Programmers Needed

colin1087

Hi All

I'm on the hunt for a programmer student(s) to get in solved in a tech startup idea. Does anyone know where to look in Dublin? I know they have Hackathons in the UK where loads of coders meet over a weekend and thrash out prototypes. Anyone know of similar things in Dublin?

eeguy

colin1087 wrote: »

Hi All

I'm on the hunt for a programmer student(s) to get in solved in a tech startup idea. Does anyone know where to look in Dublin? I know they have Hackathons in the UK where loads of coders meet over a weekend and thrash out prototypes. Anyone know of similar things in Dublin?

Contact university societies.
Get in touch with Tog.ie
Keep an eye on Eventbrite.com for hackathons or software meetups in Dublin.
There's one called Hack the Dot on 22nd of Feb and usually a few more throughout the year at the Science Gallery, DCU, UCD and the Tog makerspace

[Deleted User]

colin1087 wrote: »

Hi All

I'm on the hunt for a programmer student(s) to get in solved in a tech startup idea. Does anyone know where to look in Dublin? I know they have Hackathons in the UK where loads of coders meet over a weekend and thrash out prototypes. Anyone know of similar things in Dublin?

Not sure what your timeframe is but ZeroDays is in April. Go, buy some beers get talking to students.

Tog.ie is one idea.

I do hackathons from time to time, but most people who attend are already well established.

You could always host your own hackathon. Come up with a few challenges, get the word out there, bring people in and the top three finalists get an interview?

L.Jenkins

I must ask, if it's a startup and idea you're working on, why students? I would have assumed you'd require Senior Developers, who could trash out ideas and quality code quicker.

Seth Brundle

L.Jenkins wrote: »

I must ask, if it's a startup and idea you're working on, why students? I would have assumed you'd require Senior Developers, who could trash out ideas and quality code quicker.

I would have assumed that low costs were more important than quality.

colin1087

Thanks guys. Startup with zero funding. We want to talk to programmers (don't necessarily have to be students) see if it's feasible and if so develop the most basic prototype.

Checking out Tog, looks great!

Talisman

colin1087 wrote: »

Thanks guys. Startup with zero funding. We want to talk to programmers (don't necessarily have to be students) see if it's feasible and if so develop the most basic prototype.

Checking out Tog, looks great!

Tog is a non commercial space, they will tell you to take your startup and feck off.

eeguy

Talisman wrote: »

Tog is a non commercial space, they will tell you to take your startup and feck off.

Ah they probably won't. It's nice to be nice.

14ned

colin1087 wrote: »

Thanks guys. Startup with zero funding. We want to talk to programmers (don't necessarily have to be students) see if it's feasible and if so develop the most basic prototype.

I've seen a lot of startups try going down the student route. The problem you'll find is that most students either have their own ideas they want to work on, or else want a CV building job (i.e. not a startup) that pays so they can get traversing up that career ladder as quickly as possible and get those student debts paid off. They may say positive things towards you initially, might even write a bit of code, but as soon as any proper paying job turns up they'll be gone and you've just wasted lots of effort and time dealing with them.

You'll then see startups try the junior programmer route, in fact I've been contracted to startups who literally replaced all the senior programmers with junior ones at one quarter the cost. Initially you see tons of code being banged out, it looks like a great decision, then you find out why senior programmers cost four times more as the entire edifice comes falling down with undebuggable problems.

The final trick startups try is to use some very fashionable very new language or framework so up and coming nobody has experience in it yet. You then hire people super passionate in this new tech at bargain rates who are willing to work for a hefty discount to get the CV add. You can get some really senior and capable people this way, and initially it looks great. However, as said technology is so new it inevitably is full of unfinished parts and buggy parts so you end up fighting the language you're writing in which is a whole world of hurt. Your staff also will tend to get poached pretty quickly as they have X years experience when nobody else does. Surprise surprise, it all comes crashing down.

If however you really are zero funding, then needs must. I'd suggest go with the third route, you'll get senior people for a fraction of their normal cost, but be very wary they'll be gone as soon as that technology becomes hot. It'll get you your feasibility prototype done to a reasonable quality however.

Niall

Aswerty

The only way to get developers on board is to pay them, give them equity, or a bit of both. Payment is of course the most straight forward - give money, get service. Giving equity opens up a range of pitfalls and difficulties - the major one is getting someone who's actually interested in sweat equity.

I don't really see the OP's approach - a hackathon to build a prototype - working out. Why would students do it? And what is to stop them from claiming ownership of the work (or part of your company) in the future?

If you want to do a tech startup, get a tech co-founder. If I wanted to do a medical startup, you can be guaranteed I'd be finding a medical co-founder. Of course you can buy in expertise if you've got the capital but the OP is not in that position.

brevity

You might be able to afford junior dev's or students on the cheap but you won't be able to afford the technical debt.

CreepingDeath

Anything that can be knocked up by junior developers can be copied and improved upon easily by others.

If you don't have anything truly unique in intellectual property then other people with more experience, industry contacts and/or funding can easily overtake you to market. (if the idea is worth investing at all)

Aswerty

CreepingDeath wrote: »

...can easily overtake you to market...

This stands out, it's so rare to see the prototype approach these days. The MVP has become the goto (excuse the pun) approach for building online software and mobile apps.

14ned

Aswerty wrote: »

The only way to get developers on board is to pay them, give them equity, or a bit of both. Payment is of course the most straight forward - give money, get service. Giving equity opens up a range of pitfalls and difficulties - the major one is getting someone who's actually interested in sweat equity.

I've been offered equity countless times in exchange for lower pay, indeed a lot of startups especially US ones are unwilling to offer anything but lower pay plus equity. As I've told them all, Irish tax law makes payment through equity particularly unattractive. Capital gains here is 33% which only looks attractive if you're earning far into the upper tax bracket, and any contractor with a decent accountant should be paying a total tax on gross income well below 33%. Equity (especially foreign) also very significantly complicates your annual tax return not just this year but in every year from now on, can't be easily run through your limited company to offset it against other expenses and profits, income from it is subject to withholding taxes and filing paperwork with foreign juridictions, and is generally just a royal pain in the backside to deal with under Irish taxation. Back when capital gains was at 20% at least all that hassle made some financial sense if you were paying enough income taxes, but at 33% it makes zero sense.

Obviously you should seek independent financial advice for your own circumstances, but in general if you're tax resident in Ireland, avoid being paid in equity like the plague until the capital gains tax rate reduces very significantly over the present 33%.

Niall