Your Training Paces

Itziger

I've been wondering a bit about this and if it might not be useful to compare and contrast our key training paces and maybe make adjustments as we see feedback coming in. I used to run almost all my training in a very narrow window, now I try to take it easier on rec. runs for example. Anyway, I'll begin, and please feel free to comment and add your own.

5k rep. pace - 3.30/km even though the only timed 5k was 17.50!
10k rep. pace - 3.40/km, which I have almost achieved in a race (36.48)

LT pace - 3.50/km. I use this as a benchmark and it also serves as HM pace.
M pace - 4.10/km. I've recently achieved 4.14 in an actual Marathon so will aim for this or a tiny bit faster in next cycle.
Steady - 4.35/km or so
Easy - between 4.45 when I'm in good form and 5.00/km when things don't feel so easy.
Recovery - 5.10/km or so.

Thoughts?

adrian522

With apologies for the use of the Imperial system

LT - 6:50
HM - 7:00
M - 7:40-7:50
Steady - 8:10 ish
Easy 8:30-9:00
Recovery 9:00-9:45

10K Pace: 6:35
5K Pace 6:25

Testosterscone

adrian522 wrote: »

With apologies for the use of the Imperial system

Never apologize, its a homage to Lydiard

At the moment haven't been doing an awful lot of LT or MP work

Race Paces:
5K Pace 5.13
10K Pace: 5.28

Training:
LT - 5.35-5.45
MP - 6.00-6.10
Steady - 6.30-6.45
Easy 7.20-8.00
Recovery 8.10-9.30

To be honest only check the watch to reaffirm effort levels, If paces are slow/quick I will take note as long as the effort is right

Swashbuckler

Itziger wrote:

5k rep. pace - 3.30/km even though the only timed 5k was 17.50! 10k rep. pace - 3.40/km, which I have almost achieved in a race (36.48)

Great idea for a thread. Couple of questions and I'll post my own paces soon.

Are these the paces you actually train at or the ones recommended from an online calculator?

When you say 10k rep pace what do you mean?

Duanington

Good idea for a thread

MP, easy and steady pace are the three points of focus for me at the moment...so...

MP - 6.30ish
Steady - 7-7.10
Easy - 8.00-8.40

With regard to easy pace, I really feel its something we're all guilty of overcooking. Especially during period of high volume.
Common sense tells me to stay nice and slow...and yet the pace tends to creep up ( along with effort). Currently on a course of antibiotics so anything other than easy pace is off the cards for another few days, I'm spending my time refocusing the mind on enjoying the actual easy pace, myself and FBOT from these parts bumped into a top 10 finisher from DCM recently who was out for his easy miles and he politely informed us that we were running a little quicker than he normally would....

Perspective !

Itziger

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Great idea for a thread. Couple of questions and I'll post my own paces soon.

Are these the paces you actually train at or the ones recommended from an online calculator?

When you say 10k rep pace what do you mean?

'Buckler, I'm a bit of an amateur when it comes to this stuff compared to some on here. To answer the second question first, If I plan on doing say W/u + T + 3x1k @10k pace (repeat)............ then I use the approx 10k pace for the 3x1k section, D'ya know what I mean?

As for the first question, I do train at those paces although how I came to arrive at them, I can barely remember. I suppose I had goals and thought, well if I want to run 36.40 then 10k pace is 3.40. Just a shame I rarely hit the goals. But I do try! And before the 3.40 there was 3.45 and 3.50 and 4.00. So I have progressed somewhat. One of the biggest kicks I got in running was when I completed a Half in under 4 min/km pace. For a few years before that I thought I'd never achieve it.

Itziger

Duanington wrote: »

Good idea for a thread

MP, easy and steady pace are the three points of focus for me at the moment...so...

MP - 6.30ish
Steady - 7-7.10
Easy - 8.00-8.40

With regard to easy pace, I really feel its something we're all guilty of overcooking. Especially during period of high volume.
Common sense tells me to stay nice and slow...and yet the pace tends to creep up ( along with effort). Currently on a course of antibiotics so anything other than easy pace is off the cards for another few days, I'm spending my time refocusing the mind on enjoying the actual easy pace, myself and FBOT from these parts bumped into a top 10 finisher from DCM recently who was out for his easy miles and he politely informed us that we were running a little quicker than he normally would....

Perspective !

Interesting, isn't it. I see some fellas on Strava, way quicker than me but who I do wonder about. "Easy" miles are barely 6 mins. They may be quicker than me, but they're not Mo Fuppin' Farah either. I have dialled my Easy back by a few seconds and to be honest I could probably do with adding another 5 seconds per km to it. But sure we're all still learning I guess.

