Notice period required to evict tenant?

holdingmeback

Looking for advice.
Tenant has been in property 3 years in April.
I issued rent increase letter in January and then sent contracts with new rent amount in April. I never received anything signed back from the tenant.

Now this week they said they won't be signing contract with increased rent amount and will be looking to find somewhere cheaper. But won't give a date that they'll be out by, and as they have essentially been messing me around since January I don't expect them to be in a hurry.

So I want to issue a notice to quit, but how much notice am I required to give?

Thx

Claw Hammer

holdingmeback wrote: »

Looking for advice.
Tenant has been in property 3 years in April.
I issued rent increase letter in January and then sent contracts with new rent amount in April. I never received anything signed back from the tenant.

Now this week they said they won't be signing contract with increased rent amount and will be looking to find somewhere cheaper. But won't give a date that they'll be out by, and as they have essentially been messing me around since January I don't expect them to be in a hurry.

So I want to issue a notice to quit, but how much notice am I required to give?

Thx

Non. You can't issue a notice to quit. there is no such thing in a residential letting.

holdingmeback

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Non. You can't issue a notice to quit. there is no such thing in a residential letting.

But how do I go about getting the tenant out of the property? As they have not accepted the rent increase are they not in breach of contract and are therefore required to leave?

Claw Hammer

holdingmeback wrote: »

But how do I go about getting the tenant out of the property? As they have not accepted the rent increase are they not in breach of contract and are therefore required to leave?

You have to isuue a rent arrears notice in writing and give them time to pay the arrears and warn them that their tenancy is a risk if they don't pay. You will then have to issue a notice of termination if they don't pay. If they don't leave you will have to open a dispute with and then you will have to hope that your notice of increase was valid, that your notice of arrears was valid and that your notice of termination was valid. Then you will get a determination order that the tenant shuld leave. Most likely your notice of the rent increase was not valid so you are bunched.

Really Interested

holdingmeback wrote: »

But how do I go about getting the tenant out of the property? As they have not accepted the rent increase are they not in breach of contract and are therefore required to leave?

Did you issue the notice to increase rent in the correct way, are you in a rent pressure zone, did you tell the tenant they could dispute the increase.

https://www.rtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/the-three-stages-of-a-tenancy/rent-reviews

In normal circumstances 3-4 years in property 12 weeks notice, but only in certain circumstances.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/if_your_landlord_wants_you_to_leave.html

Claw Hammer

Really Interested wrote: »

Did you issue the notice to increase rent in the correct way, are you in a rent pressure zone, did you tell the tenant they could dispute the increase.

https://www.rtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/the-three-stages-of-a-tenancy/rent-reviews

In normal circumstances 3-4 years in property 12 weeks notice, but only in certain circumstances.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/if_your_landlord_wants_you_to_leave.html

It is 28 days for a breach of condition.

holdingmeback

Claw Hammer wrote: »

You have to isuue a rent arrears notice in writing and give them time to pay the arrears and warn them that their tenancy is a risk if they don't pay. You will then have to issue a notice of termination if they don't pay. If they don't leave you will have to open a dispute with and then you will have to hope that your notice of increase was valid, that your notice of arrears was valid and that your notice of termination was valid. Then you will get a determination order that the tenant shuld leave. Most likely your notice of the rent increase was not valid so you are bunched.

The tenant is still paying rent, albeit late.
The notice of rent increase was valid and done by the book (hasn't been a rent increase in 2 years / 3 months notice given in writing).

So as they have not accepted the increase why are they not considered to be in breach of contract and would this not be grounds for tenant to leave?

Just don't really understand why I am considered to be in wrong if I've done everything above board.

Really Interested

Claw Hammer wrote: »

It is 28 days for a breach of condition.

But there lies the problem is it a breach of condition, hence why I said in normal cases.

Claw Hammer

holdingmeback wrote: »

The tenant is still paying rent, albeit late.
The notice of rent increase was valid and done by the book (hasn't been a rent increase in 2 years / 3 months notice given in writing).

