why don't RTE sell 2rn (rtenl) ?

The Parish Priest.

It would surely fetch a substantial amount of money ?

The Cush

They tried in the past to sell 67% but that collapsed when the estimated value of that part of the company fell from up to €100m down to €20-30m. It was also included in the McCarthy Report on the disposal of state assets but was never pursued.

Hopefully they have learned from the sale of Telecom Eireann's network to keep infrastructure in state hands, Eirgrid being an example.

icdg

It would be controversial, and seemingly certain parts of government place an awful lot of value, seemingly for a combination of national security and cultural reasons, on having ownership of the terrestrial transmission network (part of the argument for DTT was that there "had" to be a television transmission system under State ownership).

I personally don't buy the argument at all in a country where the majority are viewing their TV (even RTÉ) by satellite or cable, but that is the thinking.

Sam Russell

The Parish Priest. wrote: »

It would surely fetch a substantial amount of money ?

Selling 2RN would achieve what, exactly? Give an opportunity to some investor to make a good return at our expense, perhaps?

Moving 2RN to the BAI might make sense or setting up a national infrastructure semi-state that incorporates Eirgrid, ESB Networks, Bord Gais Networks, etc. might make sense, but selling out to the highest bidder would not.

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

Selling 2RN would achieve what, exactly? Give an opportunity to some investor to make a good return at our expense, perhaps?

Moving 2RN to the BAI might make sense or setting up a national infrastructure semi-state that incorporates Eirgrid, ESB Networks, Bord Gais Networks, etc. might make sense, but selling out to the highest bidder would not.

The BAI should be put no where near 2rn.

2rn should be a separate company owning both the national network and the main RTÉ Studios in donnybrook. It should invest in server technology.

PAKNET

It's unlikely to realistically fetch much money as it has fairly limited scope for a return on investment to a commercial operator.

Unlike the UK, where competition is fierce for relatively scarce space on Freeview and DAB making it very easy to monetise, we don't exactly have broadcasters lining up to start broadcasting on SaorView - it's a struggle to genuinely fill two muxes as it stands at the moment - nor do we have any real digital audio service bar an indefinite "trial".

Even traditional customers of 2RN like mobile and regional ISPs who would have used 2RN sites for long range, island wide microwave backhaul are becoming less and less reliant on that. Most cellular and WISP edge sites, particularly 4G sites, are now converted to being fed directly by fibre, not microwave.

political analyst

I'm aware that, back in 2002, the collapse of ITV Digital in the UK caused the plan for digital terrestrial TV in the Republic to be put on the long finger. However, just because the financial value of the transmission network had collapsed it doesn't mean that a sale couldn't have taken place. If the sale had gone ahead then maybe we would have had a greater choice of channels on Saorview.

Sam Russell

political analyst wrote: »

I'm aware that, back in 2002, the collapse of ITV Digital in the UK caused the plan for digital terrestrial TV in the Republic to be put on the long finger. However, just because the financial value of the transmission network had collapsed it doesn't mean that a sale couldn't have taken place. If the sale had gone ahead then maybe we would have had a greater choice of channels on Saorview.

The transmission costs are high (€12m per year for two muxes.)

The way these costs are divided out does not favour RTE - who owns the transmission network.

TV3 has always objected to paying transmission charges - and have fought hard to not pay anything.

Because of the way transmission charges are shared out, it is next to impossible for any broadcaster (without deep pockets) to get onto Saorview. If you do not believe me then ask UTV - well you cannot ask them anything because they have disappeared since going onto Saorview.

The Cush

I don't remember anyone linking the collapse of ITV Digital and the failure to rollout DTT here. From what I can remember the sole bidder Its'TV withdrew after the government failed to give it the licence because the financing backing to rollout the DTT network disappeared when the draft licence offered to the company wouldn't allow them to offer broadband and phone via the DTT network's built-in return path, or back-channel over a standard roof aerial, using RTÉ's developed WINDS project (Wireless Interactive Network for Digital Services).

The ex-RTÉ execs behind the company had previously worked on the original Digico DTT plan.

