Any database on the tyres on cars that crash?

Popoutman

Does anyone know if there is any database on the tyre models and types that are on crashed cars?

I've a suspicion that quite a few of the incidents in inclement weather in this country are attributable to poor quality tyres. I'm thinking of incidents such as the 12 cars that crashed on Mar 1st on the N7 between Birdhill and Castletroy after inclement weather - not considering the fatal incident at all in this though.

From my memory of reading through some of the inquiry texts in fatal collisions the brand and model of tyre is rarely given. I would have expected that this information would have been collected, and would be useful to show if ditchfinders are a common factor in loss of control.

Atlantic Dawn

Brands and condition should be logged after all fatal accidents to see what stats they give.

CJhaughey

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

CorkMan_

If they did keep records I would say it'd make for interesting reading. The state of some tyres I see on cars is shocking to say the least. (Plus some brands I'd never heard of)

Kimbot

CJhaughey wrote: »

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

Also if its the stretch of road im thinking about it is a pain in the hole when wet, it holds a nice layer of water so that could have really contributed to this crash.

biko

Insurers or gardai may have such information. Not sure they'd be willing to share though..

R.O.R

CJhaughey wrote: »

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

I believe one of our cars was involved in that and based on its age and mileage it still would be on fairly fresh factory tyres so weather rather than rubber was the main factor.

bazz26

By all accounts there was a sudden freak hail storm at the time of that accident on the M7 yesterday evening. From what I heard the hail storm was so bad and so sudden that it was like somebody just dumped a million marbles onto the motorway at the time so even the best tyres in the world may not have prevented this tragedy.

pa990

biko wrote: »

Insurers or gardai may have such information. Not sure they'd be willing to share though..

No such data is collected by the Gardai, RSA or insurance companies.

beer enigma

CJhaughey wrote: »

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

The Cork incident happened right in front of me - fortunately I managed to stop, but several of the cars involved had come hurtling past me at ridiculous speed shortly before & it was like driving on marbles - Madness.

Voodoomelon

The amount of people who say after a crash or tip with someone else, "the road was shocking greasy, must've been diesel spilled or the likes". Me arse, half of these folks have Ling Langs on all four corners.

Sure a chap posted here recently asking about procedure after a serious single vehicle collision his wife was involved in, slippery roads was the cause, until the make of tyre transpired to be of the Chinese variety.
Happens ALL day long I reckon. Worst thing is, the tyre brand will never be mentioned, even by the accident investigator and folks will head out and buy the same rubbish again straight away.

166man

I think the usage of phones when driving has to be an ever increasing factor in collisions. 10 years ago, how many people had phones that they used every day compared to these days where every single person over the age of 16 has some kind of smartphone, where social media requires incessant checking.

The amount of people I see in cars on their phones aimlessly scrolling through some useless clickbait is astounding.

All it takes is looking at your phone for 1/2 seconds and you can end up rear ending someone. I agree though that tyres play a large part in this also.

beer enigma

Road Safety Authority analysis into accidents between 2008 & 2012, link below

"The Road Safety Authority said it analysed 867 of the 983 fatal collisions - representing cases where Garda files had been completed.

It found “vehicle factors” were noted in 121 crashes - accounting in for about 14 percent of fatalities.

Of these vehicle factors tyre condition amounted for almost two-thirds of all factors noted. Defective tyres were also noted more frequently in single vehicle crashes than in multiple vehicle crashes."

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/defective-tyres-largest-vehicle-factor-in-fatal-road-crashes-1.2597652

JohnBoy26

Voodoomelon wrote: »

The amount of people who say after a crash or tip with someone else, "the road was shocking greasy, must've been diesel spilled or the likes". Me arse, half of these folks have Ling Langs on all four corners.

Sure a chap posted here recently asking about procedure after a serious single vehicle collision his wife was involved in, slippery roads was the cause, until the make of tyre transpired to be of the Chinese variety.
Happens ALL day long I reckon. Worst thing is, the tyre brand will never be mentioned, even by the accident investigator and folks will head out and buy the same rubbish again straight away.

Many cars are being fitted with reputable brand part worns these days which are either very old or have substantial wear on them, or both+ their previous history is unknown.

Imo these are far more dangerous than new chinese tyres but as others have said this accident was probably more down to the conditions rather than tyres.

I was caught in a hailshower around the same time as this accident happened and it was very bad.

coylemj

Andip wrote: »

Road Safety Authority analysis into accidents between 2008 & 2012, link below

"The Road Safety Authority said it analysed 867 of the 983 fatal collisions - representing cases where Garda files had been completed.

It found “vehicle factors” were noted in 121 crashes - accounting in for about 14 percent of fatalities.

Of these vehicle factors tyre condition amounted for almost two-thirds of all factors noted. Defective tyres were also noted more frequently in single vehicle crashes than in multiple vehicle crashes."

