Best Dual Counties !

Xenophile

Best Dual Counties !

Not based on research or criteria. Rankings in many cases are a matter of opinion. Here goes !

1 Galway
2 Cork
3 Dublin
4 Clare
5 Tipperary
6 Wexford
7 Limerick

Bogsnorkler

Historically Cork by a distance.

Xenophile

Bogsnorkler wrote: »

Historically Cork by a distance.

Currently ?

corny

Xenophile wrote: »

Currently ?

How would you have Tipp fifth if you're basing it on current form?. Tipp were Al Hurling champions and Football semi finalists in 2016.

On current form Dublin would likely be second.
Clear best in football and maybe 6-8 best in hurling.
Probably match Cork in hurling while dwarfing them in hurling.

But historically Cork would be first, Galway second.

Prop Joe

Kerry & Dublin the only two counties who played Div 1 this year in both codes

dxhound2005

Bogsnorkler wrote: »

Historically Cork by a distance.

A second rate power in football, only 7 All Irelands.

1890, 1911, 1945, 1973, 1989, 1990, 2010.

bmwguy

Prop Joe wrote: »

Kerry & Dublin the only two counties who played Div 1 this year in both codes

Kerry weren't division 1 hurling

FrKurtFahrt

If 'historically' surely Offaly deserve mention.

johnmcdnl

bmwguy wrote: »

Kerry weren't division 1 hurling

They were in Division 1B.

motley

Offaly are the only county in the country to have an All-Star in every position in both codes. A good measuring stick surely?

Utopia Parkway

motley wrote: »

Offaly are the only county in the country to have an All-Star in every position in both codes. A good measuring stick surely?

Not really. I'd say the best measuring stick is the ability to consistently win All-Ireland titles in both football and hurling at senior, U-21 and minor level and in both club football and hurling.

Bonniedog

Cork and Offaly in 80s were only counties since Dublin and Tipp in 20s to win All Irelands in both codes within a few years of one another- Cork of course winning a double in 1989, so by that measure, they would have it.

Currently I suppose Dublin and Galway are only counties in top tier in both, but even as a Dub I would not consider us to be anywhere near Cork and Offaly in 80s.

Xenophile

In the immediate term let's look forward to the return of Laois and Offaly to top tier competetion, both counties have been for a long time associated with both codes !

zetecescort

dxhound2005 wrote: »

A second rate power in football, only 7 All Irelands.

1890, 1911, 1945, 1973, 1989, 1990, 2010.

Senior record is poor alright but we are at the top of the u21 roll of honour and within 1 or 2 of the top in minor I think. Something like 100 All Irelands across both codes in all grades

Hammer Archer

dxhound2005 wrote: »

A second rate power in football, only 7 All Irelands.

1890, 1911, 1945, 1973, 1989, 1990, 2010.

Only 3 teams have more All Ireland football titles. And only 2 have been in more finals.

conor05

If we look at the last two years let's say at Counties that have played Divions 1a or 1b hurling and Division 1 or Division 2 hurling.

Galway - Consistently strong at both codes and especially at undedage level.
Dublin - best football team over last few years and Hurlers have done well. Again strong at underage
Cork - still a top tier team in both codes, no all all ireland since 2005 in hurling, 2010 in football.

To a lesser extent we have
Tipperary - Huge hurling county but underage football is strong and they reached semi final in 2016.
Clare - Divison 1 hurling and Division 2 football.
Laois - Still a football county but has some very strong hurling areas and they are still in 1b.
Kerry - again 75% of Kerry is football but North Kerry has a big hurling area and they have a good hurling team who stayed in 1b for 2 years. They have 1 All Ireland in hurling.
Wexford - Borderline I would say, obviously hurling on the rise again, wonder can Banty raise their footballers up to a good level again.

bmwguy

johnmcdnl wrote: »

They were in Division 1B.

Didn't even realise that, apologies

danganabu

bmwguy wrote: »

Didn't even realise that, apologies

Its still Division 2 for all intents and purposes and they were relegated and will play in the third tier next year.

Pighead

If we're talking currently, Louth have to be in the conversation. Finalists in the division three football league this season and as recently as last Saturday the hurlers really put it up to Derry in the first round of the Nicky Rackard cup.

flasher0030

corny wrote: »

How would you have Tipp fifth if you're basing it on current form?. Tipp were Al Hurling champions and Football semi finalists in 2016.

