Stretch-and-glide or straight-into-pull

TopOfTheHill

Hi,

I have been told that I am all power in my stroke and should stretch it out.
I go straight in to the pull once my hand enters the water.

Is this a good pr a bad thing?
Will stretching out increase my speed, allow me to go more distance in a session, etc?

So ultimately, I am looking for advice on what the best drills are to achieve this change?

I have been swimming over 40 years, so it will be a hard habit to break.
Tried to slow down my stroke the other night to stretch-and-glide and ended up going into catch-up drills.

Thanks for any tips

gutenberg

I think there is a balance to be struck between having a good reach & stretch on the stroke, but also getting into the pull quickly - if there is any kind of a pause between the stretch and beginning the pull-through then of course you're going to slow down. I think for a while I almost had the opposite problem to you - I'd leave my arm outstretched at the front of the stroke for that split-second too long, and it was ultimately slowing me down.

In swimming usually it is considered good to use the least amount of strokes per length as possible; for this you're talking about maximising your distance per stroke (DPS in most of the blogs etc.), and having maximum efficiency with your stroke. This is probably what you should be focusing on, rather than thinking about adding a glide or stretch - one outcome of these drills is that it may help you develop a 'longer' stroke as well as help with efficiency.

Take a look at drills like these to see about maximising efficiency. I'm sure others on this forum can also suggest drills or other things you can do.

TopOfTheHill

Thanks Gutenberg - I will give those drills a shot and look out for more.

Walked into masters class last night, and DPS was the focus, so have started the stroke count reduction already

kal7

IMHO, I think that the confusion is that, it will feel like a pause in stroke mentally, but won't be in reality.

The time taken for nerve and muscle to react to brain instruction will make it feel like a glide phase.

But too long a glide results in stopping and then large inertia to get over, so a long stretch and glide not productive, but well timed is better.

Stroke count and feeling easier is best way to know if the drill or change in thinking has actually helped. As you have seen.

Freddio

I've been battling with this for a few years. It influences the whole logistic and dynamic in the water with things like cross over and fish tailing, versus momentum.

I still haven't found what I am looking for.

WeeBushy

Good suggestions above, other potential thing to add/ask..

Where does your hand enter the water? Extreme example: your hand enters by your ear and you start the pull phase immediately - you've lost a lot of pulling potential. So by stretching it out i.e. your hand spearing into the water close to fully extended and then starting your pull, you are going to have a longer pull, more efficiency, and thus slower stroke rate with a more extended arm, and you won't have introduced a glide which is a big thing you want to avoid.

Also a general point with drills. Make sure you really know why you are doing each of them. People can often do drills without a real understanding of precisely what the drill is aiming to do. They do them because they're written up on the board, or they read/heard that they are good for a particular thing. Get you coach to fully explain the point of each one; what exactly are you trying to learn? Then you can really focus on that, how it feels, and how it translates into your normal swimming.

Take, as a random example, the finger drag drill. What is it trying to change in your stroke? Is it a high elbow recovery? How you body rotates? How your arm enters the water? Hip movement? Are you teaching yourself that your finger should skim the top of the water on recovery in normal swimming? Basically what aspects of the drill are you teaching yourself that should be translated to your normal stroke.

Sorry for the drill rant, I just think it's a thing that is often overlooked!

Ryder

I'm very far from being a good swimmer but one of my numerous problems was a long glide. The waterpolo drill, 25m swimming with the head above water, helps to focus on keeping the catch synchronous with extension without a pause

promethius

TopOfTheHill wrote: »

Hi,

I have been told that I am all power in my stroke and should stretch it out.
I go straight in to the pull once my hand enters the water.

Is this a good pr a bad thing?
Will stretching out increase my speed, allow me to go more distance in a session, etc?

So ultimately, I am looking for advice on what the best drills are to achieve this change?

I have been swimming over 40 years, so it will be a hard habit to break.
Tried to slow down my stroke the other night to stretch-and-glide and ended up going into catch-up drills.

Thanks for any tips

Hey who told you this? It's important as it's difficult to know what your own stroke is like but a good coach will be able to give you great feedback. That would establish if the concern on your stroke is genuine.

You should be going into your pull pretty much as soon as your hand is in position in the water so i'm not sure if that's the real concern. It could be that your not getting the extension on the stroke which is important as another poster alluded to. What type of racing are you doing? If you're making changes to stroke, keep going back and checking if it's actually making you quicker, some people forget this and become a drills hermit, happens a lot with triathletes.

mad m

Freddio wrote: »

I still haven't found what I am looking for.

Either has U2...:D

TopOfTheHill

promethius wrote: »

It could be that your not getting the extension on the stroke which is important as another poster alluded to.

Yip, this is the issue.

I am only racing in triathlons, but if I can extend better, then do the distance in the same time with less effort then its a bonus. Then by increasing effort to current levels I should be doing the same distance quicker.

Of course its all experimental, so if it does not work then I can fall back.
A couple of time trials separated by a number of weeks should show results.

gutenberg

Yes, I would echo the other posters who have said about making sure to do some time trials regularly to check on any stroke changes.

I train alone but am conscious of my stroke etc., and recently I've been working on making sure I have that early, high-elbow catch, trying to go into it slightly earlier than before and trying to use more of my back/lats to generate power. I've been working on it through various drills and thought I could feel a difference, but it was only really proved when I did a time trial and had dropped two seconds in about 2-3 weeks

davmurpla

TopOfTheHill wrote: »

Hi,

I have been told that I am all power in my stroke and should stretch it out.
I go straight in to the pull once my hand enters the water.

Is this a good pr a bad thing?
Will stretching out increase my speed, allow me to go more distance in a session, etc?

So ultimately, I am looking for advice on what the best drills are to achieve this change?

I have been swimming over 40 years, so it will be a hard habit to break.
Tried to slow down my stroke the other night to stretch-and-glide and ended up going into catch-up drills.

Thanks for any tips

There is many points on this thread so far,

- I agree on "who said that"??

-Normally, if you try to glide and overreach, that promote an overrotation plus, the elbow drops as well, losing power on the first phase of the stroke.

-Drills...or friends and our enemies
I dont suggest to do drills if we are not able to get some feedback, either from a coach on poolside or in the water.
As i say, what you think you are doing when swimming, migh be completely diferent in the reality.
I would suggest dryland drills, to assimilate motions and do some neuromuscular trainning.

Coach Gordo