marriage problems

LegacyUser

i am going anominous for this thread. As the title suggests i am having serious problems with my marriage. I am married 8 years now and i have a good job, nice house and 3 lovley kids, the oldest one is 7. It is hard to know where to start in terms of our problems. I appresciate that there are 2 sides to an argument so here is my side. My wife is from abroad and she has little or no friends here in Ireland. Also she is not good at making friends, i think she is socially awquard and has little or no confidence. Recently we have been having a lot of arguments and i have to admit that my feelings for her are little or none. I am not physically or mentally attracted to her whatsoever. She was made redundant about 18 months ago and given the ages of our children we decided that it would be best that she stay at home to mind the children with the costs of childacre etc. Over this time she has put on a lot of weight.I gave her a hug recently and i struggled to get my arms around her. not a nice thing to say but the truth. truth been told i could do with losing some weight but i work long hours and commute a lot. when i try to think of positive things about her i struggle. One good thing is that she is 100% committed to the children in some respects in that she would do anything for them but the other side of this is that she seems to lose her temper with them a lot and shouts and screams at them non stop. one of the children aged 4 asked me just last night why is mammy so mean.

now some one may say that maybe she is spending too much time with the kids and needs a break. We have tried going out recently (only ever at my suggestion) and got a baby sitter. she made absilutley no effort to dress up, just wore the clothes that she wears around the house. the house is always a mess and i suggested getting a cleaner and asked her to look into it but thats 6 months ago and nothing has happend yet. i do more than my fair share with the kids in my opinion and my family and friends are always complimenting me on this.
whenever some one visits me she barley says hello, sometimes doesnt which causes me embarressemnt. Whenever i bring this up with her (tactfully) it leads to a massive row. i think she is jealous of my family and friends and without asking i think none of them have any time for her, they never ask for her or seem to make an effort which i dont blame them for this given the way she acts.

I have been deeply inhappy for some time now and have been putting up with it for the sake of the kids. if it wasnt for the kids i would be long gone. in fact i worry about leaving the kids with her too long given the way she treats them - dont get me wrong i get angry with the kids myself and shout at them when i know i shouldnt. i dont knwo why i am on here, i suppose that i want to get it off my chest as i am too embarassed to speak to anyone about it. when i say u have no feelings for her i mean it but i did once and i would like to get this back and make things work for the sake of everyine. I used to think that the children were the main priority and that i could stay in the marriage for the sake of them but is life too short for this? i shoudl also state that there is no one else invloved which complicates things such as an affair.

Tigger99

I feel very sorry for you both. She sounds as desperately unhappy as you. Tho at least you have work as s social release/ space away from being constantly in demand from 3 small kids.

She sounds very very down. I think that you need to firstly insist that she gets a break from the kids. You take them on a Saturday and arrange for her to go to the cinema/get a massage etc.

To be frank if I'd three kids and went from working to minding them full time with little contact with other adults I'd probably be close to the edge myself.

dar100

OP I can somewhat identify with your wife, I'm male if that makes a difference!!

I've recently left work to look after my two young kids, wife works!! Believe me it is harder than any job I've ever done, I've no contact with adults other than my wife, no social outlet, it's very very tuff and effect the mental health, and this is with me having the most wonderful wife so supportive and we get on great

I feel for you both, try talk and see where your both at,

Edit; I also shout at the kids, I feel bad about that, but by god it's hard

BetsyEllen

Tigger99 wrote: »

I feel very sorry for you both. She sounds as desperately unhappy as you. Tho at least you have work as s social release/ space away from being constantly in demand from 3 small kids.

She sounds very very down. I think that you need to firstly insist that she gets a break from the kids. You take them on a Saturday and arrange for her to go to the cinema/get a massage etc.

To be frank if I'd three kids and went from working to minding them full time with little contact with other adults I'd probably be close to the edge myself.

