Soil Conditioners

bogman_bass

Has anybody tried any soil conditioners like this or the other that are on the market? How did you find them?

http://www.grasslandagro.ie/soil-grass-nutrition/soil-conditioners/physiolith/

GrasstoMilk

bogman_bass wrote: »

Has anybody tried any soil conditioners like this or the other that are on the market? How did you find them?

http://www.grasslandagro.ie/soil-grass-nutrition/soil-conditioners/physiolith/

13t dropped in yard today. I find phisolith here very good. Turned our soil structure around. It hasn't replaced our ground lime usage here by any means. Still spread 2t /ac every 3 years

Never wrestle with pigs

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

13t dropped in yard today. I find phisolith here very good. Turned our soil structure around. It hasn't replaced our ground lime usage here by any means. Still spread 2t /ac every 3 years

How did your test strip with the phisolith last year go? I ment to ask you ages ago. Might give it a go on a test field.

GrasstoMilk

Never wrestle with pigs wrote: »

How did your test strip with the phisolith last year go? I ment to ask you ages ago. Might give it a go on a test field.

Been about 5 years since we did the test strip. We've been using it along time. Ideally it should have been spread back in early December so it would break down over the winter for the grass roots

alps

Used this, can't but help think it's snake oil...

Did the strip thing on the whole farm......couldn't tell the difference...

Waffletraktor

alps wrote: »

Used this, can't but help think it's snake oil...

Did the strip thing on the whole farm......couldn't tell the difference...

Buying yield.

larthehar

Is it no savage expensive? I thought i read somewhere like 240/ton.. and spread after that!!

GrasstoMilk

Waffletraktor wrote: »

Buying yield.

Wouldn't agree. I'm sure you know what mined out tillage ground with no OM or P and K is like. That was here. Worm casts now are unbelievable grass root structure is equally unbelievable compared to what it was. I reckon it's growing 1-1.5t grass here
Costs me 62€/HA every year an extra 1.5t of grass to us is worth 277€/ha

Waffletraktor

GrasstoMilk wrote: »

Wouldn't agree. I'm sure you know what mined out tillage ground with no OM or P and K is like. That was here. Worm casts now are unbelievable grass root structure is equally unbelievable compared to what it was. I reckon it's growing 1-1.5t grass here
Costs me 62€/HA every year an extra 1.5t of grass to us is worth 277€/ha

We've been here before....
The only thing you look for in lime is it's neutralising value(the cce or strenght of pure calcium carbonate to be exact) and granule size, its specifically the carbonate that does the work raising ph mostly as it's the alkali component. Physiolith's nv is 39 vs ground lime which is typically in the 50's but if the size of the particles are too large you'll have grey hair before it does anything(over here by law 40% of a sample needs to pass through 150micron sieve). How well ground is Physiolith, salesman should give you the info.
Calcium and magnesium are cations, you see which is further from the optimum to decide which type of lime you need to balance the cec as too much of either will strip out the other from the soil. Overly wet soils for a period will replace Ca sites on soil particles with Hions. Too dry and the Ca from lime can't move to replace the H-ions on soil Use ph to see when ph is getting low to affect other minerals to lime, then decide which type suits your soil. Too much water and or compaction will also cause anaerobic conditions and lower ph through production of organic acids/fermentation. This is why you need to take a few samples over the year to get a good picture.
In the past you have complained about compacted ground to the old Dawg have you not:). I would spend my first 2 tons of physiolith getting someone who knows what they're on about(probably not irish) to talk you through albrechts system There are 2 types of pH. One is water pH where the concentration of Hydrogen is measured between the soil particles (active acidity). The second one is the buffer pH (total acidity). Then you measure the Hydrogen concentration on the soil particles (reserve acidity) and between the soil particles (active acidity). When not using the Albrecht method to determine liming requirements, you would use the buffer pH. The reason is that the H in solution (between soil particles) is only temporary. It is being fed by the H attached to the soil particles which we want to remove using lime. Ca/Mg will be another thing to worry about here, as your ground has been 'mined'. Think of it as doing fec before dosing catttle and not peeing money away on the wrong thing. Then another 2-4 tons on lime and some more on a special batch of trace elements from the lads on the way to Monageer once you know what you need.
The sales leaflet crap wont even tell you what in it because a professional would rip it to shreds. It's calcified seaweed/coral-algea called Maerl from a by product of something else and i'm sure the margin on it is fairly high. Does the sales rep have a fresh company car? :pac:;)

Mooooo

Got these samples done in 2014 by glenside, what do you reckon on the recommendations waffle?

yosemitesam1

Waffletraktor wrote: »

We've been here before....
The only thing you look for in lime is it's neutralising value(the cce or strenght of pure calcium carbonate to be exact) and granule size, its specifically the carbonate that does the work raising ph mostly as it's the alkali component. Physiolith's nv is 39 vs ground lime which is typically in the 50's but if the size of the particles are too large you'll have grey hair before it does anything(over here by law 40% of a sample needs to pass through 150micron sieve). How well ground is Physiolith, salesman should give you the info.
Calcium and magnesium are cations, you see which is further from the optimum to decide which type of lime you need to balance the cec as too much of either will strip out the other from the soil. Overly wet soils for a period will replace Ca sites on soil particles with Hions. Too dry and the Ca from lime can't move to replace the H-ions on soil Use ph to see when ph is getting low to affect other minerals to lime, then decide which type suits your soil. Too much water and or compaction will also cause anaerobic conditions and lower ph through production of organic acids/fermentation. This is why you need to take a few samples over the year to get a good picture.
In the past you have complained about compacted ground to the old Dawg have you not:). I would spend my first 2 tons of physiolith getting someone who knows what they're on about(probably not irish) to talk you through albrechts system There are 2 types of pH. One is water pH where the concentration of Hydrogen is measured between the soil particles (active acidity). The second one is the buffer pH (total acidity). Then you measure the Hydrogen concentration on the soil particles (reserve acidity) and between the soil particles (active acidity). When not using the Albrecht method to determine liming requirements, you would use the buffer pH. The reason is that the H in solution (between soil particles) is only temporary. It is being fed by the H attached to the soil particles which we want to remove using lime. Ca/Mg will be another thing to worry about here, as your ground has been 'mined'. Think of it as doing fec before dosing catttle and not peeing money away on the wrong thing. Then another 2-4 tons on lime and some more on a special batch of trace elements from the lads on the way to Monageer once you know what you need.
The sales leaflet crap wont even tell you what in it because a professional would rip it to shreds. It's calcified seaweed/coral-algea called Maerl from a by product of something else and i'm sure the margin on it is fairly high. Does the sales rep have a fresh company car? :pac:;)

Does anyone over your way use a 'dris' system? Sort of an applied albrecht system where you'd tissue sample a couple of your best areas and compare different ratios to worst areas to get your target nutrient balance. Varies according to soil, yield, climate etc.