Landlord trying to negotiate - should I accept?

Danger HighVoltage

I posted up on here a few weeks ago fuming about the property I was renting.

To cut a long story short - I began renting a flat in Limerick in late August. Quite run down when I went to see it, put the landlord was promising to have the place immaculate within a few weeks. He promised heating would be put in place and that various missing items would be installed.
Essentially, most of his promises were empty - but eventually, when he installed a stove heater it spewed smoke back into the flat, destroying everything. Carbon monoxide alarm went off constantly. The flat was so damp that bed sheets were damp going to bed and then in the morning I had to dress myself in damp clothes. I even had to join a gym to shower in because the steam would exasperate the dampness.
Whenever I said anything to the landlord he would dismiss me - saying I was over reacting and being ridiculous. Even when I told him I was worried about the carbon monoxide because a family member of mine died a couple of years ago due to carbon monoxide poisoning. He also would not install fire safety measures - so I had to myself.
Our upstairs neighbour also had keys to my flat and he (and the landlord) regularly let himself in to light fires and god knows what else.

Eventually, after realising that he had no intention of taking my concerns seriously - I got my stuff together and moved out with half a month of rent paid in advance. He wouldn't give back my deposit.

This man rents across Limerick city and is obviously not new in the game. Despite this, he wasn't registered with the ptrb. I registered a mediation with them, to get my deposit back so I can actually afford to get another apartment. After the mediation date was set, I got a phone call from him offering half the deposit in exchange for ending the dispute.

I really don't want to have to go through court etc at risk of losing the whole deposit.
Should I take the negotiation? Or would I be better off seeing this through?

Graham

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

I really don't want to have to go through court etc at risk of losing the whole deposit.
Should I take the negotiation? Or would I be better off seeing this through?

If talking to the landlord directly is not working, register a dispute with the RTB. RTB will make a determination without you needing to go anywhere near a court.

Danger HighVoltage

I have registered a dispute for telephone mediation for next week, but I am unsure where I sit legally - whether or not I would get my deposit back at all

godtabh

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

I really don't want to have to go through court etc at risk of losing the whole deposit.
Should I take the negotiation? Or would I be better off seeing this through?

Tell him you want it all. Give him 24 hours to decide then take the offer off the table.

Graham

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

I have registered a dispute for telephone mediation for next week, but I am unsure where I sit legally - whether or not I would get my deposit back at all

Be sure to mention the Carbon monoxide alarms going off were a major factor in deciding it was not safe for you to continue the tenancy.

Red Kev

He's negotiating which means he knows he's in the wrong. I'd ask for everything I'm owed back plus some payment for the amount of wasted time plus any additional costs he caused.

If he doesn't pay up I'd have the PRTB meeting followed by a chat with Revenue. Tell him that.

RedXIV

As Red Kev says, no one stars negotiations when they are winning. You have him on the back foot, he's opened up the door to negotiations, go right back at him. Look for full deposit and don't be afraid of dropping Revenue and PRTB in the conversation.

Remember, he's been screwing with you for months, so don't feel bad for fighting back

punisher5112

Op keep up with the action. I had something similar had to leave early got environmental health in also and ended up getting deposit and also compensated a months rent back also.

Don't drop it as he will not bother giving you the money anyway.

Document everything and I hope you have pictures and any other records of problems.

Panthro

Tell him full amount returned to you within a day or no deal.

Danger HighVoltage

Problem is, there is no Irish law about carbon monoxide that I can find. He is also an ex-solicitor so I think he knows his way around the law.
The flat was definitely not safe to live in though.

On the other side - why would he offer a negotiation if he thinks he's in the right!

frag420

Try and get that offer from him via text as then you have proof, better than a he said/she said scenario!

Maybe send him a text asking how much he is willing to pay for you not to go to the PRTB. Once you have that reply you have him over a barrel as it is proof he is taking the p1ss!!

RedXIV

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

Problem is, there is no Irish law about carbon monoxide that I can find. He is also an ex-solicitor so I think he knows his way around the law.
The flat was definitely not safe to live in though.

On the other side - why would he offer a negotiation if he thinks he's in the right!

The fact an ex-solicitor is willing to negotiate makes me think he really knows just how much trouble he's in. If his bread and butter came from winning in legal settings and he doesn't want to enter one, I'd be pretty confident

Graham

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

Problem is, there is no Irish law about carbon monoxide that I can find.

One or two laws would potentially cover killing a tenant.

OP, just keep on as you're going. AT this stage it sounds like your ex-landlord knows the areas where he's exposed, it's probably not worth going down some of the verging-on-blackmail routes being proposed.

Danger HighVoltage

punisher5112 wrote: »

Op keep up with the action. I had something similar had to leave early got environmental health in also and ended up getting deposit and also compensated a months rent back also.

Don't drop it as he will not bother giving you the money anyway.

Document everything and I hope you have pictures and any other records of problems.

What kind of evidence did you have?
It was hard to doccument the issues, I have pictures of dehumidifiers and some mould on the wall. But I was so paranoid about exposure to the mould that I cleaned everywhere pretty much daily - it was a pretty rash leaving. I had a couple of sleepless nights and then decided to pack up. Not a huge amount of mould build up to photograph.

Danger HighVoltage

Red Kev wrote: »

He's negotiating which means he knows he's in the wrong. I'd ask for everything I'm owed back plus some payment for the amount of wasted time plus any additional costs he caused.

If he doesn't pay up I'd have the PRTB meeting followed by a chat with Revenue. Tell him that.

I'd be pretty sure he's dodging tax too, no rent book and a lot of foreign people working on his land. He was extending on the back of the flat too, couldn't find planning permission for it.

