First cut silage looks green like second cut and is lying

cacs

Walked my silage ground this evening and it's super stuff around 40cm long. Lovely leafy green stuff but it's start to lie down. It got around 90 units of N 25 unit P and 40 units k. Fertilizer is out about a month. A lot of it is start to lie and it hasn't start to head out yet. I was hoping to cut it around the first or second week in June I can't leave it down that long. What would you say

Water John

Well, you need about 45 days for that N application. I think 90 N would be high, esp nowadays.
Used to do it in the 80/90s and have pits splitting and sliding.
Next week will have no silage cut, with rain. So you are looking at the last week of May, at the earliest.

cacs

Water John wrote: »

Well, you need about 45 days for that N application.
Next week will have no silage cut, with rain. So you are looking at the last week of May, at the earliest.

That's what I thought too but I never had this leafy green it looks like well fertilised second cut. Normally I have seen more of a stem in it and a stronger body to it in first cut

mahoney_j

cathal irwin wrote: »

Walked my silage ground this evening and it's super stuff around 40cm long. Lovely leafy green stuff but it's start to lie down. It got around 90 units of N 25 unit P and 40 units k. Fertilizer is out about a month. A lot of it is start to lie and it hasn't start to head out yet. I was hoping to cut it around the first or second week in June I can't leave it down that long. What would you say

Should of cut last week,if its lodging now quality is dropping at a rapid rate ,by first or second week June it won't be good enough for any sort of growth rates on stock next winter unless supplemented

Count Mondego

mahoney_j wrote: »

Should of cut last week,if its lodging now quality is dropping at a rapid rate ,by first or second week June it won't be good enough for any sort of growth rates on stock next winter unless supplemented

He should have cut it three weeks after putting out 90 units of nitrogen?

cacs

Count Mondego wrote: »

He should have cut it three weeks after putting out 90 units of nitrogen?

Would the nitrogen not have enough time to work out of the plant

mahoney_j

cathal irwin wrote: »

Would the nitrogen not have enough time to work out of the plant

I'd of cut last week if mine ,sun and 2 runs Tedder would of sorted n and u would of had a serious quality pit if silage .aftergrass also back early June

cacs

mahoney_j wrote: »

I'd of cut last week if mine ,sun and 2 runs Tedder would of sorted n and u would of had a serious quality pit if silage .aftergrass also back early June

Maybe your right

Water John

I think if you cut last week it would have been brutal stuff. Just too much N.
I'd prefer to cut in 10 days time. that is still only the 25th May.
You are in effect trying to get the best possible outcome from an error.
Also look at the butt and see how ungreen it is.
70/75 N for first cut, next year. Don't beat yourself up over it. You'll still have good silage, just not premium.

mahoney_j

Water John wrote: »

I think if you cut last week it would have been brutal stuff. Just too much N.
I'd prefer to cut in 10 days time. that is still only the 25th May.
You are in effect trying to get the best possible outcome from an error.
Also look at the butt and see how ungreen it is.
70/75 N for first cut, next year. Don't beat yourself up over it. You'll still have good silage, just not premium.

Well agree to disagree but the crop is already lodging so quality is dropping daily now also weather for next week 10 days is Brocken .i think your overestimating the n content ,growth has been very strong last 5/6 weeks and I'd say there was well over 2 units a day on average taken up by plant .there was great power in the sun and wind last week ,that combined with tedding the crop would easily flush out any remaining n .could of got a high 70s low 80s dmd 40% plus dm crop last week what will quality be like in another week or 10 days considering crop is lodging now ,back near 70 possibly less gone from rocket fuel feed to laundered diesel type stuff that will require concentrate

TITANIUM.

Lad's maybe I'm missing something but isn't 90-100 units the recommended Nitrogen application for first cut silage?
Are ye saying that he spread to late?

Sam Kade

TITANIUM. wrote: »

Lad's maybe I'm missing something but isn't 90-100 units the recommended Nitrogen application for first cut silage?
Are ye saying that he spread to late?

You need to leave one day for every 2 units of nitrogen before cutting. If he spread 90 units it will take 45 days growth to use up the nitrogen. He should have spread less when things went late.

White Clover

TITANIUM. wrote: »

Lad's maybe I'm missing something but isn't 90-100 units the recommended Nitrogen application for first cut silage?
Are ye saying that he spread to late?

That's what they recommend for new swards.
I don't agree with poisoning grass with too much N. I think that's where the op made the mistake. 60 or 70 units is loads and cut after a month or 5 weeks. K is very important too, 40 units is about a third of what's required.

TITANIUM.

Sam Kade wrote: »

You need to leave one day for every 2 units of nitrogen before cutting. If he spread 90 units it will take 45 days growth to use up the nitrogen. He should have spread less when things went late.

Ya I understand about the uptake of nitrogen, sure he can still cut the end of may. Twill be grand op,

Mooooo

TITANIUM. wrote: »

Lad's maybe I'm missing something but isn't 90-100 units the recommended Nitrogen application for first cut silage?
Are ye saying that he spread to late?

Ideally you want to cut before the end of May so that 90 units would want to be out 45 days before hand, depends on what else it got also and if it was grazed or not

Western Pomise

Obviously growth rates depend on where you are in country but here in NW there most definitely wasn't strong growth for last 5 or 6 weeks!....mores the pity.

Water John

Interesting variety of approaches here.
Just wouldn't agree with cutting last week. That is cutting only 4 weeks after putting out 90 N. If that had been spread in splits, 6 and 4 weeks ago, I would have said, mow.

tanko

Cathal has sucklers i think, he doesn't have 800 kg Holsteins. It's always preferable to make the best silage you can but the sucklers here often get average enough silage and they never seem to loose condition on it.
If he gets it saved the last week of May/first week of June and it get a couple of good teddings and a bit of sun it'll be grand I'd say.

I said

I put out 4 bags 18-6-12 and half bag urea to the acre last week of march I won't be cutting till first week of June growth rates never really took of till the middle of April no heat in it till then.

patsy_mccabe

Too much of high quality silage is not ideal for sucklers. No harm to go more for bulk than quality in this case.

pedigree 6

Go out into the middle of the field and tell the grass that it is the 7th of June!

If that doesn't work shout out that you're going to spray the field with Roundup.

That should definitely put the fear of God into the grass and it will start to head out.:)

cacs

Sam Kade wrote: »

You need to leave one day for every 2 units of nitrogen before cutting. If he spread 90 units it will take 45 days growth to use up the nitrogen. He should have spread less when things went late.

I spread it on the 30th if march and the 7 th if april but it didn't get washed in until the 15 of april it was very dry here. So iam taking an application date of tye 15 yes it was a bit earlier withe dew but honestly not a lot as it could be seen in the ground. Got slury on the second week in march

cacs

tanko wrote: »

Cathal has sucklers i think, he doesn't have 800 kg Holsteins. It's always preferable to make the best silage you can but the sucklers here often get average enough silage and they never seem to loose condition on it.
If he gets it saved the last week of May/first week of June and it get a couple of good teddings and a bit of sun it'll be grand I'd say.

Cheers tanko your bang on i keep sucklers and weanlings. That's exactly what i was thinking yes i might loose a bit of quality but nothing that will have a dramatic effect on the bottom line. The next break in tye weather i might get it tested for N and all going well knock it.

cacs

pedigree 6 wrote: »

Go out into the middle of the field and tell the grass that it is the 7th of June!

If that doesn't work shout out that you're going to spray the field with Roundup.

That should definitely put the fear of God into the grass and it will start to head out.:)

Now we're talking