HGE and Diet

VonVix

So, my German Shepherd has had a second bout of hemorrhagic gastroenteritis. Last time he had it was the 31st of December and now diagnosed again the 31st of January! This time around, it's not as bad, but it would certainly have progressed if I didn't get him vet attention for it.

I reckon what I have him on now (Barking Heads lamb and Rocco beef tins. I tend to avoid chicken in his diet) may possibly be too rich(?) and not really helping if he has stomach issues (typical GSD grrr), despite me wanting to feed him something of a decent quality. I have never had a dog with tummy issues, so this is out of my realm of experience!

I'm wondering if anyone else here has a dog with similar issues and any food suggestions for a pooch in his position?

Nody

Raw with a high portion of veggies? Only thing coming to mind to keep the quality high but lower the meat content but hopefully someone with more experience will be able to answer :P

tk123

Have you tried Rocco Sensible? If you were going to try raw start with tripe as it's gentlest on their tummies and a super food - the downside being it stinks lol! Avoid chubs/trays or anything mixed - just plain tripe would be my advice and you can slowly add lean proteins like rabbit/venison/pheasant at a later stage if the tripe suits him. I get mine from slaneypetfoods.ie - start with a small box and then you can get in in bulk if he takes to it. Again - it stinks so a separate freezer is advised!

Hope he's felling better soon!

VonVix

Haven't tried Rocco Sensible actually!

Can't really do raw, in a household of 4 with just a small freezer as it is. We actually got rid of our shed that held our second freezer earlier last year.

tk123

VonVix wrote: »

Haven't tried Rocco Sensible actually!

Can't really do raw, in a household of 4 with just a small freezer as it is. We actually got rid of our shed that held our second freezer earlier last year.

TBH if the dog was very sick I don't know if I'd want to drastically change their diet switching them to raw anyways? Like i do feed raw and recommend it if it's doable but it could make matters worse since some dogs do a detox and have an upset tummy at first. I'd feed whatever makes him better and worry about upping the quality when he's better and can handle the change.

Maybe try the rocco sensible and get some sensitivity control/Hills equivalent from the vet to tide you over until it comes? I think MaxiZoo stock a sensitive one too?
Another one i've seen recommended for very sick dogs is Chappie - full of crap but settles their tummies lol!

maggiepip

You might want to try a diet more moderate in fat too.
Rocco and similar foods, while they are good, are actually pretty high in fat.

The dry matter fat content of Rocco for example actually works out at 26℅ (calculate 100 % minus moisture which is 75℅ = 25℅ dry matter.
Then divide fat content , which in rocco beef is 6.5℅ by 25% = .26 then multiply by 100 to get actual dry matter fat. Which is 26℅.)

I used to feed my dogs Rocco and similar foods . Unfortunately now 2 of my dogs have pancreatitis and my third dog has had 2 episodes of HGE in the past. None of my dogs can tolerate high fat anymore.
In fact I never realised how high in fat some tinned food s are until my dogs got sick and I learned how to work out dry matter!

VonVix

tk123 wrote: »

TBH if the dog was very sick I don't know if I'd want to drastically change their diet switching them to raw anyways? Like i do feed raw and recommend it if it's doable but it could make matters worse since some dogs do a detox and have an upset tummy at first. I'd feed whatever makes him better and worry about upping the quality when he's better and can handle the change.

Maybe try the rocco sensible and get some sensitivity control/Hills equivalent from the vet to tide you over until it comes? I think MaxiZoo stock a sensitive one too?
Another one i've seen recommended for very sick dogs is Chappie - full of crap but settles their tummies lol!

Yeah, I know what you mean.

And that's really interesting about Chappie, knowing my luck, he'd probably do better on a crappier food! :P

maggiepip wrote: »

You might want to try a diet more moderate in fat too.
Rocco and similar foods, while they are good, are actually pretty high in fat.

The dry matter fat content of Rocco for example actually works out at 26℅ (calculate 100 % minus moisture which is 75℅ = 25℅ dry matter.
Then divide fat content , which in rocco beef is 6.5℅ by 25% = .26 then multiply by 100 to get actual dry matter fat. Which is 26℅.)

I used to feed my dogs Rocco and similar foods . Unfortunately now 2 of my dogs have pancreatitis and my third dog has had 2 episodes of HGE in the past. None of my dogs can tolerate high fat anymore.
In fact I never realised how high in fat some tinned food s are until my dogs got sick and I learned how to work out dry matter!