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/defective-tyres-largest-vehicle-factor-in-fatal-road-crashes-1.2597652

Vehicle factors were 'noted' simply means that there was some defect found in the vehicle, it does not mean that the defect was the primary or even a contributory cause of the accident. For example, if someone is driving too fast while drunk and they knock down a cyclist or pedestrian, it probably wouldn't have made a blind bit of a difference how much tread was on their tyres yet their bald tyres will show up on those statistics.

Inappropriate speed, inexperience, fatigue and drink/drugs account for the vast majority of fatal accidents. While I'm all in favour of the NCT, the fact is that the condition of the vehicle is the primary cause of a relatively small number of fatalities.

flyingsnail

CJhaughey wrote: »

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

I believe there were three separate incidents in that general area in a short space of time last night, the first was off the motorway near junction 28 Castletroy, the second a short time later was the 12 cars southbound between junction 27 Birdhill and 28 Castletroy and while they were dealing with the second, a third occurred Northbound between junction 27 Birdhill and junction 26 Nenagh.

Del2005

Popoutman wrote: »

Does anyone know if there is any database on the tyre models and types that are on crashed cars?

I've a suspicion that quite a few of the incidents in inclement weather in this country are attributable to poor quality tyres. I'm thinking of incidents such as the 12 cars that crashed on Mar 1st on the N7 between Birdhill and Castletroy after inclement weather - not considering the fatal incident at all in this though.

From my memory of reading through some of the inquiry texts in fatal collisions the brand and model of tyre is rarely given. I would have expected that this information would have been collected, and would be useful to show if ditchfinders are a common factor in loss of control.

There should be a database of all coroners reports into RTCs that is easily accessible. I remember reading an air incident report where a pilot of a biz jet didn't fly high enough and could have hit a mountain, but he didn't yet it was a story in severly news sites. Yet we have a airliner crashing every year on our roads and there's no feedback, apart from DUI and exceeding the posted limit are bad!!, which would tell us if they even had their seatbelts on, airbags working, tyres status as per the OP, etc.

What't the point of all the investigations into RTCs when there doesn't ever appear to be any answers or solutions from them.

Esel

CJhaughey wrote: »

12 cars would point towards something a little more than just bad tyres.
Reports were of a heavy hailstorm at the time, hail is like greased ball bearings to drive on, there was a similar incident on the N40 in Cork last year as well after a hailstorm.
People driving too fast for the conditions IMHO has a lot to do with it.

bazz26 wrote: »

By all accounts there was a sudden freak hail storm at the time of that accident on the M7 yesterday evening. From what I heard the hail storm was so bad and so sudden that it was like somebody just dumped a million marbles onto the motorway at the time so even the best tyres in the world may not have prevented this tragedy.

Hail was in the form of graupel.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graupel

Odyssey 2005

CorkMan_ wrote: »

If they did keep records I would say it'd make for interesting reading. The state of some tyres I see on cars is shocking to say the least. (Plus some brands I'd never heard of)

I know a taximan who only uses triangle tyres. Been using them for years because he gets massive milage outa them. I wouldn't use them on a silage pit...but there ya go.

CJhaughey

Esel wrote: »

Hail was in the form of graupel.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graupel

Interesting, This was a description on that page:
In addition, thinner layers of graupel falling at low temperatures can act as ball bearings below subsequent falls of more naturally stable snow, rendering them also liable to avalanche.

Dangerous stuff no matter what the correct terminology is...

Lofty123

What hogwash! Whatever brand of tyres you use, If you drive within the speed limits (they are there for a reason) and adjust your driving to the road/weather conditions you will be fine. You are in far more danger from the overconfident clown with the Mitchelins, Goodyears etc speeding towards you in the rain.

If Chinese tyres were unsafe in normal use I'm sure the EU would have banned them years ago.

bazz26

Oh, here we go again. Just because tyres meet a minimum standard does not mean they are all the same or perform the same.

Lofty123

bazz26 wrote: »

Oh, here we go again. Just because tyres meet a minimum standard does not mean they are all the same or perform the same.

I never said either of those things, I simply said cheaper tyres are not inherently unsafe if the user drives legally and sensibly. Superior "performance" tyres are a waste of money unless you are on a racetrack.:rolleyes:

kay 9

Lofty123 wrote: »

I never said either of those things, I simply said cheaper tyres are not inherently unsafe if the user drives legally and sensibly. Superior "performance" tyres are a waste of money unless you are on a racetrack.:rolleyes:

I'm a believer of superior performance tyres as you call them and I don't think they're a waste of money if they corner better, give better traction on wet and dry conditions and decrease braking distance. After all, an extra 20-30 euro a corner could save your life, a strangers life or a loved ones.