Good advice.
This seems to be a lot about you, but have you thought about how she is feeling?

groovyg

Op she sounds desperately unhappy and I'm not sure if staying at home to be a full time mum was a good idea for her. I know the costs of child care are huge and in some cases when both parents are working one wage is going just on childcare but would she consider looking for work just to get out of the house. It might be what she needs.

baby and crumble

going anon wrote: »

i do more than my fair share with the kids in my opinion and my family and friends are always complimenting me on this.

I'm not trying to jump down your throat but there is no way this can be happening if you are working fulltime out of the house and she is not. By the time you get home most evenings, likely they are ready to start going to bed. Unless you take over when you get home from work and put them to bed and care for them on your own all weekend, it's not a fair share.

I'm not saying that to blame you, at all, OP but I'm simply pointing out that you get out every day to see adults, meet people, and she's with her children all day, every day. No wonder she doesn't want to get dressed up and go out at the weekend- she probably feels like crap being pulled and pawed and puked on all day every day. Add to that I'm sure she realises she has put on weight and doesn't look like she used to, and that she gave up her career and this is what she has in return, I'm not surprised she's depressed and unmotivated.

Have you offered to take the kids on your own some weekend day, and treat her to a day off, totally? Like 100% for her. Maybe for her birthday or something you could treat her to a voucher to get her hair done or her nails or something. Do you tell her you love her? Because if she gets the feeling from you that you don't fancy her anymore then sometimes that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. "He doesn't fancy me so I might as well get fat and crap looking, not like it'll make it worse!"

BetsyEllen

baby and crumble wrote: »

I'm not trying to jump down your throat but there is no way this can be happening if you are working fulltime out of the house and she is not. By the time you get home most evenings, likely they are ready to start going to bed. Unless you take over when you get home from work and put them to bed and care for them on your own all weekend, it's not a fair share.

I'm not saying that to blame you, at all, OP but I'm simply pointing out that you get out every day to see adults, meet people, and she's with her children all day, every day. No wonder she doesn't want to get dressed up and go out at the weekend- she probably feels like crap being pulled and pawed and puked on all day every day. Add to that I'm sure she realises she has put on weight and doesn't look like she used to, and that she gave up her career and this is what she has in return, I'm not surprised she's depressed and unmotivated.

Have you offered to take the kids on your own some weekend day, and treat her to a day off, totally? Like 100% for her. Maybe for her birthday or something you could treat her to a voucher to get her hair done or her nails or something. Do you tell her you love her? Because if she gets the feeling from you that you don't fancy her anymore then sometimes that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. "He doesn't fancy me so I might as well get fat and crap looking, not like it'll make it worse!"

You also likely get an hours lunch, tea breaks, toilet breaks that you can take in peace...your wife isn't getting this.
You're also entitled to a minimum of 4 weeks annual leave to take time away from your duties, you get paid each month for doing what you do.
Your wife can't book 2 weeks paid holiday away from the kids or negotiate a payrise or complain to HR if she has a problem. She has no team mates around her to ask for help.

I find so often that men are complimented on doing the most basic of childcare duties!
He changes a nappy and suddenly deserves a round of applause, a shower of compliments and a medal, with everyone saying 'ah isn't he good' - a woman changes 10 in a day and no one bats an eyelid.

You want a cleaner, so you asked your wife to arrange it. Maybe you could arrange it for her?
Sort one out and tell her that you've organised for someone to come in once a week to help her out. I'm sure she will appreciate it.

She didn't dress up to go out with you as she is feeling unattractive. Maybe none of her nice clothes fit her anymore.

You'd be better treating her to some time alone by herself away from everything for a while.
Why don't you surprise her with a voucher for a massage or the hairdressers - tell her you'll take the kids that morning and she is not to argue. A spa day isn't really expensive.
Trust me, it will be appreciated. And getting her hair done or something like that may give her a little confidence boost.
Maybe get the cleaner to come in whilst she's gone so when she gets home it's to a tidy house.

On another note, I'm not from Ireland originally and it took me years to make friends here. I still spend a lot of time alone and loneliness can be a killer. I've had bouts of depression due to it.
Please don't underestimate how hard it is to be away from friends and family, it honestly can be soul destroying and hard to understand unless you've experienced it.