Ooo, interesting. Thanks for that! What do you feed your dogs now out of interest?

maggiepip

VonVix wrote: »

Yeah, I know what you mean.

And that's really interesting about Chappie, knowing my luck, he'd probably do better on a crappier food! :P



Ooo, interesting. Thanks for that! What do you feed your dogs now out of interest?

I had one of my dogs on Chappie for awhile, out of sheer desperation, and although its crap it got her tummy healthy again. She had had HGE and I also noticed she was suffering constipation alternating with diarrhea. Chappie really did help her and regulated her bowel movement s.

Lower fat commercial foods are very hard to get grain free , and I had fed my dogs grain free for many years. So I had to compromise.

To cut a very long story of trial and error short all three are now on Burns dry duck and rice but I soak it and mix meats like boiled turkey breast, lean beef, chicken, tuna, through it.
I wasn't over the moon going back to grains but Im happier that at least burns is gluten free.
Ive also found they can all tolerate a small bit of Animonda Sensitive Chicken tinned mixed in (from zooplus). The animonda still works out at 21% fat on a dry matter basis but they do fine on a small amount.

Fat content is something I never took any notice of over the years and while fats are really important, I believe now maybe I should have paid more attention to how much fat , and what types of fats my dogs were getting.
Interestingly tinned food (which I had always fed, 3 meals of it a day) is significantly higher in fat than most dry.

I'm not saying this diet is the best by any means but it suits all three of my dogs now and thats the important thing. And I do think that too much fat can be a problem for tummy issues , whatever they are. I do hope your dog keeps well.

aonb

What about trying a home cooked diet?
my dog had really wierd problem that was never resolved, with Bloat. It would come on suddenly, and be really quite frightening (for us)

We switched to a home cooked diet - brown rice/meat/vegs or potato or fish. We never looked back. Have been feeding home cooked since. Its pleasant for the owner to prepare (being a veggie raw was out in this house) very cost effective, and the dogs really love it.
Obviously you would have to talk to your vet as to whether home cooked would suit your boy with his issue/health problem?

VonVix

aonb wrote: »

What about trying a home cooked diet?
my dog had really wierd problem that was never resolved, with Bloat. It would come on suddenly, and be really quite frightening (for us)

We switched to a home cooked diet - brown rice/meat/vegs or potato or fish. We never looked back. Have been feeding home cooked since. Its pleasant for the owner to prepare (being a veggie raw was out in this house) very cost effective, and the dogs really love it.
Obviously you would have to talk to your vet as to whether home cooked would suit your boy with his issue/health problem?

I'd be concerned he might be missing out on something nutritionally plus I wouldn't be sure how much to feed a dog his size. He also doesn't really like veg that much except carrots, he's a picky eater which doesn't help.

tk123

You'll have to get some crappie Chappie! I was thinking of you yesterday - I was late home and had to run over to the vets so forgot to give Bailey his pill(!) which has to be 1 hour before or 3 hours after his meat (because it has bone) so gave them rocco for supper. He was delighted lol - dancing around with his ball afterwards

muddypaws

maggiepip wrote: »

I had one of my dogs on Chappie for awhile, out of sheer desperation, and although its crap it got her tummy healthy again. She had had HGE and I also noticed she was suffering constipation alternating with diarrhea. Chappie really did help her and regulated her bowel movement s.

Lower fat commercial foods are very hard to get grain free , and I had fed my dogs grain free for many years. So I had to compromise.

To cut a very long story of trial and error short all three are now on Burns dry duck and rice but I soak it and mix meats like boiled turkey breast, lean beef, chicken, tuna, through it.
I wasn't over the moon going back to grains but Im happier that at least burns is gluten free.
Ive also found they can all tolerate a small bit of Animonda Sensitive Chicken tinned mixed in (from zooplus). The animonda still works out at 21% fat on a dry matter basis but they do fine on a small amount.

Fat content is something I never took any notice of over the years and while fats are really important, I believe now maybe I should have paid more attention to how much fat , and what types of fats my dogs were getting.
Interestingly tinned food (which I had always fed, 3 meals of it a day) is significantly higher in fat than most dry.