Tipperary should be number 1, based on that criteria.

danganabu

flasher0030 wrote: »

Tipperary should be number 1, based on that criteria.

Which is why the OP started the thread.

hurlingman97

danganabu wrote: »

Its still Division 2 for all intents and purposes and they were relegated and will play in the third tier next year.

The last 3 winners (I think) have come from 1b

Utopia Parkway

People maybe guilty of only looking at how the senior team gets on in a particular year. Again I think a much more reliable and robust test of the strength of a dual county is how they fare across the board at senior, U-21 and minor and at club level also.

Who produces consistently good teams right across the spectrum in both codes.

Boom__Boom

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

People maybe guilty of only looking at how the senior team gets on in a particular year. Again I think a much more reliable and robust test of the strength of a dual county is how they fare across the board at senior, U-21 and minor and at club level also.

Who produces consistently good teams right across the spectrum in both codes.

Kerry in Football currently hold the following titles

National Football league.
Munster Championship. (4th in a row)
Munster and All Ireland Senior Club.
Munster Intermediate Club (3rd in a row)
Munster and All Ireland Junior Club (3rd in a row)
Mcgrath Cup.
Munster and All Ireland Junior (2nd in a row).
Munster U-21.
All Ireland Minor (3rd in a row)
All Ireland A Colleges 18.5 (4th in a row)
All Ireland A Colleges 16.5
All-Ireland Senior Inter-Firm Football Final (3rd in a row)

Dual means club and inter-county right?

danganabu

hurlingman97 wrote: »

The last 3 winners (I think) have come from 1b

Yes you are correct, but it is still the second division of the league. Your stat says more about the structure, timing and relevance of the league more than anything else.

Utopia Parkway

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Kerry in Football currently hold the following titles

National Football league.
Munster Championship. (4th in a row)
Munster and All Ireland Senior Club.
Munster Intermediate Club (3rd in a row)
Munster and All Ireland Junior Club (3rd in a row)
Mcgrath Cup.
Munster and All Ireland Junior (2nd in a row).
Munster U-21.
All Ireland Minor (3rd in a row)
All Ireland A Colleges 18.5 (4th in a row)
All Ireland A Colleges 16.5
All-Ireland Senior Inter-Firm Football Final (3rd in a row)

Dual means club and inter-county right?

Dual counties though that play both football and hurling to a high standard. With the best will in the world Kerry don't qualify by any measure even though the small hurling community down there do love their hurling.

Bonniedog

Dublin hold the only football title that matters boom boom.

Boom__Boom

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

Dual counties though that play both football and hurling to a high standard. With the best will in the world Kerry don't qualify by any measure even though the small hurling community down there do love their hurling.

How high is to a high standard though? Are Offaly a dual county?

For the numbers of actual hurlers in Kerry, I think it's fair to say they are doing very well.

At underage especially there definitely has been some growth in the game - however it's slow enough and would have very a long way to go.

Bonniedog wrote: »

Dublin hold the only football title that matters boom boom.

For the moment.....

Also I think a lot of people are underestimating how bad things have got with Cork football - just look at their results in the championship the last few years (since the All-Ireland win in 2010 they have won just 2 games against Division 1 sides and 2 games against Division 2 sides in championship football) Their only wins in the league this year were against the two teams relegated from Division 2 teams.

Bonniedog

Offaly have gone back a lot in both games and all grades, but they came close to winning senior double in early 80s, and did win both one year after another. Pretty impressive for a county with relatively small pick in either.

conor05

Pighead wrote: »

If we're talking currently, Louth have to be in the conversation. Finalists in the division three football league this season and as recently as last Saturday the hurlers really put it up to Derry in the first round of the Nicky Rackard cup.

Ah come on, the standard of football and hurling in Louth is poor. Tipp hammered Louth out the gate recently in div 3 final.
Louth realistically are a division 3 football team and Tier 4 hurling team.
I will say one thing though, they are very very good at the soccer!
Dundalk FC and Drogheda FC.

magentis

Boom__Boom wrote: »

How high is to a high standard though? Are Offaly a dual county?

For the numbers of actual hurlers in Kerry, I think it's fair to say they are doing very well.

At underage especially there definitely has been some growth in the game - however it's slow enough and would have very a long way to go.




For the moment.....

