where do I start?

LegacyUser

Bit of background - Married over 15 years now. She's had health issues but since our child was born over 10 years ago she's gotten worse in that what were physical limitations have impacted on her mental health.l. I'm sure it's depression. Been to a marriage counsellor few years back, she didn't take it seriously. And issues went unresolved. Doesn't get on with her own mother and sister - they basically do things without her, so shopping days out / girls weekend/ holidays etc. Most recent was when they both went on a holiday abroad and my wife found out weeks later - wasn't contacted. This has happened numerous times.

My wife has had constant issues with my family - it's like they're simply not good enough. Over the past 5 or 6 years, She's pretty much disengaged from my family, so big doesn't bother visiting or getting involved in events like Christmas, family events (deaths / communions / reunions). It's become so normal now that this doesn't really bother me - I just make my own arrangements to visit my own family around the country and don't involve my wife in these plans. Before it used ikead to weeks of friction in the run up to a visit follows usually by a pist Mortem and / or an argument.

So what prompted me to write this evening was that I returned from a weekend away visiting family. My wife decided to do a spring clean - so basically binned a lot of important and sentimental stuff belong to me. Included some photos of me and my mum from the 1970s - she's still alive but these meant a lot to me, I was furious but calmly confronted her and said she'd no right to bin my stuff. This is not the forts time this has happened and I've found my stuff by chance in the bin previously. It means bailuely nothing to her and she can't understand why I get so wound up. She said I was being aggressive and shouting - I deliberately stayed calm but she's uses this technique to shut me down previously. I'm not sure how I'm meant to react in these situations when I found it by chance I the bin. One of my wife's characteristics is that she's completely unsentimental - absolutely no interest in hanging On to anything. I find this difficult because I'm sentimental.

It's not the first time it's happened. She's binned stuff on me before and I've found it by chance in the bin. Likewise stuff from our son - toys, art work, uniforms, pretty much anything goes. I like to offer this stuff to relations who have children similar ages. It's usually welcomed.

Dial Hard

What's your actual question here, OP? How to change her? Because that's not going to happen at this stage.

Do you love your wife? I don't think you mentioned that at all.

Neyite

She can be as unsentimental as she likes - with her own stuff.

Yours and your children's stuff belongs to you and it's not her decision to bin that stuff. You are not extensions of her - you are persons in your own right and your things belong to you. The home belongs to you too.

I'd suggest counselling. It sounds like you both have lost your way in communicating and you seem to just be two adults in a house-share rather than a couple who respect each other as people. I mean, you could childishly do tit for tat and 'bin' something she values but in this situation where you are already being accused of being aggressive or shouty, I think that would only escalate the problem and lead to accusations of being controlling or abusive behaviour, so while it's very tempting, be the better person and don't do that.

Dial Hard

Neyite wrote:

I'd suggest counselling. It sounds like you both have lost your way in communicating

They've been and the wife didn't engage.

I hate to say it but I just can't see the wife changing after 15 years of this behaviour and unsuccessful counselling. It sounds like she doesn't see a problem with her behaviour so from her point of view, why *should* she change? I think the OP is stuck between a rock and a very hard place on this one.

Neyite

Dial Hard wrote: »

They've been and the wife didn't engage.

I hate to say it but I just can't see the wife changing after 15 years of this behaviour and unsuccessful counselling. It sounds like she doesn't see a problem with her behaviour so from her point of view, why *should* she change? I think the OP is stuck between a rock and a very hard place on this one.

Ah. I missed that bit.

OP, can you live with this then, or is it something that is making you feel like leaving is the only option? Do you see any other options available to you?

woodchuck

I'm going to play devils advocate in relation to binning your stuff. She was home alone for the weekend and decided to do a spring clean. This is very difficult to do when a lot of the stuff belongs to another person. Yes, she probably should have set your stuff aside for you to go through later, but in her eyes it was all junk so didn't see the big deal. You admitted yourself that you were furious. I believe you when you say you tried not to so show it, but just because you don't raise your voice, doesn't mean another person can't pick up on the underlying tone. For this specific issue, now that the dust has settled, just explain that in future you'd like her to put your stuff aside for you to go through yourself before she throws it away (maybe commit to doing this within a reasonable timeframe too, as nobody wants to put up with a pile of "junk" sitting around for ages).

However... while you say this is the issue that brought you here, there are obviously a lot of underlying issues too. It sounds like she could use some counselling/therapy (for herself, not just couples counselling), but unfortunately you can drag a horse to water and all that. All you can do is decide whether or not you can live with her as she is. Otherwise I think you need to make it clear to here where things are headed. Maybe it will be the wake up call she needs to get herself sorted.

judeboy101

OP, life's too short for that crap, it's only going to get worse when she gets older. My suggestion support her to get help and if she says no start recording ****, lawyer up and you and kids get out of there. Get her mum to support u and kids get her sectioned.

Neyite

judeboy101 wrote: »

OP, life's too short for that crap, it's only going to get worse when she gets older. My suggestion support her to get help and if she says no start recording ****, lawyer up and you and kids get out of there. Get her mum to support u and kids get her sectioned.

You can't just "get someone sectioned" any more. And it's been decades since you could dispose of an inconvenient spouse by getting the local Garda and Priest to march her off to the loony bin so you get to keep all the marital assets and the kids.

The Op's wife is nowhere near that kind of MH crisis. She 'may' be depressed and did a big spring clean, and may be a bit manipulative in an argument? Not grounds for sectioning or even admission to a bed. Our health system is creaking with people who have urgent MH issues, the best she'd get is a long wait for an appointment as an outpatient.