Sound Bite

This is a horrible situation and I feel for you both.

Without even having your wife's point of view she appears to be:

1. Lonely
2. Unhappy, possibly depressed
3. Exhausted
4. Impatient/Stressed
5. Fed up

If she is all of the above, you suggesting getting a cleaner, however well intended, she may view this as criticism, that you think she isn't doing a good enough job.

She's had 3 kids, was made redundant, had no support network or social outlet and has put on a significant amount of weight. She couldn't be feeling good about herself. She will also have picked up on the fact your feelings towards her have changed which probably compounds the issue.

None of this is anyone's fault. Sometimes life just gets in the way and things escalate if they aren't addressed early. Do you guys communicate? Like really communicate rather than just talk or argue. She probably also wants changes. You probably need some alone time just to talk about your relationship not just the kids or the house etc.

It's not going to get any better unless you both try to improve things.

Big Bag of Chips

You've listed out the many and varied things wrong about your wife, giving it as "your side". Her side might have a similar list of things she sees wrong about you! Rarely marriage problems come about through the fault of just one person. While you think she's quiet and unsocial she might think you aren't understanding of her uneasiness and ignore her in favour of socialising with your friends and exclude her. Just as you have your point of view, she'll have here.

You don't like your wife. That won't have escaped her. Your family and friends don't like her. That won't have escaped her, either. She is in a foreign country away from her family, friends and supports. She has no friends and no social outlet or support structure. She's deeply unhappy. Now, you are equally unhappy, but you're in familiar surroundings. You have people around you who love you, like you, praise you for being a dad! No matter how good you are with your children, you're not doing "more than your fair share"!! They're your children and you should be doing everything you possibly can with them and for them. It's funny, I never hear mothers being described as doing more than their fair share! It's always the dads who get the credit for being great

Anyway, I think you need to sit down and have a proper, real, serious conversation with your wife. If its not something you've ever done as a couple before it might take a few attempts for both of you to understand what's going on, and to open up to each other. You said you used to love her and you want that back. So focus on that. Focus on your faults and where you have let her down and ask her what you can do to help her. In time she will come to admit her faults and where she needs help to improve things for herself and you as a couple.

You need to be united. From what I'm reading though you're not. And not only are you not united, she's actually on the fringe looking at you, your family and friends all united against her. Marriage counselling might be helpful to you too, but you need to at least start communicating your worries and feelings to her. You need to find a reset button and see what you can do to move forward, together. But be patient. She might resist talking and exposing herself emotionally if it's not something she's used to doing. But ask her is she happy? Ask her what she needs in order to be happy, and tell her what you need. Just be kind in your words and she should react in kind.

kerryjack

OP your post is very honest and I can certainly feel your pain. I was in a much similar situation like yourself and I am sure they are plenty more in the same situation. Thankfully we have come out the otherside, the solution was a simple one for us I stayed at home and OH went back to work, there is no more complaining about having to stay at home with kids and no more complaining about work. for me its the best job in the world you would be kept busy but its very rewarding. Could you take a few weeks off and take over completely and show OH how it should be done, she might pep up a bit .

Dial Hard

kerryjack wrote:

Could you take a few weeks off and take over completely and show OH how it should be done, she might pep up a bit .

Yes, mansplaining to his wife how to mind her own kids is absolutely the way to solve this problem.

Mother of god.

BetsyEllen

kerryjack wrote: »

Could you take a few weeks off and take over completely and show OH how it should be done, she might pep up a bit .

Wow...that is so patronising that you surely must be joking?

kerryjack

Dial Hard wrote: »

Yes, mansplaining to his wife how to mind her own kids is absolutely the way to solve this problem.

Mother of god.

Well he said himself she is shouting and roaring at them no way to treat children like that ,I wouldn't like someone roaring at my dog never mind my child

kerryjack

BetsyEllen wrote: »

Wow...that is so patronising that you surely must be joking?