Also I think a lot of people are underestimating how bad things have got with Cork football - just look at their results in the championship the last few years (since the All-Ireland win in 2010 they have won just 2 games against Division 1 sides and 2 games against Division 2 sides in championship football) Their only wins in the league this year were against the two teams relegated from Division 2 teams.

How many all Ireland hurling finals have Kerry played in the last 100 years?

conor05

magentis wrote: »

How many all Ireland hurling finals have Kerry played in the last 100 years?

But sure out of the 35 teams that have a Inter county tea (including London, Warwickshire and Fingal), only 13 have ever won an All Ireland and that is including Kerry. Kerry are never going to be in an All Ireland final again, that is almost a certainty but they have a good hurling team at 1b level and Leinster round robin.
Cork on the other hand have a huge playing field of both Hurlers and footballers so probably have underachieved in the last 10 years.
Cork, Galway and Dublin are the real dual counties at Senior and underage in Ireland.

Pighead

conor05 wrote: »

Ah come on, the standard of football and hurling in Louth is poor. Tipp hammered Louth out the gate recently in div 3 final.
Louth realistically are a division 3 football team and Tier 4 hurling team.
I will say one thing though, they are very very good at the soccer!
Dundalk FC and Drogheda FC.

Or to put it another way: Currently a division two football side and reigning Lory Meagher champions in the hurling.

Django99

At the moment it's probably a tie between Dublin and Galway. Division 1 Football and 1B Hurling. Kerry had the same claim but will play 2A hurling next year. Meath not getting much mention here but play in Liam McCarty and we're close to getting to Div 1 Football.

Of the counties that compete in Liam Mcarthy, realistically Dublin, Kerry and Galway could also win Sam(Galway a bit of a stretch). Tipp had a great year last year but it remains to be seen whether they can repeat it.

In the last 10 years, only Dublin and Cork have reached the semi finals of both, and only Cork have been in both finals.

So in that sense, despite the downfall of the county in both codes across all grades recently, id say Cork followed closely by Dublin. Both Tipp and Galway have potential to bring their footballers to a higher level in the near future.

It's not surprising that these are the counties that feature, one with a huge population and the other 3 are huge geographically. And you can almost draw a line in those three counties between football and hurling.

Django99

Someone mentioned clubs earlier, and a real sign of a well run club is success in both codes. Slaughtneil, Cratloe, Loughmore and some of the Dublin clubs can definitely be proud of a true dual status, winning titles in both codes, and often at the same time with a lot of dual players.

Bonniedog

Django99 wrote: »

Someone mentioned clubs earlier, and a real sign of a well run club is success in both codes. Slaughtneil, Cratloe, Loughmore and some of the Dublin clubs can definitely be proud of a true dual status, winning titles in both codes, and often at the same time with a lot of dual players.

Bally fkn Boden .... (sorry, inner voice


We brought our Feile team out there a few years ago when they were hosting play offs and our young fellas were, and myself!, were amazed at the set up. Their HQ was so busy that we wer redirected to their second premises which is itself more impressive than nearly any other club in Dublin, and from there to another pitch where the first game was played!

I was dragooned as umpire for another game later and was given a white coat! Got talking to Boden chap who was on other side and he said they were fielding 30 teams over all grades that weekend. Wouldn't be their greatest fan but it is awesome set up across all codes, ages and genders.

Django99

Bonniedog wrote: »

Bally fkn Boden .... (sorry, inner voice

Couldn't think of which Dublin clubs had done it recently! Are they the only ones? For some reason Kilmacud are in my head as either having done it or come close.

Bonniedog

Django99 wrote: »

Couldn't think of which Dublin clubs had done it recently! Are they the only ones? For some reason Kilmacud are in my head as either having done it or come close.

Kilmacud have won both, but not in same year. Vinnies have both and won double championships on a good few occasions when they were in their pomp. Erins Isle and O'Tooles are only other clubs I can think of who have won both senior championships, and O'Tooles last football was about 80 years ago!

Boden. Crokes and Vinnies still be main dual clubs but Cuala may challenge that.

danganabu

Django99 wrote: »

It's not surprising that these are the counties that feature, one with a huge population and the other 3 are huge geographically. And you can almost draw a line in those three counties between football and hurling.

Was the case one time in Tipp, maybe 30 years ago and before where the hurling was predominately in the Mid and North Division and football in the West and South, this has changed over the last 30 years, the only constant is that football is pretty much ignored in the North of the county and even at that there are four players from the North Division on the Senior panel.