If the OP is genuinely at the end with regards to his marriage then he does need to talk to a solicitor and see what his options are.

leggo

I'm not saying leave your wife but...

...the procedure and the reality is: someone in the relationship sits the other down and tells their partner what is bothering them, this is what they want done (e.g. counselling taken seriously) and, if it's not, this is what will happen (e.g. I'm willing to end this). The other person then has the right to do what they want and face the consequences, whatever they are. If there are no real consequences, stubborn people likely won't change. Some just can't change, it's their personality and the amount of work required to make them 'happy' is insurmountable because they're used to being themselves.

The thing that fills me a bit with dread here is that this seems to be your wife's personality and no amount of loss, be it with your family or hers, can change that. People who are willing to lose everything are generally at an extremely low ebb of unhappiness within themselves and, when you get to that stage, there's not much anyone else can do. Some carry on burning bridges and being bitter and angry for the rest of their lives whereas some bottom out and decide to get happy. But it has to come from them.

So I'm not saying leave your wife but...if you feel like you've no other option to live a happy life yourself, that's okay too. But before you do or let her know of your intentions, make sure you consult all legal options first.

judeboy101

Neyite wrote: »

You can't just "get someone sectioned" any more. And it's been decades since you could dispose of an inconvenient spouse by getting the local Garda and Priest to march her off to the loony bin so you get to keep all the marital assets and the kids.

The Op's wife is nowhere near that kind of MH crisis. She 'may' be depressed and did a big spring clean, and may be a bit manipulative in an argument? Not grounds for sectioning or even admission to a bed. Our health system is creaking with people who have urgent MH issues, the best she'd get is a long wait for an appointment as an outpatient.

If the OP is genuinely at the end with regards to his marriage then he does need to talk to a solicitor and see what his options are.

OP's wife doesn't engage with family, has lack of empathy and is emotionally manipulative. We know how this story ends all too with all.

LegacyUser

Dealing with your wife's behaviour one argument at a time is going to wear you our fairly quickly, you need to be addressing the fact that she has a personality disorder. The vast majority of people wouldn't throw away someone else's photographs, or any other kind of property.
At best, they meant nothing to her and she couldn't imagine they should do for you. That inability to understand and empathise is in itself is a symptom. But it seems to me more likely that she did it to hurt you and was well aware of it, so that's the problem you're dealing with. She used to be able to use the family occasions for drama and control, but now that she's excluded, she had to find a different way to hurt you, so she took aim at family photographs. That's actually an act of violence. It's quite sinister and you may want to think I'm exaggerating, but anything important to you will now be in the firing line. Destroying possessions, particularly those with sentimental value, is quite often part of an escalating pattern of violence.

It also seems to me that you have sleepwalked through the breakdown of her relationship with both families and just kept coming up with unsatisfactory, unsustainable stop gap arrangements which have started to add up to you not actually being in a marriage anymore in order to maintain your family life. I would imagine too that both families are glad not to have to deal with her any more and probably feel sorry and worried for you.

It's time to wake up, that history is screaming at you, it's not normal and it isn't going to improve without significant professional support for your wife. It may also be that leaving the marriage is the only sensible course of action for you and you should seek legal advice as soon as you can.

Goltop36

Helpmesortthis wrote: »

Bit of background - Married over 15 years now. She's had health issues but since our child was born over 10 years ago she's gotten worse in that what were physical limitations have impacted on her mental health.l. I'm sure it's depression. Been to a marriage counsellor few years back, she didn't take it seriously. And issues went unresolved. Doesn't get on with her own mother and sister - they basically do things without her, so shopping days out / girls weekend/ holidays etc. Most recent was when they both went on a holiday abroad and my wife found out weeks later - wasn't contacted. This has happened numerous times.

My wife has had constant issues with my family - it's like they're simply not good enough. Over the past 5 or 6 years, She's pretty much disengaged from my family, so big doesn't bother visiting or getting involved in events like Christmas, family events (deaths / communions / reunions). It's become so normal now that this doesn't really bother me - I just make my own arrangements to visit my own family around the country and don't involve my wife in these plans. Before it used ikead to weeks of friction in the run up to a visit follows usually by a pist Mortem and / or an argument.

So what prompted me to write this evening was that I returned from a weekend away visiting family. My wife decided to do a spring clean - so basically binned a lot of important and sentimental stuff belong to me. Included some photos of me and my mum from the 1970s - she's still alive but these meant a lot to me, I was furious but calmly confronted her and said she'd no right to bin my stuff. This is not the forts time this has happened and I've found my stuff by chance in the bin previously. It means bailuely nothing to her and she can't understand why I get so wound up. She said I was being aggressive and shouting - I deliberately stayed calm but she's uses this technique to shut me down previously. I'm not sure how I'm meant to react in these situations when I found it by chance I the bin. One of my wife's characteristics is that she's completely unsentimental - absolutely no interest in hanging On to anything. I find this difficult because I'm sentimental.

It's not the first time it's happened. She's binned stuff on me before and I've found it by chance in the bin. Likewise stuff from our son - toys, art work, uniforms, pretty much anything goes. I like to offer this stuff to relations who have children similar ages. It's usually welcomed.

Do a spring clean of your own and bin her stuff. She won't do it again after that.

LegacyUser

Goltop36 wrote: »

Do a spring clean of your own and bin her stuff. She won't do it again after that.

Don't do this OP, pathetic, ridiculous revenge tactics will do nothing to improve the situation and will almost certainly escalate it, probably so quickly that you will be badly harmed by it, physically and/or emotionally.