At the same time the sale of the transmission network was also cancelled due to low value placed on it by the bidders following the technology stock market collapse and this also halted any further DTT development until 2006.

political analyst

The Cush wrote: »

I don't remember anyone linking the collapse of ITV Digital and the failure to rollout DTT here. From what I can remember the sole bidder Its'TV withdrew after the government failed to give it the licence because the financing backing to rollout the DTT network disappeared when the draft licence offered to the company wouldn't allow them to offer broadband and phone via the DTT network's built-in return path, or back-channel over a standard roof aerial, using RTÉ's developed WINDS project (Wireless Interactive Network for Digital Services).

The ex-RTÉ execs behind the company had previously worked on the original Digico DTT plan.

At the same time the sale of the transmission network was also cancelled due to low value placed on it by the bidders following the technology stock market collapse and this also halted any further DTT development until 2006.

Why did the government not provide for the licence to let that happen?

political analyst

Sam Russell wrote: »

The transmission costs are high (€12m per year for two muxes.)

The way these costs are divided out does not favour RTE - who owns the transmission network.

TV3 has always objected to paying transmission charges - and have fought hard to not pay anything.

Because of the way transmission charges are shared out, it is next to impossible for any broadcaster (without deep pockets) to get onto Saorview. If you do not believe me then ask UTV - well you cannot ask them anything because they have disappeared since going onto Saorview.

On what grounds has TV3 objected to paying the charges?

The Cush

political analyst wrote: »

Why did the government not provide for the licence to let that happen?

Don't know the reasons but to speculate, a lot of capacity would be required to carry these data services in spectrum that is allocated to broadcasting using standards that wouldn't be as efficient as standard being used/developed today (4g/5g), mast capacity/low frequencies combined with the large coverage areas of broadcast transmitters i.e. a large user base, would mean very low speeds/availability.

Anyone following the Imagine 4G LTE thread over on the broadband forum will see how quickly their higher density/higher frequency masts, supposedly limited to 400 subscribers, can quickly become congested even using today's latest standards.

Also at that time the mobile networks were rolling out their UMTS/3G networks, the DTT network could have been seen as competition at the time.

In any case wireless interactive services over the DTT network never went ahead here or anywhere else possibly due to the limitations mentioned above. Only now, 15 years or so later, are we beginning to see hybrid interactive broadcast broadband technologies launching via dedicated hi-speed networks rather than the broadcast network.

Sam Russell

political analyst wrote: »

On what grounds has TV3 objected to paying the charges?

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/tv3-takes-rte-to-high-court-in-row-over-10m-transmission-fees-157683.html

http://www.iftn.ie/broadcast/news/?act1=record&only=1&aid=73&rid=4283983&tpl=archnews&force=1

RTE sues TV3 in dispute over payments for digital transmission services

By: iina reporters
Published 9/3/2015, in High Court
By Aodhan O’Faolain

RTE have brought proceedings seeking approximately €1m from TV3 in a dispute over an alleged failure to pay for digital transmission services.

The case was admitted to the Commercial Court list on Monday by Mr Justice Brian McGovern on consent between the parties.

RTE, represented by Cian Ferriter SC, is seeking €734,000 for tariffs it claims are outstanding for the provision of Digital Terrestrial Television (DTT) multiplexing broadcasting and transmission services in 2013. It also seeks approximately €287,000 in tariffs for the provision of DTT services in 2014.

The sums sought are the difference between what TV3 has paid for the ….read more

- unfortunately a pay wall.

https://courtsnewsireland.ie/category/high-court/page/58/

Analogue days, TV3 was only ever available t0 80% of the population because TV3 refused to pay for transmission except on the 17 main transmission sites.

Long history - Google is your friend. http://www.thejournal.ie/rte-tv3-comreg-complaint-closed-1530219-Jun2014/

By the way, TV3 got 3E onto Saorview as a gift, and got bailed out by the taxpayer to the tune of €80 m.

rogue-entity

PAKNET wrote: »

we don't exactly have broadcasters lining up to start broadcasting on SaorView - it's a struggle to genuinely fill two muxes as it stands at the moment - nor do we have any real digital audio service bar an indefinite "trial".

The prices charged are ridiculous and doubtless put off any small to medium player. As for DAB, Comreg are not issuing licences for DAB multiplex operators. One company ran a trail in the South East and another ran one in Cork and Dublin but neither were able to extract a permanent licence.
Selling off 2rn would only make a bad situation much worse IMHO