Attaching curtain pole to cozy board advice

boardtc

I want to hang a curtain pole over a double door. When the wall was built there were no batons added, the construction is 100mm block work and 50mm cozy\insulated board. There is no vapour layer I'm told. I also have curtain tie back hooks to install.

The hardware store advised me to use a 6mm pilot hole with a 80mm drill bit and then use a nylon hammer fix 80mm, I made those purchases. He also recommended drilling into the concrete for the tieback hooks as he said they could be caught by kids and the plaster pulled off otherwise. There are 3 holes on these hooks, 2 close together.

I started drilling the pilot hole for the rail and realised I needed a hammer action drill to get fully into the concrete. I have than now but in the meantime I double checked with the builder who advised me to use 100mm screws and red wall plugs. I'm not sure how I would get the red wall plugs through the cozy board?

Going back to to the hardware store with the builder's feedback another assistant said people all over the country hang curtain rails using Tap-It Plasterboard 30mm Fixings (Rawlplug) with a screw, just into the cosy board and that's fine!

So, I'm unsure how to proceed. Any advice is much appreciated!

jonon9

Drill the hole to the required depth, than place the plug in the hole, than place the curtain pole holder up and insert the screw now a few small taps with the hammer on the screw head to push in the plug till it seats into the block wall and then begin to screw until it s all the way in. Iv used this method loads of times without fail. The only way for it to fail if a person did chin ups off the pole.

There is also a plasterboard fitting that you screw into the plasterboard and then you screw into the fittings

the_pen_turner

Get some express Anchors. 150mm minimum.
Drill an 8mm hole in the wall and hammer them is flush. Put a few 6mm plugs into the end. At least 2 deal. Then mount the bracket

boardtc

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Get some express Anchors. 150mm minimum.
Drill an 8mm hole in the wall and hammer them is flush. Put a few 6mm plugs into the end. At least 2 deal. Then mount the bracket

The 2nd guy in the hardware store did show me the express anchors (also called express nails I think), I think it was at that point that I threw my hands up! I saw they were 8mm alright. It seems a very interesting option. My understanding is that they bend in the concrete. How deep would I have to drill in to use a 1500mm express anchor, would a 80mm bit be ok or would you go to 100mm? Would 80mm screws be ok? When You says at least 2 6mm plus do you mean stacking in short ones into the anchor, or alternatively use a long plug?

Calahonda52

No they don't bend, they compress in the hole as they have a slit down the side.
the cozy is 50mm and the block is 100 so I think 120mm by 8mm is enough, that way you don't perform the cavity.
Drill the hole say 130mm deep and clean it out with a vacuum cleaner and then drive in the express nail until it is flush with the plasterboard, be warned that this is a one way ride so if you drill too shallow and it does not go all the way in you will have to trim it off.

This requires a fair degree of precise marking out and drilling and if you run into a joint in the block work you may not get a good fix with the express nail..
Can you post a picture of the rail bracket pls

DublinDilbert

I put up a curtain rail in a hallway a few weeks back with 3 express nails, put one in the top of each bracket. Then rawl plug into the center of the express nail. Excellent job, will never budge.

But before I drilled into the concrete for the express nails, i used normal rawl plugs to test fit the rail and make sure the curtains were the correct length etc... once i was happy it was level and at the correct height I removed the rail and then drilled for the express nails.

boardtc

Good stuff @DublinDilbert, I like the plan. Rawlplug into an express nail, nice idea, which rawlplug did you use?

@Calahonda52 here's the rail bracket below. Good tip on the vacuum cleaner. Not sure if you recommend going 120mm or 130mm deep, @Calahonda52 / @the_pen_turner only 150mm to work with!

Would 3 rawlplugs shown by @jonon9 alone be ok for the side hooks or would ye anchor into concrete too?

DublinDilbert

boardtc wrote: »

Good stuff @DublinDilbert, I like the plan. Rawlplug into an express nail, nice idea, which rawlplug did you use?

@Calahonda52 here's the rail bracket below. Good tip on the vacuum cleaner. Not sure if you recommend going 120mm or 130mm deep, @Calahonda52 / @the_pen_turner only 150mm to work with!

Would 3 rawlplugs shown by @jonon9 alone be ok for the side hooks or would ye anchor into concrete too?

Yellow Hilti rawl plugs, but almost any plug will do. I think the express nails I used were 100mm, so 50mm for the insulation, 50mm for the brick.

I'd just use standard plugs for the tie backs, not much weight and if a child does get tangled up, you want it to pull off the wall.

martinr5232

Six or eight mm frame fixers is what i have used for this job in the past and never an issue.

boardtc

So many ways of doing the job!

