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Hosted Forums

  • #2
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 10,341 LoLth


    Hosted forums are attached to Boards.ie but are not under the Boards.ie umbrella. We have no direct control over the content (admins will very rarely visit a hosted forum without reason) which has lead to issues in the past with content not suitable being hosted on a Boards.ie server and, to the end user, seemingly supported by boards.

    Hosted forums were intended to be a form of incubator for special interest groups who met on boards to have a place before they find somewhere more permanent of their own. Hence they have their own mods, own charters and own rules on who can join or even see the content or know of their existence. Hosted forums are different to regular Boards.ie forums and despite the intention to have them as temporary add-ons, this was never really applied and some hosted forums have become almost permanent fixtures with a community of their own - and thats great to see but...its not part of boards and falls between the cracks when it comes to policy and management but responsibility is still fully on the Boards.ie management.

    So whats the plan?
    Well, first off we want to identify the quiet ones. We have, over the past two years , monitored Hforum activity and identified if a forum has been silent for an extended period of time (we're thinking of 1 year without a post as a flat rule but a posts-over-time measure may be a better indicator). these forums will be wound up and either archived and public , archived and private or merged as part of a suitable forum on boards.ie where the post dates will ensure they are not flooding the front pages.

    next we will look at the not-very active forums and see if they match existing boards.ie forums. if they do, we merge them into boards.ie either as a sub-forum (if there are distinct differences) or as parallell content (if they are similar enough and assuming the content is acceptable!)

    finally active forums: ideally these would be merged or sub-forumed but some may be better suited to a single thread in a parent forum (active could still be content light, just consistently updated over time). Others would not be suited to boards.ie and would either be archived (private) , archived (public).

    If any forum is to be archived (private) , a notice will be put up and all users will have ample time to copy content / export links etc before it goes. we're not trying to destroy content or communities. I would hope that any archived active forums would have enough time to establish their community elsewhere and continue their conversations in their own happy corner of the interwebz.

    Any forum that is elected to be merged or made into a sub-forum would have the original location redirect to the new so no users will lose their way and bookmarks will continue to function (because there is nothing worse than once reliable bookmarks that change!)

    VERY IMPORTANT BIT:
    ANY FORUM WHICH IS CURRENTLY PRIVATE WILL NOT BE MADE PUBLIC REGARDLESS OF THE DECISION. Doesnt matter if its better merged with an existing forum, if its private now it will always remain private. anything that users have posted in an environment that they believed to be controlled and secure will not be exposed to anyone (or role) that does not already have access to it. If this means a private forum/sub-forum then that will need to be reviewed especially in light of "suitability". A private hosted forum that is essentially "port your pr0n here" (does not exist as far as I am aware so no, you cannot have a link!) would not be a suitable forum private or otherwise as it contravenes the general boards charter/ToU.

    Whats considered suitable for boards?
    thats an open discussion and something that is constantly changing as society changes and as the need for discussion changes. We're open to suggestions on where to draw the line or where the current line needs to be nudged but that would not be the primary focus of this thread.

    The future of hosted forums?
    Not sure. I, personally, like the idea of spinning off communities that want a place to start out but it's a fine line between taking advantage of free hosting and accepting a helping hand to get off the ground. Also there's the issue of association with boards.ie and vice-versa .

    So whats this thread for?
    This is the Open Discussion thread for hosted forums in general where Boards admins and staff want to get user opinion and suggestions for how we proceed. The end goal is to clear down the current Hosted Forums, thats the decision , however how we do that and timeframe etc is not set in stone so thats what we would appreciate input on. We made a start with the Chelsea and Spurs supporter forums and, I'll be honest, we messed up a bit there. We should have had this discussion first and informed the users what was coming. In our defense this isn't new to us, it's always been trundling along so we (admins and staff) forgot that it would be new to others and in our rush to get it done at a quiet time in the soccer season, we didn't explain what exactly was happening and why. We got it wrong and this is the start of our attempt to get it right. This is not just about Chelsea and Spurs hosted forums though, this is about all of the existing hosted forums and their users, its abotu all future hosted forums and their potential users and its about how boards.ie can help make communities that extend beyond this website other than jettisoning users and mods in a cloud of dissatisfaction and, in some cases, feelings of betrayal.

    How will this thread work?
    This thread will be moderated but open.

    what's that mean? well, you must post on topic but you can post anything that is part of the discussion as long as its on topic and is actually part of the discussion. Standard boards.ie rules of conduct apply regarding treatment of other users , content of posts and of course trolling.

