Hypothetical about TV series

by8auj6csd3ioq

In the UK series The Loch the police invite all the residents of the town to a meeting about the murder and get them to fill in a form to secretly obtain a sample of their handwriting to compare with handwriting found at scene. Would that be entrapment  and would it be admissable in court if it happened in Ireland or indeed would  in the uk. This is just something i am wondering about as to how correct the series is legally and is hypothetical. The series is not over yet so i do not know if they will try to use it as evidence

Samuel T. Cogley

My favourite is the 'apology letter' in 'The Wire'. That and the '****' scene but that's not really related :pac:

Most certainly NSFW:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOyvDRxK--o

Victor

Crosby Hissing Snorkel wrote: »

Would that be entrapment 

Entrapment is when a police officer (or other prosecuting authority) encourages the accused to commit a crime. It is not when a police officer (etc.) allows someone to commit a crime or watches someone commit a crime, unbeknownst to the offender. It is not when a police officer (etc.) encourages the accused to implicate themselves.

I'm not certain which jurisdiction it applied to, but samples given voluntarily can be retained by the police, but negative samples given under a statutory provision usually have to be destroyed within a certain period. There may be legislation on this.

Note that handwriting evidence isn't conclusive in itself. I have 3 different handwriting styles and sometimes slip between them. Alternatively, get someone to write the same word 10 times and you'll find a lot of variation. Additionally, it is one thing to write something, but another to have committed an associated murder.

There is case law in the UK related to the police looking for blood samples to extract DNA. Not only could someone implicate themselves, they could also implicate their relations. Or the milkman.

Samuel T. Cogley

If Jack doesn't mind I'd love to see this as a general pop-culture legal ploys thread. It's been a while since we've had something similar and they're always great craic. Still need to watch Rumpole!

Mod
Good idea, carry on

Grolschevik

Always on about your Rump Hole...

Samuel T. Cogley

Grolschevik wrote: »

Always on about your Rump Hole...

In fairness as we're all well aware it's where I speak out of...

NUTLEY BOY

Grolschevik wrote: »

Always on about your Rump Hole...

Some respect please !

Rumpole appeared for the defence in the Penge Bungalow murders without a leading counsel (Q.C.) and he became quite a reputed whiz in the matter of bloodstains before DNA.......

NUTLEY BOY

As far as the handwriting evidence goes would that fall foul of any exclusionary rules on the basis that the purpose of the taking of the evidence was to incriminate the "suspects" without their knowing and thus allowing them to self-incriminate without prior caution ?

Discodog

The writers won't of researched the legalities. The series is total farce. No one wandering around Loch Ness has ever met anyone like the supposed characters. At least Midsummer & Broadchurch are fictional places & Morse failed to convince that a murder happens every week in Oxford

Samuel T. Cogley

Discodog wrote: »

The writers won't of researched the legalities. The series is total farce. No one wandering around Loch Ness has ever met anyone like the supposed characters. At least Midsummer & Broadchurch are fictional places & Morse failed to convince that a murder happens every week in Oxford

Growing up less than half a mile from Inspector Morse's favourite haunt and frequently playing in Wytham Woods, I can assure you that the murder rate was definitely exaggerated, a bit :pac:

My Mum's car is in one of the episodes! Claim to fame.

Marcusm

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Growing up less than half a mile from Inspector Morse's favourite haunt and frequently playing in Wytham Woods, I can assure you that the murder rate was definitely exaggerated, a bit :pac:

My Mum's car is in one of the episodes! Claim to fame.

She didn't die, she pretended to be his wife! I have a semi encyclopediacal recollection of the Morse novels.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

by8auj6csd3ioq

"As far as the handwriting evidence goes would that fall foul of any exclusionary rules on the basis that the purpose of the taking of the evidence was to incriminate the "suspects" without their knowing and thus allowing them to self-incriminate without prior caution ?" That is what i wondered


"If Jack doesn't mind I'd love to see this as a general pop-culture legal ploys thread. It's been a while since we've had something similar and they're always great craic. Still need to watch Rumpole!" I don't mind

Look up the rate in Murder She Wrote for the size of the place

by8auj6csd3ioq

"The writers won't of researched the legalities" They should have if they are going to write realism

cml387

Rumpole (against his reservations) once got involved in a divorce case.

The crux of the matter was a series of nasty typed notes exchanged between husband and wife ("To my so-called husband etc. etc.")

Rumpole deduced that the notes were typed on the same machine, in fact the one in Rumpole's chambers, and he successfully unmasked the writer.

A conciliation was organised.


Mind you he was accused of completely buggering up the work in Family Court.

GerardKeating

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

And apparently, a rural town in Maine has the highest murder rate in the word, even higher that East LA, El Salvador and Honduras. it had 274 killings in 11 years. despite a populated on only 3,500.

by8auj6csd3ioq

Now you've had your fun about rumps hole, inspector morse and someone's mother's car can we get back on topic.? :-)

As NUTLEY BOY put it "As far as the handwriting evidence goes would that fall foul of any exclusionary rules on the basis that the purpose of the taking of the evidence was to incriminate the "suspects" without their knowing and thus allowing them to self-incriminate without prior caution ?"

Samuel T. Cogley

Crosby Hissing Snorkel wrote: »

Now you've had your fun about rumps hole, inspector morse and someone's mother's car can we get back on topic.? :-)

As NUTLEY BOY put it "As far as the handwriting evidence goes would that fall foul of any exclusionary rules on the basis that the purpose of the taking of the evidence was to incriminate the "suspects" without their knowing and thus allowing them to self-incriminate without prior caution ?"

The other issue you'll have is you're asking aboiut Irish law when really you should be asking about English Law. Our constitutional protections would likely exclude the evidence - or would they given the current SC - whereas in England and Wales?

Edit: Or is it Scots Law sorry with it being 'the Loch'? Ock Aye so it is! Anyone familiar with Scottish rules of evidence, or do they not differ much from Ireland and or E&W?