Duanington

Itziger wrote: »

Interesting, isn't it. I see some fellas on Strava, way quicker than me but who I do wonder about. "Easy" miles are barely 6 mins. They may be quicker than me, but they're not Mo Fuppin' Farah either. I have dialled my Easy back by a few seconds and to be honest I could probably do with adding another 5 seconds per km to it. But sure we're all still learning I guess.

Those fellas probably do feel that the miles fall into the " easy" category but then maybe they have just become accustomed to the pace that they run their daily runs at as opposed to it being actually easy.
I'm sure for some people 7 min\miles genuinely feels pretty easy but you have to wonder if its more of a case of they have just settled into that level over time - I often wonder if you place HR data beside "easy" runs , what the picture would look like.

Singer

5k: 3:42/km
10k: 3:52/km
MP: 7:15ish/mile
Steady: 7:45-7:30/mile
Easy: 8:00 - 8:45/mile
Recovery: At least 9:00/mile

The precise 5k/10k times are 'cos I just finished up training for those distances Most of the time I think I should probably slow down my recovery and easy paces, though I'm definitely not flogging myself. Anywhere near 8:00 for easy only happens when I'm feeling perky, a lot of the time it'll be more towards 8:30.

Following different people on Strava provides some good perspective. Krusty regularly knocks out a bunch of 8:xx minute mile runs and makes me feel guilty about feeling like 9:00 is a slow run On the other side, there's a guy in work who basically runs the same fast-ish pace all the time, and I was initially impressed at his speed - until I realised he was basically running hard all the time, and his PBs were vastly inferior to my own

Testosterscone

Duanington wrote: »

- I often wonder if you place HR data beside "easy" runs , what the picture would look like.

Generally my easy runs average around the 140-150 bpm mark which in comparison my race HR s tend to average 175-183 with the higher being better races (between 5k and 10 mile) when was able to dig deeper

quick feet

It seems like I've alot to learn, I'm currently working off the following..
Long run 8.15m.m
M.pace 7.30-40
Aerobic 8.15-30
Lactate 6.50-7.0m.m
Recovery 8.30+
The slower stuff still looks too fast compared to others...

Swashbuckler

Just recently completed a block of training for a sub 40 attemept. Managed to achieve it in killarney with a 37:50. As fate would have it my garmin wouldn't power up so I had to run on feel. If I had the watch I probably would have pulled myself back to 4min km pace. Anyway the training for that sub 40 had;

5k race pace - 3.47/km giving pb at Tralee parkrun of 18:55.
200m intervals at around 42s per interval. I think that's 3:30 pace.
600m intervals at 3:45/km
1k intervals at 3:45/km
The Mcmillan 10k sessions 6x1m etc at 4min/km.
Progressive long 16k run starting at 4:50/km and finishing close to 4min/km.

LT pace - 4:15/km.
Tempo - 4:05/km
Easy - 4:45/km and have to hold myself back at times. Find it hard to sit back unless I'm genuinely fecked from the previous day.
Recovery - 5.10/km
Mix of hill runs thrown in too.

I find it very hard to judge what pace I should be running some runs at such as tempo and LT. The Mcmillan calculator says one thing but then different days feel different. Some days a 4:05 tempo was very difficult. Other days it was just comfortably hard.

Where to go next is the question. 37:50 was a bit of a shock to me. Not sure if I should now be changing my paces and targeting faster or should I keep going as I have been.

Swashbuckler

Singer wrote:

Following different people on Strava provides some good perspective.

Only recently started using Strava. Out of interest how does one find lads like Krusty or is it more of a buddies thing?

Singer

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Only recently started using Strava. Out of interest how does one find lads like Krusty or is it more of a buddies thing?

Lookup the 1st place M45 runner in the Rotterdam marathon this year and put the name into Strava

Or just join the boards club: https://www.strava.com/clubs/22198

Itziger

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Just recently completed a block of training for a sub 40 attemept. Managed to achieve it in killarney with a 37:50. As fate would have it my garmin wouldn't power up so I had to run on feel. If I had the watch I probably would have pulled myself back to 4min km pace. Anyway the training for that sub 40 had;

5k race pace - 3.47/km giving pb at Tralee parkrun of 18:55.
200m intervals at around 42s per interval. I think that's 3:30 pace.
600m intervals at 3:45/km
1k intervals at 3:45/km
The Mcmillan 10k sessions 6x1m etc at 4min/km.
Progressive long 16k run starting at 4:50/km and finishing close to 4min/km.