    I'm banned from a forum that is being discussed, can I post? emmmm.... lets look at it this way, if its on topic and its an attempt to give constructive feedback then ok. if its just a potshot at the mod/hmod/users or an attempt to segway into a different topic then we'll file it under "trolling" and deal with it that way. As I said, this is an attempt at open discussion.

    Are there any restrictions on posting?
    Yes. Any user may post TWICE in any 12 hour period. This is not an attempt to restrict user opinions but rather an attempt to ensure that opinions are considered and planned and to prevent reactionary posts or sidetreks. Why Twice? because you post once and someone counters or misunderstands. Its always good to hold a post back for clarifying a point or helping another user.

    Will it make any difference?
    As stated above, the decision has been made. In fact it was made two years ago and delayed repeatedly. However the HOW and the degree of severity / timeline / allowances / how we facilitate the hosted forum communities on the main site have not been finalised nor have the criteria for hosted forums going forward or how much of the Boards.ie charter should apply to hosted forums of the future or should a transgression in a hosted forum carry over to the main site? Also, any suggestions for criteria to judge eligibility of future Hosted Forums would be useful.


    Edited to revise the time period from 24 hours to 12 hours.


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Comments

  • #2


    As for "The future of hosted forums?", once the entire Hosted section has been handled as per the above info, I'd suggest tying the changes in with a radical overhaul of forum creation rules (ie, a way more relaxed approach), & use the Hosted area of Boards as a test-bed for new forum ideas. The specifics could be debated, but I'd advocate for more "open field" testing of new forum ideas, as opposed to relying on +1/-1's. If it works out, great, move it from Hosted to the main site...if it doesn't take off within a given time, close shop.

    In that context, the Hosted section could be given some more prominence than it already has, feed users in to it to explore it, & give new forum ideas a far better chance of success than the tiny backwater forum called Forum Requests affords them.


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    Quick note:

    Post approval is currently turned on. We're looking at disabling it to allow posts to be made without requiring admin approval before they are visible. I'll manually approve posts until that setting is changed but there may be a delay as RL takes priority.

    edit: I *think* post approval should be sorted now....


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    I am not quite sure why the 'ordinary' boards posters are being consulted about what appears to outsiders to be a secret society? Or a series of secret societies. How can we have an opinion on something we know nothing about?


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    Can the old Spurs forum be reopened as a hosted forum?


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    looksee wrote: »
    I am not quite sure why the 'ordinary' boards posters are being consulted about what appears to outsiders to be a secret society? Or a series of secret societies. How can we have an opinion on something we know nothing about?

    I co-mod a private hosted forum, it's quite busy, pretty much everyone who posts there posts elsewhere on boards and over the years many people have come and gone from it so I don't know if every private forum could be described as strictly secret societies. Many posters may have something to contribute to the discussion.


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    Spurs is a hosted forum currently isn't it? In which case it is scheduled to be closed and moved to the soccer forum possibly as a supporter megathread same as other club supporter threads. (IIRC Spurs and Chelsea were anomalies that were exceptions to the rule or some strange reason or pre-dated the rule and were never mothballed)

    Unless you are referring to the forum that was there before it got converted into a hosted forum, in which case it would be a forum request like any other. Problem is, club forums have , to date, been refused on the basis of not wanting to set a precedent of club dedicated sub fora and the overhead in modding that introduces.

    From what I understand, some of the Spurs supporter posters have set up a Spurs community elsewhere for discussion away from Boards.ie


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    I believe Hosted forums have a place on boards. I never knew they were a temporary measure to be honest. I've been part of a few and, two in particular, I've made great friends from. I quite likely would be well gone from boards if not for them. Because of them I stuck around and continued contributing to the public boards forums.

    As for "taking advantage of free hosting". The posters using the hosted forums have a large mixture of prolific posters and mods from what I've seen. I don't see an issue with them using this free hosting considering the content generated and the service the mods give to boards, which they obviously do for free.

    Do a few hosted forums take up much considering the size of the site? I'm not sure on the numbers of hosted forums or the activity but IMO any active hosted forum, whatever way you measure that I'm not sure, should remain as is with their hosted mods in place and forums only accessible to admin.

    "Hosted forums were intended to be a form of incubator for special interest groups who met on boards to have a place before they find somewhere more permanent of their own."

    Do we really want posters moving away from boards? As if that isn't happening enough already.