Lofty123

kay 9 wrote: »

I'm a believer of superior performance tyres as you call them and I don't think they're a waste of money if they corner better, give better traction on wet and dry conditions and decrease braking distance. After all, an extra 20-30 euro a corner could save your life, a strangers life or a loved ones.

Why would anyone need to corner better? Do you mean faster? Traction is only an issue if you are driving at the limits of your tyres grip. 20 kms slower could also save many lives.

Del2005

Lofty123 wrote: »

What hogwash! Whatever brand of tyres you use, If you drive within the speed limits (they are there for a reason) and adjust your driving to the road/weather conditions you will be fine. You are in far more danger from the overconfident clown with the Mitchelins, Goodyears etc speeding towards you in the rain.

If Chinese tyres were unsafe in normal use I'm sure the EU would have banned them years ago.

If the Chinese tyres where any good they'd be OEM from all manufacturers. Manufactures are constantly trying to increase profitability and saving €50 a corner on thousands of cars would be a substantial profit. Why aren't they OEM?

dr.fuzzenstein

Lofty123 wrote: »

What hogwash! Whatever brand of tyres you use, If you drive within the speed limits (they are there for a reason) and adjust your driving to the road/weather conditions you will be fine. You are in far more danger from the overconfident clown with the Mitchelins, Goodyears etc speeding towards you in the rain.

If Chinese tyres were unsafe in normal use I'm sure the EU would have banned them years ago.

What hogwash! If someone on premium tires hits the brakes in front of you, you will hit them and you will be at fault!
Why would you deliberately make your car worse and endanger yourself and others? Would you deliberately wear slippery shoes that land you on your arse?
Also, replace the car in front with a pedestrian who walked out without looking, you will cream them too.
In this video the stopping distance is 14 meters longer at 70 miles per hour. Of course your stopping distance will be longer at any speed, so simply driving slower will not help you.
Of course you could crawl everywhere at 20-30 km/h under the speed limit, causing tailbacks and frustration, because your car handles like a hovercraft...

I would suggest you watch this video, you simply cannot argue that cheapo Chinese tires are anywhere near as good as something decent. So I would advise you to reconsider if you're eyeing up those Triangles or Ling Longs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2c9Ry0JfMw

Cheensbo

"At the point the continental tyre was stationary, the budget tyre was still doing 31mph"

Naaah but shur de taximen, DE TAXIMEN use them!!

Voodoomelon

Isn't it funny how online you never get someone coming back and apologising or admitting they were wrong or ill-informed? Face to face, someone would be like "oh really, I never knew that, that's food for thought" etc. But online, horsesh1t keeps being peddled and perpetuated, with no accountability.

Sam Kade

Odyssey 2005 wrote: »

I know a taximan who only uses triangle tyres. Been using them for years because he gets massive milage outa them. I wouldn't use them on a silage pit...but there ya go.

You must have used them at some stage seeing that you aren't recommending them Whatever about budget tyres v premium tyres a lot also depends on the condition of the tyres, I've seen a lot of cars with badly worn tyres some with no thread at all parked in car parks.

James Bond Junior

R.O.R wrote: »

I believe one of our cars was involved in that and based on its age and mileage it still would be on fairly fresh factory tyres so weather rather than rubber was the main factor.

I know the releatives of the poor person whom lost his life and he was driving a car that was scarcely a few weeks old so rubber wasn't a factor.

I work with all females and take upon myself to keep an eye on their tyres, lights, read any codes that pop up etc. I've waxed on about the danger of Chinese tyres several times and how dangerous they are. I now see that two of my colleagues, whom have young children I may add, have replaced their tyres with yokohamas and goodyears from triangles and wanglis. That's two families safer on our roads simple as that.

I've said it once in here and I'll say it again, buy the best bed, best shoes and best tyres you can get because you will always be using one of those at any given time.

The Bishop Basher

Lofty123 wrote: »

I never said either of those things, I simply said cheaper tyres are not inherently unsafe if the user drives legally and sensibly. Superior "performance" tyres are a waste of money unless you are on a racetrack.:rolleyes:

I put Triangles on my E240 many years ago when I was less informed on these matters.

The sales guy gave me the speel that they're all tested to EU standard and I swallowed it..

He even made a joke about it being great to see a taxi driver who takes safety seriously. I'm not a taxi driver

Anyway, it very quickly became clear to me that not only were they of inferior quality..

They were downright dangerous..

I'm not one for government regulation on most things but cheap tyres like Triangles should be banned from sale in any country that takes road safety seriously.

Meanwhile here in Ireland we'll continue to blame all our road safety issues on young drivers, cars over 10 years old and anything that dares drive faster then 60 mph regardless of vehicle, road and conditions while the numbers dying continue to rise..

As usual, incompetence and vested interests are the order of the day..