Root canal options abroad

DarraghR

Hi there. I recently visited my dentist for a checkup and x-rays. After examination I was told that a root canal would be necessary. I am suffering because the tooth was previously cracked but repaired. Also have grinding problems at night.

I have signed up with the Dental Hospital located in Dublin City in order to get it done for as little as possible.

My girlfriend is Polish so maybe going to Poland would be a good option. Or could someone suggest any other countries or options.

The tooth in question is top row 3rd from the back. I heard back ones are a bit more complicated. What price would we be talking?

Makood

If it's a dentist your girlfriend recommends and you are travelling to Poland anyway, go for it.

uck51js9zml2yt

we get dental work done in slovakia...again...local knowledge!

DarraghR

Thanks for the feedback guys.

In the end I got an assessment done in the Dental Hospital and now I am on a waiting list. Estimated time will be some date after Summer. Because I hold a medical card there will be no fee.

Idbatterim

its a root canal, what are they, E400-600? going abroad seems a bit extreme! wait till you pay all the trip related expenses, not worth it...

DarraghR

Yes at least. Accommodation would be free as I would be staying in my girlfriends parents. Flights would be 100 max. The root canal procedure can be done for as little as 150 over there.

My friend went through the Dental Hospital in Dublin before for a root canal and paid 250 which isnt bad

Idbatterim

that isnt bad at all!

Fishorsealant

But are cost and value the same thing ?
They certainly aren't in my mind.

Cheaper isn't always better!
Short term savings might not equate to long term savings.

Oral Surgeon

DarraghR wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback guys.

In the end I got an assessment done in the Dental Hospital and now I am on a waiting list. Estimated time will be some date after Summer. Because I hold a medical card there will be no fee.

You will be seen and treated by a student who be inexperienced in doing molar root canal treatments.... Most qualified dentists pass on molar root canal treatments because they are tricky.... your call....

DarraghR

They do have some experience and are monitored. No problem with my mates work anyway. Maybe if dentists weren't such a rip off in this country I might pay the fee ...

uck51js9zml2yt

I'm getting a root canal done here by a specialist even though I've the option of it being done by someone I know in Slovakia.
It's costing me 690.
The additional costs if it goes wrong abroad aren't worth the risk.

davo10

DarraghR wrote: »

They do have some experience and are monitored. No problem with my mates work anyway. Maybe if dentists weren't such a rip off in this country I might pay the fee ...

If you are in discomfort you may have to accept quite a long wait before you are seen in DDH. The "after the summer" refers to the time of year the students come back, not the time you will be seen. As you will find, molar root canals are long, finiky, clinical time consuming treatments. When it's finished you will understand why they cost so much.

Victor

Note that health / travel insurance might not cover health tourism, especially if there are complications.

A root canal will involve a minimum of 2 visits to ensure any infection is gone. The travel costs would add up.

Admittedly, in the Dental Hospital, it would take more visits, as a student is doing it. However, there is the full back-up of the hospital if there are any issues. Presumably travel is easier also.

Glenbhoy

davo10 wrote: »

If you are in discomfort you may have to accept quite a long wait before you are seen in DDH. The "after the summer" refers to the time of year the students come back, not the time you will be seen. As you will find, molar root canals are long, finiky, clinical time consuming treatments. When it's finished you will understand why they cost so much.

Root canals generally require 2 visits, to my knowledge, experienced practitioners like to leave about 4 weeks between appointments as best practice.
In dublin, you can probably get the full treatment for less than 500.
Whatever about the sense of going abroad for more expensive treatments, imo going for something like this where the likelihood of after care being required can be high would not be a good call, unless of course you're going to be there for a bit of time.

DarraghR

Luckily I have no major discomfort but I am aware this could change over time. I did have a chat with the dentist about deterioration between now and my appointment.

Thanks for all the help and advice. Fingers crossed I get it sorted soon

Makood

Callum Numerous Sinker wrote: »

I'm getting a root canal done here by a specialist even though I've the option of it being done by someone I know in Slovakia.
It's costing me 690.
The additional costs if it goes wrong abroad aren't worth the risk.

Very true, but, if it goes wrong in Ireland, what is the cost to repair? I don't mean after the treatment itself, I am talking about 6-12 months after treatment

davo10

Makood wrote: »

Very true, but, if it goes wrong in Ireland, what is the cost to repair? I don't mean after the treatment itself, I am talking about 6-12 months after treatment

Most dentists, including myself, will retreat free of charge within first 12-18 months if infection re-occurs.

Most dentists advise the placement of a crown on a molar after root canal, to protect the weakened tooth. If the patient elects not to do this and the tooth fractures as a result, unfortunately the tooth often needs to be removed and that is not covered as it is the result of not being crowned.

Stheno

davo10 wrote: »

Most dentists, including myself, will retreat free of charge within first 12-18 months if infection re-occurs.

I had this experience getting a root canal on a back tooth which had three roots.