No I am not its just to show her how much fun you can have with your kids, go to parks ,cycling, baking, cooking swiming great memories to have with your kids.

dee_mc

kerryjack wrote: »

Well he said himself she is shouting and roaring at them no way to treat children like that ,I wouldn't like someone roaring at my dog never mind my child

He also said that he shouts at them, too.
The OP's wife is clearly in a very vulnerable place right now - by some miracle, your tactless methods worked well in your marriage, but they're not applicable in the OP's case.
OP, I feel for you, but you're giving yourself too much credit and your wife not enough. Read your own post there again. Read the bit about your weight gain and hers. Then read it again. You're assuming that your work is harder than hers and that it justifies your weight gain. Give your wife a bit of that consideration!

Big Bag of Chips

I've been both a stay at home parent and a working parent. I loved and appreciated having the opportunity to stay at home with my children. But I can't say I didn't enjoy working. It gives your day structure, routine, makes you get washed and dressed!! It gives you regular meal times. It gives you social interaction. It gives you job satisfaction. It doesn't matter how often you clean off your kitchen table, the job is never done. There's no tangible job satisfaction from being a stay at home mother. There's no monetary reward. There's nobody encouraging you telling you you're doing "more than your fair share", there's nobody even telling you you're doing an 'ok' job. Nobody thanks you. Ever! You're expected to be there. It's taken for granted that you will do everything, and you are expected to enjoy it.

Your wife doesn't sound like she ever planned to be a stay at home parent. It sounds like it was a decision that was made for her. Maybe she needs to get back to work. Even part time. You need to talk to her. The only way to solve any problems is talking them through. Not laying the blame on any one person. Because you're both at fault here.

LLMMLL

OP it sounds like you need to lose weight yourself so how about tackling this and asking your wife for support. No sweets in the house etc. Ask her to join you for runs/walks. It's unfair to expect her to remain slim while you put on weight. Everyone has their own reason why they gain weight and yours is no more special than hers. I would actually eat far more crap when bored at home than when I'm out and about working.

Some of the attitudes towards childcare in this thread are pretty unfair. People on here seem to think "woman at home with kids = awful life" "man at work = Having the time of his life". Both have their stresses and rewards and coming home from a long day at work doesn't mean that you have to 100% take over the child minding duties to "do your fair share". It's quite possible the OP is actually doing his fair share and isn't the chauvinistic ogre he's being portrayed as.

Sleepy

Dial Hard wrote: »

Yes, mansplaining to his wife how to mind her own kids is absolutely the way to solve this problem.

Mother of god.

"mansplaining" :rolleyes: Giving birth does not automatically make someone an expert on child-rearing. Perhaps some education (although I'd suggest from a professional, rather than the OP) might benefit her?

Also are they not "their" kids? Or are you so blinded by feminist ideology that you consider them to be her property?

Cork Lass

"I gave her a hug recently and i struggled to get my arms around her. not a nice thing to say but the truth. truth been told i could do with losing some weight but i work long hours and commute a lot. "

Maybe your own weight made it hard for you to get your arms around her. Just something for you to think about on your commute to your job with the long hours.

daithi7

Oh ffs folks,

Give over on the weight issue. It's pretty obvious from the Op's post that he sees himself as a bit overweight, but she sounds like she is becoming obese.

So reading the rest of his post re moods, unhappiness, shouting at the kids, massive weight gain, etc, etc it sounds like his oh is in a pretty bad place. Perhaps posts assisting him on how he might help her out of this dark place would be more useful , rather than jumping down his throat for commenting negatively on his wife's alarming weight gain.

I mean heaven forbid, stone him, stone him, I say!!

Taltos

Mod Note
OK back on topic here. Sleepy please take care than in your objection of other's valid viewpoints you don't derail threads. This is an advice forum and not a discussion forum on feminist or other ideologies.

looksee

It would be helpful to remove all 'blame'. There is no 'fault' here, the op is frustrated and wants to improve the situation, his wife is unhappy and apparently needs help. Trying to allocate fault and blame is no help at all.

OP, I think your wife needs your support and help at the moment. Leave yourself out of it, you seem to be currently stable and coping with life. She is not, and needs some help. That situation could change, your job could run into problems and you might be the one needing help.

