Not Allowing kids to see grandparents

The Darkroom

Hi all just wondering if i just don't want my kids seeing my wife's american parents do I need a reason and is it possible to legally prevent someone from seeing their grandkids. If it's possible I'll get on to my solicitor but just wondering.

Thanks

Kimbot

You could get a barring order, but you would have to ask a solicitor about it

everlast75

The Darkroom wrote: »

Hi all just wondering if i just don't want my kids seeing my wife's american parents do I need a reason and is it possible to legally prevent someone from seeing their grandkids. If it's possible I'll get on to my solicitor but just wondering.

Thanks

The law looks at it a different way.

Is there a valid reason why your kids shouldn't see their grandparents?

They have a right to see their relatives. You would need a very significant reason to interfere with that.

DublinCDT

The Darkroom wrote: »

Hi all just wondering if i just don't want my kids seeing my wife's american parents do I need a reason and is it possible to legally prevent someone from seeing their grandkids. If it's possible I'll get on to my solicitor but just wondering.

Thanks

It's possible for grandparents to go to the family district court here and seek access to their grandchildren. Not sure how it works if parties are in different jurisdictions.
As for a banning order ... I'd imagine not liking them is not enough of a reason. What is your objection ?

Edit- what does your wife feel ?

Wexfordboy89

Im guessing unless the grandparents are using ilegal substances or are up to something ilegal and you have proof i wouldnt say you can.dont know if u want or can disclose reason why.is your wife ok with this aswell

The Darkroom

Wexfordboy89 wrote: »

Im guessing unless the grandparents are using ilegal substances or are up to something ilegal and you have proof i wouldnt say you can.dont know if u want or can disclose reason why.is your wife ok with this aswell

Thanks lads.

Well their kids use illegal substances and are often high upon visiting them. I can't prove this

They also came over and took a service out for my wife who had cancer and said they'd pay for it. They ran back to the states and when the time came to pay the bill had come close to 20k euros and they wouldn't pay. The company couldn't chase them because they're in America so because the service was rendered to my wife they're chasing her instead.

Is this a good reason? My wife reluctantly stands by me on this.

rainemac

If your wife is with you on this then surely you can just make a decision to not see the grandparents and tell them you no longer want to have a relationship with them and this includes your children???

DublinCDT

Just to be clear are we talking the aunts and uncles using drugs in the US or when they come to Ireland to visit ?

rainemac

Also to clarify, they took out a service for your wife with cancer, a type of treatment for the cancer? Said they'd pay but didn't and went back to the US?

Wexfordboy89

Hmmm im guessing its not as simple as just saying you cant come as they could easily just turn up at your door.thats pretty shyt of them to run off n leave you having to pay 20k they owe.im not sure what you would need to actually get a barring order stopping them seeing the kids.maybe try citizens advice if theres one near you

Mutant z

The Darkroom wrote: »

Hi all just wondering if i just don't want my kids seeing my wife's american parents do I need a reason and is it possible to legally prevent someone from seeing their grandkids. If it's possible I'll get on to my solicitor but just wondering.

Thanks

You must have real bad blood with your inlaws if you want to prevent them from seeing their own grandchildren.

Lmklad

A barring order doesn't apply as they do not live with you. If your wife is in agreement then the OP then I can't see what the problem is. Just forbid them from entering your property. As for drug using Aunts and Uncles unless it's happening here there is little you can do about it (not sure where they live but remember some States allow use of cannabis) unless they are visiting here and you suspect they might be bringing illegal substances with them. Then a quiet phone call to Customs might be in order.

ohnonotgmail

Grandparents have no automatic right of access to their grandchildren. If they turn up on your doorstep just tell them to go away.

seamus

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Grandparents have no automatic right of access to their grandchildren. If they turn up on your doorstep just tell them to go away.

Grandparents can go to court to apply for access to see their grandchildren, and its very rare for them to be refused unless there's a solid reason it would not be good for the child.

The grandparents being in a different jurisdiction complicates matters, and likely plays against them - if they see the child once a year or less then the courts may consider them a disruptive influence rather than a beneficial one.

But yes, if they turn up on the doorstep you can tell them to go away. Best to tell them not to come to Ireland at all.

DublinCDT

Would the grandparents have burden of proof ie need to prove they are not likely to expose the children to drug abuse if granted custody ?

ohnonotgmail

PhoenixParker wrote: »

I have never heard of such a thing in Ireland.

Only parents and legal guardians have rights regarding children. Grandparents have no legal standing. Difficulties might arrive if the children's mother disagreed but that would be about her rights as a mother not the grandparents.

only parents and legal guardians have automatic rights. Grandparents can apply to the courts for access to grandchildren. It is covered under legislation

https://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/bills28/bills/2013/1313/b1313d.pdf

dunleakelleher

By the way you are talking, you want to deny you children all access to see their grandparents, aunts and uncles. That's a huge call and may come back to haunt you as your kids grow up and make decisions and opinions for themselves.
Quite a lot of people don't get on with in-laws. but are in contact for the relatively short time the kids are small. If (and I have no doubt) they are bad people. it's better your kids make that decision opinion for themselves You still have the right to protect them from harm. But I would hate to think you would be held to blame (by your kids) for denying them of a whole childhood with out grandparents, aunts and uncles.

DublinCDT

dunleakelleher wrote: »

By the way you are talking, you want to deny you children all access to see their grandparents, aunts and uncles. That's a huge call and may come back to haunt you as your kids grow up and make decisions and opinions for themselves.
Quite a lot of people don't get on with in-laws. but are in contact for the relatively short time the kids are small. If (and I have no doubt) they are bad people. it's better your kids make that decision opinion for themselves You still have the right to protect them from harm. But I would hate to think you would be held to blame (by your kids) for denying them of a whole childhood with out grandparents, aunts and uncles.