@DublinDilbert how far did you drill in for the 100mm express nails?

@martinr5232 is this what you mean by frame fixers, these are the ones I got:

martinr5232

Yeah thats them.

boardtc

Hoping to get this over the line in the morning. Obviously a bunch of ways to do the job. I am thinking I will go with the express nail, just cos. I'll have to ask in the hardware store as I am still unsure how much the nails compress and what size hole you need drilled compared to the length of the express nail. Thanks for all the advice.

looksee

jonon9 wrote: »

There is also a plasterboard fitting that you screw into the plasterboard and then you screw into the fittings

I have tried a couple of times to use these and on each occasion the plasterboard has ended up so mangled that it has been a 'fill and start again with something else' job.

DublinDilbert

boardtc wrote: »

Hoping to get this over the line in the morning. Obviously a bunch of ways to do the job. I am thinking I will go with the express nail, just cos. I'll have to ask in the hardware store as I am still unsure how much the nails compress and what size hole you need drilled compared to the length of the express nail. Thanks for all the advice.

M8 express nails will need an 8mm drill bit, so the M8 express nail is about 9mm before you hammer it in.

https://www.goodwins.ie/products/id-2102.html?filter_set%5B0%5D=11%2C204&

Calahonda52

looksee wrote: »

I have tried a couple of times to use these and on each occasion the plasterboard has ended up so mangled that it has been a 'fill and start again with something else' job.

If I recall correctly the front of these is 7mm in diameter so I usually drill a 7mm hole first through the pb and then start with the cordless drill at v low speed, with steady pressure.

This pilot also finds any screws/nails/mushroom fittings, but leave little patching up if you do hit one:D

boardtc

It's a first-in build and there's nothing to hit there. I have to go through 50mm cosy board before hitting the concrete. My drill was not able to get through the concrete so I have a load of a hammer action. I'll check with hardware store in a few if I need to use 7mm or 8mm. I remain undecided about whether to use 110/150 expresses and what depth to drill into concrete. All solutions will probably work anyway :-)

DublinDilbert

boardtc wrote: »

It's a first-in build and there's nothing to hit there. I have to go through 50mm cosy board before hitting the concrete. My drill was not able to get through the concrete so I have a load of a hammer action. I'll check with hardware store in a few if I need to use 7mm or 8mm. I remain undecided about whether to use 110/150 expresses and what depth to drill into concrete. All solutions will probably work anyway :-)

M8 express nail takes an 8mm drill. Its only a curtain rail, just mark the length of the express nail on the drill bit with some tape and drill the wall. With a 50mm cavity, 110mm is fine, you could hang out of it.

boardtc

So back at the hardware store, I went back to the first assistant I had dealt with, he was very anti express nails and using rawplugs inside them. I let him talk me out of that. He proposed another option! Concrete Screws!

I drilled using the 6mm bit in 105mm or so. The vacuum got nothing out. I then tightened the screws by hand, got them in with effort. Seems a good job.

The issue I have now though is that my argus pole is not long enough, I need 324mm wide and the 3 piece pole is 330when fully extended but there needs to be overlap for the 3 poles to hold and 3 cm each side is not enough to avoid sag :-( Ideally I would get a once piece pole and hopefully similar brackets (once argus pole returned), where pole slot is 13mm above a single hole. Any advice on where I could get a long curtain pole?

the_pen_turner

concrete screws are great.
the best thing about the express nail and plugs is that wont cruss in the slab. iv seen people use all kinds if fixings and you see the slab bent in a lot

Sleeper12

looksee wrote: »

I have tried a couple of times to use these and on each occasion the plasterboard has ended up so mangled that it has been a 'fill and start again with something else' job.

These can't take much weight & even less weight with the pulling open & close curtains twice a day. They might be ok for light curtains that stay open all the time. Rule of thumb is fixings should be in the concrete

Would 3 rawlplugs shown by @jonon9 alone be ok for the side hooks or would ye anchor into concrete too?

As above do a permanent job from the get go. Get into the concrete

boardtc

boardtc wrote: »

The issue I have now though is that my argus pole is not long enough, I need 324mm wide and the 3 piece pole is 330when fully extended but there needs to be overlap for the 3 poles to hold and 3 cm each side is not enough to avoid sag :-( Ideally I would get a once piece pole and hopefully similar brackets (once argus pole returned), where pole slot is 13mm above a single hole. Any advice on where I could get a long curtain pole?

I got a length so 12x12 pine stripe wood and inserted it inside the pole today, given the joins much more stability! Job done, thanks for all your advice, I learned a bunch :-)