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    Lads do you have nothing better to do? And I mean this in the nicest possible way.

    With all the issues that boards.ie has, I would have thought that this would be waaaay down the list.


  • #2


    Hi,

    Could you clarify a few things for me please?

    01. If an active private hosted forum becomes sub-forumed, what actually happens to the forum itself? Does all of the existing threads etc remain in place (in the eyes of the members)?

    02. Privacy. It was mentioned that previous posts etc would remain private. If sub-forumed, would access to the forum still be confined to members only and future posts kept private?

    03. If sub-forumed, would this require the previously hosted forum to be assigned new moderators or would moderation fall under the forum that it is subbed under?

    Thanks :)


  • #2


    LoLth wrote: »
    Boards.ie forums and despite the intention to have them as temporary add-ons, this was never really applied and some hosted forums have become almost permanent fixtures with a community of their own - and thats great to see but...

    ...finally active forums: ideally these would be merged or sub-forumed but some may be better suited to a single thread in a parent forum (active could still be content light, just consistently updated over time)...

    ...The end goal is to clear down the current Hosted Forums, thats the decision , however how we do that and timeframe etc is not set in stone so thats what we would appreciate input on.

    I understand the decision has been made. But how it saddens me to think of losing our hosted forums, or pairing them down to one thread. You have no idea how important they have become to some posters, a community has been formed. I don't understand one thing (of many) - the hosted forums I belong to have always conformed to boards standards. Once we lost the social groups, it was, well... I don't think you could understand the bonds formed, without being a member... and like you said, you've made your decision. I, for one, post on boards for the hosted forums - they are what Boards was all about, a real community feel, unlike any other place online. The Hforums I belong to are among the busiest on boards (I believe). To lessen them to a single thread is a loss beyond words. With the new setup (away from legacy) you took away albums, friending, visitor messaging. Instead of going toward the trend of building a social community, you seem to be lessening it with this additional changes of removing social groups/hosted forums. I don't understand the thinking. It's a personal loss I don't want to even consider :( truly saddens me.


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    I don't really understand why this has suddenly become an issue? Seems that most private forums have been allowed to peacefully exist on boards for years and now all of a sudden there's a push to change them?

    If they're inactive or go against the boards ToU, then of course they should be closed. But I just don't see the point of shutting down or merging active communities when there doesn't seem to be any major issues with keeping them as they are. Sure they were originally intended to be temporary but I'm sure many posters would argue that they've earned their place on boards.


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    I frequent two Hosted Forums, Latverian People's Army and Motivation and Personal Development, which are major draws for me, besides the forums I mod. Would hate to see them go. Would serve boards well if they become a sub-forum.


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    I agree with all the comments that have been posted so far. I'd say lots of people would leave/stop posting if this were to go through. For lots of us, some of these hosted forums have been veritable lifelines.


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    Looks like I am in a minority of one in not having the faintest idea about any of them then.


  • #2


    looksee wrote: »
    Looks like I am in a minority of one in not having the faintest idea about any of them then.

    I don't know about them either tbh. Chelsea and Spurs forum are only ones I'm aware of, and the ones you have to join to see, have no idea what goes on, or how you even find them.


  • #2


    Whats up with boards constantly pushing established users away?
    How many feet do ye have that ye keep having to shot them.


    As dougal said. Have ye nothing better to be doing.
    Reeks of a jobsworth which is indicative of the 'direction' boards have gone in the last few years.


  • #2


    In my 11 years on boards I have had 20,000 posts- and about 10,000 of these are from hosted forums.

    Like others have said, they are communities and valuable resources. I have made many friends from hosted forums and would be very sad to see them go. You mention people establishing their communities elsewhere. I don't understand why boards is actively trying to lose members right now?

    I understand that dead hosted forums need to be culled- so so do all dead forums!
    One hosted forum I'm a member of has had over 5,000 posts this month! Another is hitting 2,000. Surely these can't just be obliterated??

    Will any of the popular and active hosted forums be turned into a 'real' forum of it's own, or is this the death knell for them all?


  • #2


    There's loads of dead Hosted forums, these should be closed & privately archived. The active Hosted forums, should just be made private Boards forums (keeping existing access masks so nobody loses access, but possibly requiring some altered charters to bring them in line with current site tou's, though nothing untoward should be going on in them anyway)...then there's zero difference made to anyone. Rename the Hosted area to something like New Forum Testing, & use it to grow new forums & communities.