Talk to her, not from a point of view of how she affects you, but how she feels and affects herself. Ask if she is somehow upset with you. See if you can persuade her to go to her gp, if necessary go to the gp on your own and express your concern for her. Many of the things you have listed would be on any list of things to look out for if she is depressed. I'm not suggesting she is, but it is something that should be explored.

Is it necessary for you to do so much commuting, given that you work long hours? If that is a long term prospect could you consider moving a bit closer to your work? Does she have a car? Even injecting a bit of 'something is changing positively' into your lives may give her the boost she needs.

Maybe find the most sympathetic member of your family and ask them to try and make contact - I don't mean practise psychology on her or patronise her, but your saying that your family do not like her says as much about your interaction as hers.You really do have to go the extra mile to make her feel part of the community and your family. At the moment you are 'siding' with them, there is no wonder she feels lonely.

Edit, oops its so easy! I sound as though I am allocating blame there in the last paragraph, after all I said!

LegacyUser

Sounds like your wife is stuck in a very dark place and trapped in a cycle. Shes not nice to your family and friends so they are not nice to hear which of course makes her not want to be nice to them etc etc She's in a foreign country with no family, she lost her job and is now stuck at home. It might make financial sense for her to stay home but it's clearly not something she is suited for. Having one night out isn't going to fix things, you need to make lasting changes to how your family is running.

You need to sit down and have an honest talk about where you are - if this isn't possible then you need to get a third person as mediator. You need to break things down to deal with them. Put your romantic relationship to the side for now, you've stated your not attracted to her at this point so lets focus on work and kids. She's not happy as a stay at home mum so she either needs to start looking for a job or doing a course to help her get one. You need to divide up looking after the kids, not just doing all the fun activities but dealing with everything. You need to speak to your family to cop on, I know she's also equally at fault but regardless of wither your marriage lasts she is still the mother of your children and that is not going to change.

Now it may happen a few or several months from now you find you are still not attracted to her and want to end the marriage but at least if you focus on co-parenting better and she is back working you will be able to separate on better terms and both be able to stand on your own.

lurker2000

I'm no expert but it sounds like your wife is suffering from depression - post natal depression possibly unless she was always standoffish with your family and friends when you met her first. You fell in love with her before, there was a reason for that and there is still a chance that you can rekindle those feelings.

A lot of posters have spoken about her being locked a home with three children, but one of them at least is at school and possibly two by now - so she's not totally surrounded by drudge day in and day out. Having both worked and stayed at home, I know the pressures of both, but she would have opportunities to have some 'me time' during the week if she really wanted it, even if it was putting the youngest ones in a public creche for an hour or two. The fact that she seems so inert and unable to tackle dressing up much less the housework is a sign that she is not coping at all.

Your declining closeness and her weight gain have contributed no doubt to her low spirits-not helped by being away from her own family and friends. You make no mention of these, are they concerned about her too? Do they visit often or does she visit them? As she is foreign, I would be concerned that in the event of a marriage breakdown, she would try to take the kids back to her home country. Can you get her mother/sister/friend over for a few weeks to see if they can get to the bottom of her unhappiness.

But for starters you need to both have a very honest heart to heart, a session with a family counsellor and she needs to be assessed by a sympathetic GP. If she can express her concerns and worries, it could be the start of recovering your fractured relationship and this can only benefit your children. I wish you all the very best for a good outcome

ShaShaBear

OP I can see where you are coming from, and applaud that you are fully aware that there are two sides to this story.