Also held to blame by your wife .... just saying.

seamus

DublinCDT wrote: »

Would the grandparents have burden of proof ie need to prove they are not likely to expose the children to drug abuse if granted custody ?

Custody is a different thing.
For access they wouldn't have to prove much unless the court had good reason to believe the grandparents would expose the children to drug abuse.

Some aunts and uncles having drug issues wouldn't count unless they live or spend a lot of time with the grandparents.

tayto lover

Your children might not forgive you in years to come for preventing them seeing their grandparents.

Snugglebunnies

Grandparents can bring you to court for access to your kids. The judge will decide if your reasons for preventing them seeing the children are good enough. If an access order is granted you will have to hand your children over to the grandparents.

dats_right

Wow, I cannot believe the lack of knowledge and ignorance being displayed by the majority of posters. I know I don't post on this forum regularly anymore, but surely all of the knowledgeable people haven't disappeared?

The simple answer here is that generally a parent has full legal right to decide who their child sees. In other words a parent is prima facie entitled to prevent grandparents from having any access with their grandchild. Of course, it would be open to the grandparents to apply to the District Court for access to be ordered but this is a difficult road for grandparents and not guaranteed to succeed.

Marcusm

dats_right wrote: »

Wow, I cannot believe the lack of knowledge and ignorance being displayed by the majority of posters. I know I don't post on this forum regularly anymore, but surely all of the knowledgeable people haven't disappeared?

The simple answer here is that generally a parent has full legal right to decide who their child sees. In other words a parent is prima facie entitled to prevent grandparents from having any access with their grandchild. Of course, it would be open to the grandparents to apply to the District Court for access to be ordered but this is a difficult road for grandparents and not guaranteed to succeed.

The children's rights referendum changed it from an outright decision of the parents to a requirement to take account of what is in the children's interests. Given what the OP has asserted, I would hope that the parents' position would be vindicated but they cannot arbitrarily decide to exclude grandparents from their children'slives.

ohnonotgmail

dats_right wrote: »

Wow, I cannot believe the lack of knowledge and ignorance being displayed by the majority of posters. I know I don't post on this forum regularly anymore, but surely all of the knowledgeable people haven't disappeared?

The simple answer here is that generally a parent has full legal right to decide who their child sees. In other words a parent is prima facie entitled to prevent grandparents from having any access with their grandchild. Of course, it would be open to the grandparents to apply to the District Court for access to be ordered but this is a difficult road for grandparents and not guaranteed to succeed.

clearly you haven't bothered to read the thread. all this has already been explained. a grandparent has not automatic right to access but they can apply to the district court for access. It is not such a difficult road as you imagine. a parent would need a good reason to prevent access.

DublinCDT

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

clearly you haven't bothered to read the thread. all this has already been explained. a grandparent has not automatic right to access but they can apply to the district court for access. It is not such a difficult road as you imagine. a parent would need a good reason to prevent access.

Yip ....not that difficult You can represent yourself and asfaik it's only €7 to issue the summons through the local district court office. Bad blood would actually help the grandparents case. Judges are wary of grandparents seeking access to grandkids when really its to give their sons more access where the mam and dad are split.

BlueLass

You can represent yourself and asfaik it's only €7 to issue the summons through the local district court office.



Family law matters in district court do not have any fees attached - no charge!

GM228

Marcusm wrote: »

The children's rights referendum changed it from an outright decision of the parents to a requirement to take account of what is in the children's interests. Given what the OP has asserted, I would hope that the parents' position would be vindicated but they cannot arbitrarily decide to exclude grandparents from their children'slives.

This is true, whilst the childs best interests must be taken account of, the guardians and the childs views still have to be taken account of.

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

clearly you haven't bothered to read the thread. all this has already been explained. a grandparent has not automatic right to access but they can apply to the district court for access. It is not such a difficult road as you imagine. a parent would need a good reason to prevent access.

The problem is the grandparent still must apply for leave of the court to do such and apart from the childs best interests and views (views is most likely also subject to age and maturity in accordance with the constitution) there is no consideration of the grandparents view. The only consideration on the grandparents side is their connection with the child - i.e being a relative which in itself may not account for much.

ohnonotgmail

GM228 wrote: »

This is true, whilst the childs best interests must be taken account of the guardians and the childs views still have to be taken account of.





The problem is the grandparent still must apply for leave of the court to do such and apart from the childs best interests and views (views is most likely also subject to age and maturity in accordance with the constitution) there is no consideration of the grandparents view. The only consideration on the grandparents side is their connection with the child - i.e being a relative which in itself may not account for much.

it may not account for much but it does account for something. the point is that the final decision does not rest with the parents and that there are avenues that the grandparents can go down.

The Darkroom

The Darkroom wrote: »

i just don't want my kids seeing my wife's american parents

The Darkroom wrote: »

They ran back to the states and when the time came to pay the bill had come close to 20k euros and they wouldn't pay. The company couldn't chase them because they're in America so because the service was rendered to my wife they're chasing her instead.

Is there even an issue? Are the grandparents demanding to see the children?

You can easily stop your kids from seeing their grandparents by just not facilitating it.

It would be up to the grandparents then to change this.

tayto lover

DublinCDT wrote: »

Yip ....not that difficult You can represent yourself and asfaik it's only €7 to issue the summons through the local district court office. Bad blood would actually help the grandparents case. Judges are wary of grandparents seeking access to grandkids when really its to give their sons more access where the mam and dad are split.

It is very often the case that the grandparents want to see the children themselves and not to allow their son more time.

DublinCDT

I'm still not clear where burden of proof if any lies in a case where mam/dad says there's drug abuse and granparents say no. Does the judge simply base their decision on who shows the presents the most likely truth ???