Sobriety checkpoints

irishrgr

Saw on RTE earlier in the week about a number of drunk drivers arrested, well done. Made me wonder, how do the sobriety/drunk driver checkpoints work in Ireland? Under Irish law do the Gardaí need PC to ask you to blow into the bag or can they just demand it? IE, I'm driving along, stop at checkpoint, have license and insurance, good tax, etc., does the member need to smell alcohol, see bloodshot eyes, slurred speech, etc. before conducting the sobriety test.
Over here we don't really do the checkpoints, it's a legal minefield when they were tried, most agencies just don't bother. We use the PC from the initial violation (speeding, swerving across the line, etc.) to make the stop, then we can start down the road of testing if we have reasonable suspicion (odor of alcohol, etc.). FWIW, if they fail the field sobriety test, then we arrest, bring them to the nick, get a warrant for the blood draw, do the breath test there, more sobriety tests, everything on video. We have paramedics assigned to the jail who do the blood draws. It ends up taking about three hours all told.
Curious to see what you lads of,
A

Mandatory Alcohol Testing checkpoints have been around for years. They're authorised by a Cig or higher and allow all drivers to be breathalysed. If they refuse they commit an offence.

Section 9 of the RTA 2010 covers the rest of the options;

9.— (1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána—

(a) is of opinion that a person in charge of a vehicle in a public place—

(i) has consumed intoxicating liquor, the member shall require, or

(ii) (I) is or has, with the vehicle, been involved in a collision, or

(II) is committing or has committed an offence under the Road Traffic Acts 1961 to 2010

If you believe that a driver is under the influence of drugs then you can carry out a Roadside Impairment Test. Haven't see it being done and don't think many are trained in it. I'm not. There are plans to bring in roadside drug tests and they will be incorporated into checkpoints.

easygoing1982

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Section 9 of the RTA 2010 covers the rest of the options;

They are probably both the same but is there a section 10 RTA.

I was stopped last night at a MAT checkpoint and the guard said he was requesting a sample of breath under Section 10

easygoing1982

easygoing1982 wrote: »

They are probably both the same but is there a section 10 RTA.

I was stopped last night at a MAT checkpoint and the guard said he was requesting a sample of breath under Section 10

Sec 10 is the checkpoint. Everything else is sec 9.

Seth Brundle

Just wondering (for curiosity and not "for a friend"), (and given the amount of dash cams that can record sound/voice), if the garda had said that they were taking a sample under section 10 and the driver was found to be over the limit, would the driver not have good technical grounds to get off any charge?

Whitewater-AGS

kbannon wrote: »

Just wondering (for curiosity and not "for a friend"), (and given the amount of dash cams that can record sound/voice), if the garda had said that they were taking a sample under section 10 and the driver was found to be over the limit, would the driver not have good technical grounds to get off any charge?

No because section 10 if you read it covers the authorisation to set up the checkpoint and also to demand breath specimen. If you had a crash and where not at a checkpoint and had a sample demanded under section 10 then you may have a legal point to raise in court as that demand should be made under section 9 of the act. Clear as mud like most drink driving law, case law and legal challenges in this jurisdiction.

Sleeper12

foreign wrote:

Mandatory Alcohol Testing checkpoints have been around for years. They're authorised by a Cig or higher and allow all drivers to be breathalysed. If they refuse they commit an offence.

Except for Alan Shatter. He has asthma and couldn't give a sample

kub

kbannon wrote:

Just wondering (for curiosity and not "for a friend"), (and given the amount of dash cams that can record sound/voice), if the garda had said that they were taking a sample under section 10 and the driver was found to be over the limit, would the driver not have good technical grounds to get off any charge?

If you had an audio recording of a conversation and if one of the parties in that conversation did not know about it then it cannot be admitted as evidence.

irishrgr

OK, thanks, different legal systems, interesting. Good way to get the drunks off the road. We have to be certified in the Standard Field Sobriety test (SFST), it's a two day class with volunteers who get to have a few jars to demonstrate the effects. (and yes, they have to show up with a designated driver and be over 21!!!). Then you have to recertify every two years. I haven't taken the class yet, on the "to-do" list. If I pull someone over, I can administer some basic testing while I'm waiting for a certified officer to turn up. All the tests are done on video roadside, and likewise again at the jail. Even if you 'lawyer up" and get it thrown out on some technicality, in TX, your license is automatically suspended for 90 days (unless you can show cause otherwise), car gets towed, etc. Average costs is $7500 to the suspect by the time you add it all up.
Still, it doesn't seem to be that much of a deterrent, we still get loads of them all the time, especially at the holidays. Our local PD even has a special van for all the blood draws and testing (a converted RV), to take pressure off the jail, but it still takes a few hours to process them.
Thanks,

A

irishrgr

Forgot to add this, for sheer entertainment value. A few years back a mate got to pull over our District Attorney, fair play to him, he handled it very professionally. She was pretty intoxicated, ended up getting nicked, started a fight at the jail, finally was convicted and got 45 days. She has since resigned :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-bj-BLTRRo

Whitewater-AGS

http://www.thejournal.ie/handcuffs-drink-driving-dismissal-3058921-Nov2016/. At least your allowed handcuff prisoners in the states!

irishrgr

Wow, crazy, that is madness you have to have "violent prisoner" before you cuff them!!! So apparently the good judge is not concerned about officer safety and it's OK if some numpty kicks off in the back of the patrol car (which don't seem to have custody cages in Ireland). We absolutely HAVE to cuff all prisoners, regardless of anything or how good they are. It's agency policy and backed up by loads of case law.
I would be happy to have the learned judge come ride along and explain to me his benchmarks for deciding who "won't get violent" and be sure to offer the most profound apologies when they kick off. Of course his honour would be in the back with said prisoner and he could explain to him/her his logic between blows, kicks and bites.
Our prisioners remain cuffed all the way through the booking process. If the jail assess them as non-combative (their call not mine), they will be uncuffed and sent to a cell. if they continue to act the arse, they can be restrained up to including soft restraints in a padded chain. If a prisoner goes in the ambulance from the scene, they are handcuffed (officer may/may not ride in the ambo depending on what the medics & officers decide), at the casualty ward, guess what, handcuffed to the trolley (usually a set of leg irons). It's a pain in the hole, mind you, as you have to stay there with your prisoner until an officer from the jail shows up to relieve you.
Honestly lads, I'm gobsmacked you can't cuff them. Sound of hand slapping forehead!!!!! Good luck then, be careful.