Judging by everyone's replies - I should keep pursuing. He knows he's in the wrong, why else would he negotiate..

punisher5112

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

What kind of evidence did you have?
It was hard to doccument the issues, I have pictures of dehumidifiers and some mould on the wall. But I was so paranoid about exposure to the mould that I cleaned everywhere pretty much daily - it was a pretty rash leaving. I had a couple of sleepless nights and then decided to pack up. Not a huge amount of mould build up to photograph.

Place was so bad if left for 2 weeks without washing down walls etc. Mould and even mushroom type growths occurred.

Place was damp clothes destroyed including documents passports etc.

Was an absolute dump but when 1st viewed had just been painted so didn't seem to bad.

Heating on near 24 hours a day. All windows opened daily no clothes dried inside and walls were as black as the road.

Danger HighVoltage

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

I'd be pretty sure he's dodging tax too, no rent book and a lot of foreign people working on his land. He was extending on the back of the flat too, couldn't find planning permission for it.

Judging by everyone's replies - I should keep pursuing. He knows he's in the wrong, why else would he negotiate..

I should add that a man living & working on the land said he was very cold and it was damp in his flat too. But his english is very poor and I highly doubt that he would be in a position to notify authorities.

The landlords attitude really makes you feel that you are in the wrong - so I would imagine any issues this man had were promptly dismissed and ignored.

Danger HighVoltage

punisher5112 wrote: »

Place was so bad if left for 2 weeks without washing down walls etc. Mould and even mushroom type growths occurred.

Place was damp clothes destroyed including documents passports etc.

Was an absolute dump but when 1st viewed had just been painted so didn't seem to bad.

Heating on near 24 hours a day. All windows opened daily no clothes dried inside and walls were as black as the road.

Sounds all too familiar - sorry you had to go through that.
Glad it worked out for you in the end. I'm still trying to get rid of the damp and smoke smell out of my clothes and belongings. It ends up costing a fortune when put in this type of situation. The authorities were quite good to you? Did you go through the ptrb?

punisher5112

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

Sounds all too familiar - sorry you had to go through that.
Glad it worked out for you in the end. I'm still trying to get rid of the damp and smoke smell out of my clothes and belongings. It ends up costing a fortune when put in this type of situation. The authorities were quite good to you? Did you go through the ptrb?

Prtb at the time yes which are now are RTB but enviro health were extremely good to have as a record also.

Funny thing was these LL were big time millionaire types as it was on a private estate where years previous land was sold for over€40 million and all there property was bellow standard and had been brought to environmental healths attention many times before.

The judgement was good and I was happy to be out to be honedt.
6 months for meeting and money was transferred within 2 weeks.

Marcusm

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

I should add that a man living & working on the land said he was very cold and it was damp in his flat too. But his english is very poor and I highly doubt that he would be in a position to notify authorities.

The landlords attitude really makes you feel that you are in the wrong - so I would imagine any issues this man had were promptly dismissed and ignored.

Have a look here at minimum standards rules and highlight those which apply. Write down a summary of the deficiencies before the mediation. Absolutely at this stage I would proceed with it. He is exposed to a fine as well as return of your deposit.

foggy_lad

Danger HighVoltage wrote: »

Problem is, there is no Irish law about carbon monoxide that I can find. He is also an ex-solicitor so I think he knows his way around the law.
The flat was definitely not safe to live in though.

On the other side - why would he offer a negotiation if he thinks he's in the right!

You should contact the local council and ask them to have the premises examined with a view to having it condemned for habitation. A place I lived in previously was condemned after I moved out as the council had their environmental health officer check it out and he was appalled at the condition of the building.

punisher5112

foggy_lad wrote: »

You should contact the local council and ask them to have the premises examined with a view to having it condemned for habitation. A place I lived in previously was condemned after I moved out as the council had their environmental health officer check it out and he was appalled at the condition of the building.

Not possible the op is gone from it.

Ginger83

Full deposit and a months rent is what you should be asking for to meet in the middle at your full deposit. I'd mention you may seek compensation for clothes destroyed due to damp and lightly query whether he's registered with prtb.
You should get resolution very quickly.

...__...

Plus one on the above post
I went through similar situation 2 years ago.

The house is not fir for habitation.
Go to the rtb and make sure you list everything you have done the fire blankets and alarms etc.
If you have receipts bring them too. also you will need to look at your personal stuff to see if anything needs to be replaced. take lots of photos etc.
Most importantly go through with the hearing they have seen a lot of this stuff before so they know who to believe.

TheChizler

punisher5112 wrote: »

Not possible the op is gone from it.

The local authority have powers to compel landlords to facilitate inspections and renovations. If it's still a rental property they have the power.

AlanG

If what you are saying about the stove, keys and carbon monoxide alarm are true then there is no risk of you not getting your deposit back. You will probably get the 2 weeks rent also. Be sure you mention to him that you will be on to the Revenue Commissioners regarding the matter as well as is your right.

Pkiernan

OP - I think that you have a duty to report this dirt bag to the RTB and to Revenue.
Otherwise he'll just do this to the next tenant

Danger HighVoltage

Update to the situation if anyone is interested.
Went through telephone mediation with RTB, mediator was fair and quite understanding. The landlord went from half deposit to half deposit+100 euro, my partner and I decided we wanted to get finished with the situation and accepted.
Of course, we weren't completely happy - but finishing dealing with this horrible man was satisfactory enough.

Our next step is to try to stop anyone else from having to deal with this dangerous property - we're currently trying to decide who to call and how much detail to give.

Thanks to all of you for your advice!