So as they have not accepted the increase why are they not considered to be in breach of contract and would this not be grounds for tenant to leave?

Just don't really understand why I am considered to be in wrong if I've done everything above board.

You haven't served a notice of arrears. have you got your 3 comparitor property details?

Tigger

Claw Hammer wrote: »

It is 28 days for a breach of condition.

What condition ?

Really Interested

holdingmeback wrote: »

The tenant is still paying rent, albeit late.
The notice of rent increase was valid and done by the book (hasn't been a rent increase in 2 years / 3 months notice given in writing).

So as they have not accepted the increase why are they not considered to be in breach of contract and would this not be grounds for tenant to leave?

Just don't really understand why I am considered to be in wrong if I've done everything above board.

Did your notice of rent increase tell them they could object to PTRB?

Claw Hammer

Tigger wrote: »

What condition ?

In this case failure to pay rent. A very basic condition.

holdingmeback

Really Interested wrote: »

Did your notice of rent increase tell them they could object to PTRB?

Yep and included 3 examples of other comparable properties in area. The letter I sent included everything required on it and correct notice was provided of increase. And it's been 2 years since last increase.

Really Interested

Claw Hammer wrote: »

In this case failure to pay rent. A very basic condition.

But they paying rent late i accept, they say they not agreeing to increase. That may not be a breach of condition, as they must be informed that they can go to PRTB to object. It seems thats the first step.

Claw Hammer

Really Interested wrote: »

But they paying rent late i accept, they say they not agreeing to increase. That may not be a breach of condition, as they must be informed that they can go to PRTB to object. It seems thats the first step.

They haven't challenged the increase which means they are in arrears. Once notified they either object to the notice or they can get a 28 day notice.

whippet

You gotta love how the majority of posters here jump to the conclusion that the LL always does it wrong !!!

Tigger

whippet wrote: »

You gotta love how the majority of posters here jump to the conclusion that the LL always does it wrong !!!

I rented for 17 years and only one land lord was decent
I rented off him for 7 years and only moved on because I needed more room
The others took the complete mick and knowing my rights made them mad
If the op served notice to increase rent correctly (I don't know what the contract is for) then they should go to the prtb and look for a decision
However
They seem to think they can issue notice to quit and that makes me think that they didn't really issue correct rental increase notice which includes the info of how to challenge said increase
And if they had then theyd know that if the tenants aren't challenging but are refusing to pay the increase ( seems they would challenge if they had been informed in the notice ) then the tenants should be issued notice of rent arrears

So yeah I think it looks like a landlord who either doesn't know or doesn't care about the rules

davindub

Tigger wrote: »

So yeah I think it looks like a landlord who either doesn't know or doesn't care about the rules

Not necessarily, there is a lot of confusion about the legislation. Its not helped by some tenants / LL's/observers spreading biased or false information. But I would agree arrears letters should be sent repeatedly before notice of terminations. The LL might consider actually calculating the rent paid on a pro-rate basis to see the ageing of the arrears.

That being said, OP you need a solicitor involved, as the provider you are not afforded the leeway a tenant would have for not following the processes correctly.

holdingmeback

Tigger wrote: »

I rented for 17 years and only one land lord was decent
I rented off him for 7 years and only moved on because I needed more room
The others took the complete mick and knowing my rights made them mad
If the op served notice to increase rent correctly (I don't know what the contract is for) then they should go to the prtb and look for a decision
However
They seem to think they can issue notice to quit and that makes me think that they didn't really issue correct rental increase notice which includes the info of how to challenge said increase
And if they had then theyd know that if the tenants aren't challenging but are refusing to pay the increase ( seems they would challenge if they had been informed in the notice ) then the tenants should be issued notice of rent arrears

So yeah I think it looks like a landlord who either doesn't know or doesn't care about the rules

I can't comment on your previous experiences with landlords, but judging by your rant it would appear there's been conflict.
I, however, have always followed correct procedures and rules with all of my tenants, and the purpose of my thread was not to request commentary on this. I would be concerned if I had a tenant who didn't know their rights.