I'm not saying this diet is the best by any means but it suits all three of my dogs now and thats the important thing. And I do think that too much fat can be a problem for tummy issues , whatever they are. I do hope your dog keeps well.

Did you try James Wellbeloved, I like it but was advised it probably didn't have enough fat for huskies who thrive on a high fat diet. They do grain free as well.

maggiepip

muddypaws wrote: »

Did you try James Wellbeloved, I like it but was advised it probably didn't have enough fat for huskies who thrive on a high fat diet. They do grain free as well.

Thank you, I did actually try that one and one of my fussier fellas wouldn't eat it. Wafcol is another good grain free one but none of them would touch it! Burns goes down well and definitely agrees with all 3 of them so I'm happy , for now anyway, touch wood.

stusawop

Maggiepip....have a little look at your calculation of the dry matter fat content of Rocco. (smiley)

maggiepip

https://www.pawdiet.com/articles/dry-matter-basis-calculator-for-pet-food/

stusawop

Apologies...got my arithmetic wrong!!

maggiepip

stusawop wrote: »

Apologies...got my arithmetic wrong!!

No worries, Im not very good at explaining things clearly sometimes.

The Mask 13

have you tried bakers? i have a husky who is very picky when it comes to food. she gets constipated very easy with the wrong type of food. Tinned food is meant to be very bad for a dog. Bakers beef, she wont eat the chicken stuff. its expensive but keeps her stomach and her health in order.

muddypaws

The Mask 13 wrote: »

have you tried bakers? i have a husky who is very picky when it comes to food. she gets constipated very easy with the wrong type of food. Tinned food is meant to be very bad for a dog. Bakers beef, she wont eat the chicken stuff. its expensive but keeps her stomach and her health in order.

Bakers is about the worst food you could give a dog. Not all tinned food is bad, there is some excellent tinned food available, that isn't full of all of the additives that is in Bakers.

The Mask 13

Thanks for the heads up, i didn't realise it was that bad. Its the only food she'll eat at this minute though. Any suggestions what would be better to get her she's very picky.

muddypaws

The Mask 13 wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up, i didn't realise it was that bad. Its the only food she'll eat at this minute though. Any suggestions what would be better to get her she's very picky.

Huskies tend to do well on a high fat food, my lot at the moment are on Alpha High Performance, but its not easily found, its a working dog food. For the same price as the Bakers, you would get a premium food, a lot of posters on here use zooplus to buy the food online, lots of good options on there, with high meat content. I would just suggest staying away from any food that has colours in it. I have a few huskies, and some of them will go days without eating, its just something that some huskies do, with no cause for alarm. A common problem with huskies as well is overfeeding, they need less food than you would expect for a dog of their size, overfeeding usually causes upset stomaches and loose poo.

The Mask 13

yeah she has gone a couple of days before without eating, it had me worried. Huskys are beautiful dogs but they can be so stubborn, it's their way or the highway l. I will have a look into that food you mentioned thanks again.

The Mask 13

muddypaws wrote: »

Bakers is about the worst food you could give a dog. Not all tinned food is bad, there is some excellent tinned food available, that isn't full of all of the additives that is in Bakers.

Just done a bit of research there on Bakers food, Jesus i didn't even know how bad it is for a dog. The nice packaging and sneaky wording tricks a lot of people. Its going in the bin straight away, and thanks again for the heads up appreciate it.

aonb

The Mask 13 wrote: »

Just done a bit of research there on Bakers food, Jesus i didn't even know how bad it is for a dog. The nice packaging and sneaky wording tricks a lot of people. Its going in the bin straight away, and thanks again for the heads up appreciate it.

I got 2 blue plastic square boxes of Bakers as a freebie for something or other. My dogs are fed home cooked food, but I would have some emergency tinned food always. When I had run out of the emergency tinned food, I gave my dogs the Bakers - my wimpy drama-queen smelled it and started whining :D:D:D
(wouldnt eat it!)

DBB

The Mask 13 wrote: »

Just done a bit of research there on Bakers food, Jesus i didn't even know how bad it is for a dog. The nice packaging and sneaky wording tricks a lot of people. Its going in the bin straight away, and thanks again for the heads up appreciate it.

I remember buying it donkey's years ago when I was a first-time dog owner, I thought I was the bee's knees for buying him such good food
But honestly? I think it's actually made to look the way it does for the owner rather than the dog