A little bit of nerve was missed and my dentist redid it free of charge.

I was very surprised and appreciative

Makood

Stheno wrote: »

I had this experience getting a root canal on a back tooth which had three roots.

A little bit of nerve was missed and my dentist redid it free of charge.

I was very surprised and appreciative

Why surprised if I can ask?

davo10

Makood wrote: »

Why surprised if I can ask?

I suspect because as a profession, we are not renowned for our spirit of generosity.

Also from a consumer point of view, dental treatments are not covered by warranties or timeframes. If they fail it can be due to a multitude of factors so some in our profession may not be sympathetic to a patient who comes back with a reoccurrence of a previously treated issue.

Makood

davo10 wrote: »

I suspect because as a profession, we are not renowned for our spirit of generosity.

Also from a consumer point of view, dental treatments are not covered by warranties or timeframes. If they fail it can be due to a multitude of factors so some in our profession may not be sympathetic to a patient who comes back with a reoccurrence of a previously treated issue.

But the re-treatment wasn't free, the first treatment was unsuccessful. For correction of a failed treatment, was time taken off work? Lunch out? Travel expense? All adds up .

davo10

Makood wrote: »

But the re-treatment wasn't free, the first treatment was unsuccessful. For correction of a failed treatment, was time taken off work? Lunch out? Travel expense? All adds up .

Those considerations are the patient's only, not the dentists. There is no fee for re-treatment in a lot clinics, but if the dentist refused to re-do/refund, it would be up to the patient to prove that the failure was due to negligence rather than the many, many other factors which can cause a root canal to fail which are beyond the dentist's and in many cases the patient's control. Sometimes, well established, chronic infections do not heal no matter how well the treatment is done. If good clinical practice was followed and the post treatment X-ray shows well filled roots, then there is usually nothing more that could be done, the re-treatment is a gesture of goodwill.

In relation to Sthenos case, the tiny canal may only have come to light when the infection did not heal, root morphology is not "standard" or "uniform" in every tooth, though most molars have 2-3 roots, some have up to 5 and the extras sometimes are not visible on X-ray. In this case I suspect Sthenos root was curved and the apex curved in behind another root, again this happens and cannot be seen in the mouth or on X-ray, the dentist only suspects it when looking for reasons why an infection hasn't cleared.

Makood

This is not a free of charge treatment. Spin it however you like

And a large addition to your previous edited post just appeared.

davo10

Makood wrote: »

This is not a free of charge treatment. Spin it however you like

Okey dokey. As with your own post, sometimes you go back and add to it.

I should add a caveat to my earlier post about re-treatments within 12-18 months, as it is a gesture of goodwill, if a patient comes saying what you have, I'd tell them take a hike, I'll do nothing for you, go spend thousands on solicitors and expert witnesses, the X-rays/notes will show it was done well.

Makood

davo10 wrote:

I should add a caveat to my earlier post about re-treatments within 12-18 months, as it is a gesture of goodwill, if a patient comes saying what you have, I'd tell them take a hike, I'll do nothing for you, go spend thousands on solicitors and expert witnesses, the X-rays/notes will show it was done well.

I'm not sure why the agression is warranted? Attack rhe post not the poster is a boards rule.

davo10

Makood wrote: »

I'm not sure why the agression is warranted? Attack rhe post not the poster is a boards rule.

"Spin it however you like" implies some attempt to hoodwink the patient, if you say that you would be shown the door. That's the post.

Makood

davo10 wrote:

"Spin it however you like" implies some attempt to hoodwink the patient, if you say that you would be shown the door. That's the post.

No. My point it the re-treatment was not free It incurred expenses, time off work etc.

Dianthus

The average success rate of root canal treatment in specialist (endodontist) hands is 90%. They work under a microscope, usually X30 magnification.
The average general dentist only has loupes, ×2.5 magnification.
There's only so much you can do. If correct procedure was followed,& the x-rays look good, then it sometimes can be just one of these things. Doctors lose patients, dentists lose teeth- it's part& parcel of life!
Name one medical procedure relating to bacteria& the human body that has a 100% success rate.....?

Stheno

Makood wrote: »

Why surprised if I can ask?

See below.

Makood wrote: »

But the re-treatment wasn't free, the first treatment was unsuccessful. For correction of a failed treatment, was time taken off work? Lunch out? Travel expense? All adds up .

davo10 wrote: »

Those considerations are the patient's only, not the dentists. There is no fee for re-treatment in a lot clinics, but if the dentist refused to re-do/refund, it would be up to the patient to prove that the failure was due to negligence rather than the many, many other factors which can cause a root canal to fail which are beyond the dentist's and in many cases the patient's control. Sometimes, well established, chronic infections do not heal no matter how well the treatment is done. If good clinical practice was followed and the post treatment X-ray shows well filled roots, then there is usually nothing more that could be done, the re-treatment is a gesture of goodwill.