As already mentioned, the correct rent review notice was provided (not sure why everybody is challenging this?) with correct notice, examples of 3 other properties, informed about how they can challenge the increase etc.
I cannot advise on why the tenant has not challenged the increase with the PRTB. I suspect because the increased rent is still below market rent (offered based on maths I did - obviously in my interest to keep tenant in property). But as it has been 2 years since rent was reviewed I am entitled bring it closer to market rent. If the tenants are simply not accepting any increase well there's really not much more I can do.

As they have not agreed to the new rent amount my question then was around my rights to remove the tenants from the property and the correct procedure around this.

davindub

holdingmeback wrote: »

I can't comment on your previous experiences with landlords, but judging by your rant it would appear there's been conflict.
I, however, have always followed correct procedures and rules with all of my tenants, and the purpose of my thread was not to request commentary on this. I would be concerned if I had a tenant who didn't know their rights.

As already mentioned, the correct rent review notice was provided (not sure why everybody is challenging this?) with correct notice, examples of 3 other properties, informed about how they can challenge the increase etc.
I cannot advise on why the tenant has not challenged the increase with the PRTB. I suspect because the increased rent is still below market rent (offered based on maths I did - obviously in my interest to keep tenant in property). But as it has been 2 years since rent was reviewed I am entitled bring it closer to market rent. If the tenants are simply not accepting any increase well there's really not much more I can do.

As they have not agreed to the new rent amount my question then was around my rights to remove the tenants from the property and the correct procedure around this.

Sensible and fair.

Look get a solicitor, but the gist of it is, the right to terminate a tenancy is within the RTB act, you can do so for rent outstanding after 14 days, but enforcement of orders is outside the scope of the RTB. It is up to the tenant to appeal both the rent increase and termination order, but still if they ignore, you need to open a case with the RTB, wait for the mediation or adjudication (if mediation is not accepted), allow for the period given in the determination order and then go to the circuit court.

That is the worst case scenario, it takes a fairly hard tenant to resist all that pressure.

Maybe give it one last shot, a registered letter working out arrears on a pro-rate basis with a 28 day window of compliance and then issue a termination of tenancy letter. I don't think a solicitor will charge much for issuing letters, so better to get them to do it.

Graham

holdingmeback wrote: »

As they have not agreed to the new rent amount my question then was around my rights to remove the tenants from the property and the correct procedure around this.

Assuming you notice to increase the rent was in order (sounds like it was), your tenant is now in arrears.

You should now be seeking to terminate the tenancy for rent arrears. The process is outlined here:

https://www.rtb.ie/dispute-resolution/dispute-resolution/terminating-a-tenancy-for-rent-arrears

Tigger

holdingmeback wrote: »

I can't comment on your previous experiences with landlords, but judging by your rant it would appear there's been conflict.

i wsn't ranting about renting
no conflict just landlords making up their own rules and then wondering why they can't just do what they like, i rented since before the part 4 and other newer rights so i was lucky sometimes to get a rent book and they always seemed to want cash

I, however, have always followed correct procedures and rules with all of my tenants, and the purpose of my thread was not to request commentary on this. I would be concerned if I had a tenant who didn't know their rights.

As already mentioned, the correct rent review notice was provided (not sure why everybody is challenging this?) with correct notice, examples of 3 other properties, informed about how they can challenge the increase etc.
I cannot advise on why the tenant has not challenged the increase with the PRTB. I suspect because the increased rent is still below market rent (offered based on maths I did - obviously in my interest to keep tenant in property). But as it has been 2 years since rent was reviewed I am entitled bring it closer to market rent. If the tenants are simply not accepting any increase well there's really not much more I can do.

As they have not agreed to the new rent amount my question then was around my rights to remove the tenants from the property and the correct procedure around this.

the correct procedure is to issue a notice of rent arrears due to them not paying the increase
and make sure that you provided them with the correct format of rent increase. Then they should challenge the increase as a matter of course or they should pay the arrears. anything else and you will be in the right to issue them termination after they didn't make up the arrears in the allotted time.