsh!tes from time to time as well, although I've personally never encountered any.

The thing about Dublin though and what makes it different to a lot of other cities is that these things are highly localised - the difference between a settled and dangerous area can literally mean a two minute walk down the road in Dublin. Thomas St itself is absolutely fine, hang out there regularly at all hours of the day and night and have never had a single issue. Just know which areas have a dodgy reputation and make sure you don't accidentally get mixed up in them - I initially discovered the Basin St thing accidentally just because it looked like a quick shortcut from Thomas St to the South Circular in Rialto, turned back pretty quickly when I discovered the warring scumbags. Maybe I just got them on a bad evening

MadDog76

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Thomas street is grand in fairness. Rough as a badgers ball sack but if you leave the natives alone they'll leave you alone. All the hookers have been cleared out as well so no chance of being mistaken for a working girl, unlike most of D4.

Thomas Street has never had street-hookers .......... you must be confusing it with another area.

Victor

MadDog76 wrote: »

Thomas Street has never had street-hookers .......... you must be confusing it with another area.

Yeah. They used Molyneaux Yard (lane at other side of Vicar Street) instead.

Samuel T. Cogley

I'm beginning to wonder if I'm too observant. :pac: Maybe these young ladies are just concerned about the state of the economy and ensuring I'm always 'looking for business' opportunities.

TBH They might not have been technically on Thomas street or in central Ballsbridge but in both cases they were pretty close and some of the office districts in D2 suffer* from it too.

*It's not really an issue walking past tbh.

MadDog76

Victor wrote: »

Yeah. They used Molyneaux Yard (lane at other side of Vicar Street) instead.

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

I'm beginning to wonder if I'm too observant. :pac: Maybe these young ladies are just concerned about the state of the economy and ensuring I'm always 'looking for business' opportunities.

TBH They might not have been technically on Thomas street or in central Ballsbridge but in both cases they were pretty close and some of the office districts in D2 suffer* from it too.

*It's not really an issue walking past tbh.

The closest they ever got to Thomas Street was in Smithfield across the Liffey in Dublin 7 .......... and even that was over 10 years ago!

Victor

MadDog76 wrote: »

The closest they ever got to Thomas Street was in Smithfield across the Liffey in Dublin 7 .......... and even that was over 10 years ago!

Molyneaux Yard was a historical thing.

bmwguy

Didn't realise street brazzers still exist. Thought they were all on the internet.
If it is indeed a London based financial firm relocating then local brazzers are probably a necessity

hmmm

Lived off Thomas street for years and I would not locate a 24x7 business there- I think a lot of people coming too or from work at 4 in the morning would be uncomfortable. You're unlikely to have any hassle, but I've seen enough dodgy stuff over the years to know you need to have your wits about you. It'd be fine for a 9 to 5 type of company.

MadDog76

Victor wrote: »

Molyneaux Yard was a historical thing.

Historical being the key word ..........

MadDog76

bmwguy wrote: »

Didn't realise street brazzers still exist. Thought they were all on the internet.
If it is indeed a London based financial firm relocating then local brazzers are probably a necessity

They don't anymore apart from 2 or 3 heroin addicts on Burlington Road some Saturday nights and the odd Friday night.

Samuel T. Cogley

MadDog76 wrote: »

The closest they ever got to Thomas Street was in Smithfield across the Liffey in Dublin 7 .......... and even that was over 10 years ago!

Aye years back but they got as far as Thomas street, or at least the adjoining streets. Actually Blackhall place around the Law Soc was the ironic enough epicenter.

MadDog76

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Aye years back but they got as far as Thomas street, or at least the adjoining streets. Actually Blackhall place around the Law Soc was the ironic enough epicenter.

Blackhall Place is across the Liffey in Dublin 7, they never got anywhere near Thomas Street though ..............

Samuel T. Cogley

MadDog76 wrote: »

Blackhall Place is across the Liffey in Dublin 7, they never got anywhere near Thomas Street though ..............

We'll just have to disagree. I'm not bowing to your superior knowledge of Dublin red light districts. :pac: All gone now though, off the street anyway except for D2/D4 where it's still rife.

hatrickpatrick

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

..............Thomas Street does intersect with one or two dangerous streets though as you get further from the city centre end, which it might be easy to wander into by mistake - Basin Street / View adjacent to the Guinness Storehouse is a scary place even for some Dubliners so I'd learn where the turn-off for that street is and avoid it like the plague.....................

Wandered in there of a Sunday morning last August, Jesus ..... I'd struggle to verbalise the place.

hatrickpatrick

Augeo wrote: »

Wandered in there of a Sunday morning last August, Jesus ..... I'd struggle to verbalise the place.

Fights in progress? The night I got lost around there was characterised by a sort of "set fire to as many things as possible while baaaetin' the sh!te out of eachother and yelling at any passers by" mentality

In fairness, the place tends to boast by far the most impressive bonfire anywhere in the city around Halloween, so that redeems it somewhat

...... there was a load lads aged 16 to 40 just sitting on footpaths etc. What was weird was that many of them looked really manky, like hadn't washed in months. Too fat to be on junk but not overly healthy looking.

Toddlers and dogs playing happily.

This was about 11am. ... strange vibe about the place. Be slow to wander in there again. To be fair they were amicable enough but I was glad I didn't run out of petrol in there.

irlirishkev

Augeo wrote: »

...... there was a load lads aged 16 to 40 just sitting on footpaths etc. What was weird was that many of them looked really manky, like hadn't washed in months. Too fat to be on junk but not overly healthy looking.

Toddlers and dogs playing happily.

This was about 11am. ... strange vibe about the place. Be slow to wander in there again. To be fair they were amicable enough but I was glad I didn't run out of petrol in there.

There was, and is at least one homeless shelter up the road.. Could have been related to that.

irlirishkev

irlirishkev wrote: »

There was, and is at least one homeless shelter up the road.. Could have been related to that.

Yeah, maybe. As I said I'd find it hard to verbalise what I saw, I'd know lots of typical scumbags and a few more hardened criminals and of course like everyone would have noticed folks with addiction problems etc etc.

Just never quite saw the likes of in there before.

andekwarhola

Augeo wrote: »

...... there was a load lads aged 16 to 40 just sitting on footpaths etc. What was weird was that many of them looked really manky, like hadn't washed in months. Too fat to be on junk but not overly healthy looking.

Used to be a big halting site in there when I lived in the area but that was years ago. Got chased down the road there for booting a dog that tried to bite me.

In a strange way, it's a unique, interesting little area (at least around Pim Street) in the shadow of the brewery but I wouldn't really live or locate a business there.

Bambi985

Thanks to everyone for the advice and anecdotes!

Thought I'd update for anyone who cares. We had a great trip across about three weeks ago and spent the day scouting around the city centre looking at potential offices. Our new Dublin gaff in Fitzwilliam Place will be opening in mid October

Lux23

Best of luck with it.

Dr Brown

I would stay away from dame lane people are always getting the **** kicked out of them in that area.