In relation to Sthenos case, the tiny canal may only have come to light when the infection did not heal, root morphology is not "standard" or "uniform" in every tooth, though most molars have 2-3 roots, some have up to 5 and the extras sometimes are not visible on X-ray. In this case I suspect Sthenos root was curved and the apex curved in behind another root, again this happens and cannot be seen in the mouth or on X-ray, the dentist only suspects it when looking for reasons why an infection hasn't cleared.[

The bit in bold was exactly the scenario I experienced, nothing to be done about it, I was surprised that the treatment was free of charge as the original was 900 euro, and was essentially treated again free of charge.

I didn't incur any costs in terms of time of work as I worked in a flexible environment, nor did I incur lunch or travel costs as at the time I commuted a large distance to work, so to me the additional treatment was completely foc.

I'm also a nervous dental patient, and it took me a while to get the original root canal, and the fear of having to undergo it again meant I waited a month or so to go back when it recurred.

Each session took over 2.5 hours, and I'd two for the retreatment, so I very much appreciated my dentist not charging me for what was essentially a no fault scenario that occured. THe dentist in question is one who helped me get comfortable with dental health treatment after a very bad experience in the past, and the root canal experience just reinforced my confidence in him.

I've referred countless people to him over the years as a result (indeed I was a referral) so perhaps it's his business model.

Oral Surgeon

Makood wrote: »

But the re-treatment wasn't free, the first treatment was unsuccessful. For correction of a failed treatment, was time taken off work? Lunch out? Travel expense? All adds up .

To put a general medical spin on things....

I (unfortunately) know of many friends/ relatives/ patients etc who have undergone unsuccessful medical/ surgical procedures... such as infected hip/knee replacements, recurrence of cancer following surgery/ chemo/ radiotherapy etc....

In those cases, money has not changed hands and the surgeon/doctor is genrally working on the public system but the tone of the conversation is not an aggressive "why has your treatment failed" it is more like "ok that hasn't worked for you, now next try the next line of treatment possible"...

For some reason in dentistry, the "consumer" mentality has taken over and the inherent variability and often unpredictability of a particular patients condition has been forgotten....

I say to patients, if you want to try to save the tooth then go to get the root canal to try to save it... If you want certainty, then I can certainly take it out- no problem....

Stheno

Oral Surgeon wrote: »

To put a general medical spin on things....

I (unfortunately) know of many friends/ relatives/ patients etc who have undergone unsuccessful medical/ surgical procedures... such as infected hip/knee replacements, recurrence of cancer following surgery/ chemo/ radiotherapy etc....

In those cases, money has not changed hands and the surgeon/doctor is genrally working on the public system but the tone of the conversation is not an aggressive "why has your treatment failed" it is more like "ok that hasn't worked for you, now next try the next line of treatment possible"...

For some reason in dentistry, the "consumer" mentality has taken over and the inherent variability and often unpredictability of a particular patients condition has been forgotten....

I say to patients, if you want to try to save the tooth then go to get the root canal to try to save it... If you want certainty, then I can certainly take it out- no problem....

Your post very well explains why I was surprised at getting the additional work foc. I was given the choice of extraction or root canal as the tooth was in a bad way, and advised that there might be complications with the root canal.

When the initial treatement failed and the work to fix it was foc I was surprised

I also am one of those people who expect to pay professionals for their time, so I expected to reimburse my dentist for any follow up.

Oral Surgeon

Stheno wrote: »

Your post very well explains why I was surprised at getting the additional work foc. I was given the choice of extraction or root canal as the tooth was in a bad way, and advised that there might be complications with the root canal.

When the initial treatement failed and the work to fix it was foc I was surprised

I also am one of those people who expect to pay professionals for their time, so I expected to reimburse my dentist for any follow up.

Bring cookies the next time you attend, even though they cost next to nothing, its the thought that counts.....:)

Stheno

Oral Surgeon wrote: »

Bring cookies the next time you attend, even though they cost next to nothing, its the thought that counts.....:)

Nah, he buys his partner jellies like wine gums, he's not a fan of fudge :pac:

helimachoptor

Oral Surgeon wrote: »

Bring cookies the next time you attend, even though they cost next to nothing, its the thought that counts.....:)

Physician treat thy self..

Unless of course they're sugar free, but then what's the point :pac:

Oral Surgeon

helimachoptor wrote: »

Physician treat thy self..

Unless of course they're sugar free, but then what's the point :pac:

Full of sugar, butter and chocolate....! Do as I say, not as I do!!

uck51js9zml2yt

Unfortunately in my case a root was missed and came to light 15 years later with no room to return to the original denstist. He's long retired ...or dead..at this point.(probably the latter)

Oral Surgeon

Callum Numerous Sinker wrote: »

Unfortunately in my case a root was missed and came to light 15 years later with no room to return to the original denstist. He's long retired ...or dead..at this point.(probably the latter)

Good enough for him after missing that canal!!

res ipsa

The only certainties in life are death & for most of us taxation.