Your wife sounds utterly miserable. I'm currently a stay-at-home mum of 2 toddlers and by GAWD it can be soul-destroying locked in a house day in and day out with no adults to talk to and no me-time.
I am not depressed, but there are rough weeks where I could be seen as "circling the bowl" so to speak.
I had a few close friends, all of which (bar one who is longish distance) vanished once kid number one appeared on the scene. I do have family close by, but our opinions on a lot of things differ greatly and while we are close, I couldn't socialise with them often.
Sometimes my kids behave and I get a bit of housework done and get to eat a proper meal or two. Other times I have to get by totally on crisps and toast because my eldest keeps bullying my youngest and the layout of my house doesn't allow for kitchen use without leaving them primarily unsupervised. We only have an upstairs toilet and there have been days where I have to take the two of them upstairs with me just to take a wee. If my partner is not here and I want a shower, I have to put BOTH of them in with me.
My house is a kip. I spend ages at night cleaning and cleaning and the place looks lovely and as soon as we get up the next morning, it's like it was never touched. And I've lost my entire night to boot!
I put on a LOT of weight. We have a kitchenette and it got so bad that my partner couldn't squeeze past me in it. But he stepped in, helped me out. I'm down 2 stone now and still working at it. We also put my eldest in creche 2 days a week which allows me to maintain some of the more challenging parts of the housework, get some batch cooking done and shower in peace, maybe even read a book! :eek:

Maybe a huge step forward in making life better for you both is to ask what can be done to help her. My partner did suggest a cleaner before, and I was so upset and offended that he thought I could sit there and watch a stranger tidy my home for me, so I'm not surprised she hasn't moved on that front. As for the dressing, not surprised about that either. At my biggest, and even now, I really struggle to find a balance between clothes that fit and clothes I will actually wear. The fact that she agreed to a babysitter and went out with you suggests you were on the right track here - she needed a break and wanted some alone time and attention from you!

It can be really, really hard at home with kids and when you get into a slump like your wife is in, and I was in until recently, it's hard to even want to do anything to get out of it

HiGlo

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

Focus on your faults and where you have let her down and ask her what you can do to help her.

In my opinion this is a great starting point.... I understand your feelings toward her have changed, but people aren't stupid, they can pick up on these things...
A valuable lesson I learned many years ago in counselling is that you can't change people, all you can do is change yourself and how you behave to them and hope that they respond. My experience with this to date has been true so perhaps this is a good starting point - along with, as others have suggested, fully taking over looking after the kids for a day or two and giving your wife a total break.

I have to say, I winced a little bit reading your versions of weight gain for you and your wife. Yours is just a little bit and it's justified, hers is a lot and a problem..... Interesting perspective. Weight gain isn't just about having time to go to the gym - it's about a balanced diet too and that's got nothing to do with your long hours or commute.

Hope it works out for you two.

professore

There are plenty of outlets for people at home with kids to meet people. My wife was forever going to coffee mornings, toddler gyms, and a million other things when she wasn't working. A lot of them are free or very cheap too - and there are highly educated, interesting and intelligent people doing this too if that's what she's worried about. She's not Irish either but we have several friends from that time 15 years later. Surprised no one has mentioned this.

You say she's not Irish, maybe there is some meetup for people from her country or at least that speak her language?

Having said all that, she sounds chronically unhappy. Have you had a sit down and been upfront about your feelings with her? She might be suffering from post natal depression.

ShaShaBear

professore wrote: »

There are plenty of outlets for people at home with kids to meet people. My wife was forever going to coffee mornings, toddler gyms, and a million other things when she wasn't working. A lot of them are free or very cheap too - and there are highly educated, interesting and intelligent people doing this too if that's what she's worried about. She's not Irish either but we have several friends from that time 15 years later. Surprised no one has mentioned this.

You say she's not Irish, maybe there is some meetup for people from her country or at least that speak her language?

Having said all that, she sounds chronically unhappy. Have you had a sit down and been upfront about your feelings with her? She might be suffering from post natal depression.

There are literally none of those things were I live. Closest toddler morning is a 25 minute drive away, and I do not drive. I went to one shortly after my first, was judged heavily for breastfeeding, heard a snide comment about my weight and did not return. They are most certainly not for everyone assuming you can find a reachable one in your locality!

Big Bag of Chips

Some are great, some are very cliquey or clanish. And to walk into an established room of strangers who all know each other you have to have a confidence and social side that means you find it easy to talk to people. They are certainly not for everyone. These are the kinds of meet ups that you already need to have friends for before you really get into the social side.