    This doesn't need to be a big deal, simply a very slight change of address for any active hosted forums, get rid of the dead ones, keep/maintain their existing privacy structure, & move on.


  • #2


    I agree with others. They are a vital lifeline to a lot of posters enabling them to open up about themselves. I have made some great friends on a number of hosted forums I have. A lot of the public fora, it is hard to maintain a community spirit.

    Similar to Posy, my post count is 39K, with 21K being in hosted fora.

    The vast majority would slot under Social & Fun category.. I would be concerned about privacy issues if the active ones were moved & made public.

    There is a wide variety of threads on the ones I frequent, which I am sure happen on the ones I don't. So, I cannot see how a super-thread would be feasible.

    The charters all have the core Boards terms of use at their heart. In all my years on Boards, I have only seen one person kicked out of a hosted forum and it was for breaching one of these rules.

    As we are one community & family of posters in effect, they are the most well-behaved forums.


  • #2


    The OP is very confusing.

    All I know is that if the active private social forums that I care about are closed or impacted negatively then I don't see any reason for me to post on boards.ie. It's the only reason I didn't leave ages ago.

    I couldn't give a crap about closing the dead ones if I'm honest.




  • #2


    What'll happen to the mods on hosted forums. The ODG forum was created as a result of the tGC mods closing down the online dating threads and those of us who use/used online dating not having anywhere to go to discuss it.

    A private group was created, and when they were closed it was made into a hosted forum. Now hosted forums are being closed so are we going full circle and back to a thread in tHC or TLL? Or even worse, AH?

    And what'll happen the mods? Will they be made mods of the new parent forums? They're hmods for a reason, the user base likes them and they are active in those forums.


  • #2


    List of public hosted forums for anyone interested. If people wanted to start mentioning the Private ones that up to them, might give people more of an understanding.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=80

    Personally, I think the management are going in the wrong direction here they are digging up a non issue for some reason.


  • #2


    Another nail in the almost shut coffin lid.

    I lurked for a while then started posting in 2008. I have been a member of a number of private hosted forums and am a member of a couple of public hosted forums now.

    Maybe it is felt that if the hosted forums are closed, posters will naturally migrate to the regular forums and create a facade of a more active and popular site.

    As others have said, it's all thats keeping me here.

    Dont get me wrong, the site is ok but the general population is a mixed bag of idiot rereg fcuktards and argumentative drama queens looking to get a rise out of people. The decent folk are easily overshadowed.

    The hosted forums I frequent and the people in them are all thats good about the place.

    Boards, now yer leavin'


  • #2


    I agree with everything that's been said so far. I frequent two private forums regularly and there is a real sense of community in them that I can't find anywhere else on the site, I've made good friends who I love talking too everyday and I would be very sad if they were taken away from us, by all means close the ones that are dead but please leave the active ones alone.


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    So the point of this thread is to discuss the severity of what is going to happen rather than if it should happen at all?


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    This post has been deleted.


  • #2


    I agree with the majority of posters here. I pretty much only frequent two private forums and the sense of security and community in these two amazing forums is unrivalled.

    I have been blessed to have gained many a friend over the years and I would be deeply upset if we should lose these community spirited forums.


  • #2


    Inviere wrote: »
    There's loads of dead Hosted forums, these should be closed & privately archived. The active Hosted forums, should just be made private Boards forums (keeping existing access masks so nobody loses access, but possibly requiring some altered charters to bring them in line with current site tou's, though nothing untoward should be going on in them anyway)...then there's zero difference made to anyone. Rename the Hosted area to something like New Forum Testing, & use it to grow new forums & communities.

    This doesn't need to be a big deal, simply a very slight change of address for any active hosted forums, get rid of the dead ones, keep/maintain their existing privacy structure, & move on.

    I agree with every word of this. So simple it's amazing it hasn't been thought of in 2 years.

    Was it like the love day ep of the Simpsons.

    Bossman to admins- we need to get rid of the hosted forums bring me ideas.Leaves room

    Admins-So lets close the hosted forums, beer anyone.


  • #2


    Did any of ye actually read the bit about the active hosted forums?


  • #2


    Did any of ye actually read the bit about the active hosted forums?

    That they're taking advantage of free hosting? Yep. Read that. Or that some will be moved to single threads, etc. Yep. Read that. As has been said. Communities have been formed and now posters fear they'll be disbanded or changed in some way. Posters don't want that is what I take from the thread so far.


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