LT pace - 4:15/km.
Tempo - 4:05/km
Easy - 4:45/km and have to hold myself back at times. Find it hard to sit back unless I'm genuinely fecked from the previous day.
Recovery - 5.10/km
Mix of hill runs thrown in too.

I find it very hard to judge what pace I should be running some runs at such as tempo and LT. The Mcmillan calculator says one thing but then different days feel different. Some days a 4:05 tempo was very difficult. Other days it was just comfortably hard.

Where to go next is the question. 37:50 was a bit of a shock to me. Not sure if I should now be changing my paces and targeting faster or should I keep going as I have been.

Your times (well some of 'em anyway!) are very similar to mine. Are you planning any Half or Marathon this year/next?

If you were targeting 39.xx and you ran 37.50 it does suggest you were underestimating your ability alright. I'd leave the slower paces alone or I'd cool down that easy pace a smidgin. I notice you don't have a Steady or General Aerobic pace there. Big gap between 4.14 and 4.45.

Swashbuckler

Itziger wrote:

If you were targeting 39.xx and you ran 37.50 it does suggest you were underestimating your ability alright. I'd leave the slower paces alone or I'd cool down that easy pace a smidgin. I notice you don't have a Steady or General Aerobic pace there. Big gap between 4.14 and 4.45.

Itziger wrote:

Your times (well some of 'em anyway!) are very similar to mine. Are you planning any Half or Marathon this year/next?

Thanks for the comments. I have run half's in the past with a pb of 1:31:30 but my fitness has come on since then. No immediate plans of moving up as we have a baby in the way so I expect the running to suffer a bit.

My long ten mile run starts out at around 4:50 and finishes up at around 4min. So probably four or five miles are spent jn the region you're talking about if that makes sense? Maybe that's wrong approach.

Coffee Fulled Runner

Looking for a bit of advice on traning paces. Bit of background my last two race times were September '16 half marathon was 83:56 and October '16 5km was 17:59. Picked up a serious enough injury in October. I'm back running 3 months now with one month training. My endurance obviously isn't what it was a year ago but I still have some speed in me. I've no races in mind but will be targeting 5kms when I feel I'm ready. Just wondering how much should I readjust my paces? One of my last sessions was 4x 1mile with a 2 minute recovery with pace 4:00/km and I'm comfortable with easy runs 4:50/km at the moment.

Itziger

Decided to wear the HRM strap to see how an easy 10 miler came out. I think that's fairly good. 134 avg and only went up with the 'hills' at the end a little.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/1877494598

Swashbuckler

Itziger wrote:

Decided to wear the HRM strap to see how an easy 10 miler came out. I think that's fairly good. 134 avg and only went up with the 'hills' at the end a little.

You read my mind.was going to ask..are there benefits in doing a long slow run when targeting 10k and 5k races or do the benefits show more in half and full marathons. I do a progressive ten miler starting at 4.45 pace and working to faster pace each mile. Is this the wrong approach? Should I just be focusing on "time on the feet"?

Duanington

Itziger wrote: »

Decided to wear the HRM strap to see how an easy 10 miler came out. I think that's fairly good. 134 avg and only went up with the 'hills' at the end a little.
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/1877494598

Looks good alright !

Phonehead

Generally try to keep somewhere close to the Jack Daniels VDOT

Easy: 4:45/km - 5:10/km
Marathon Pace effort: around 4:10/km - 4:15/km
Threshold: 3:50/km but sometimes OR most times I can lose the run of myself and end up closer to 3:40/km
Reps: 3:15/km - 3:25/km

Itziger

Swashbuckler wrote: »

You read my mind.was going to ask..are there benefits in doing a long slow run when targeting 10k and 5k races or do the benefits show more in half and full marathons. I do a progressive ten miler starting at 4.45 pace and working to faster pace each mile. Is this the wrong approach? Should I just be focusing on "time on the feet"?

I'd say there's room for both. I think for most of us the easy stuff is the bread and butter and should not be ignored. Those in the know tell us there are many benefits. I find the progression runs are best kept for the race prep weeks, say 3 or 4 weeks out. I feel they bring you on and sharpen you up.

When I ran my Half PB I did a few progression runs which went roughly 4kE+4kM+4kHM+4k faster than HM. Now that I type that, it sounds fairly brutal. I'll have to look aback at the session and get back to you. 4k faster than HM sounds WRONG!