Are Luas Fine Appeals Ever Successful?

SimonTemplar

I've been browsing this forum and there are a number of threads were people's Luas fine appeal has been declined. This sometimes is the case were the invalid ticket is due to a glitch in the Leap system and not the passenger's fault who genuinely wasn't trying to dodge the fare.

I'm curious if anyone had a successful appeal or is the appeals process basically just a pretence.

From a revenue stream viewpoint, why would an appeal be granted if the passenger didn't have a valid ticket and Transdev can get €45 from them even if it was a genuine mistake.

Tow

I have received 3 lots of fine letters to my home over the years, addressed to whom I assume is the former occupiers son. Not once has anyone come to the door looking for money. From what I can see, if someone does not engage with them nothing happens. I have even seen this a number of times on the Luas, the ticket inspectors will not ask people who look like skangers for their ticket, just skip by them. When they do try to issue a fine, I have seen people refuse to give them details and walk off the tram at the next stop shouting abuse at the inspectors. Nothing happens to them. This is a far cry from how the likes of the Paris Metro is policed, there is no messing around them them, but at the same time they are more pleasant to deal with!

XPS_Zero

I'd say it is v v v rate but I won an appeal once but only after I basically said "go ahead take me to court I know I'll win"

I stupidly thought the online top ups took effect right away when you next tag your card not the pi)s taking 48 hours defeating the entire point of it
I topped up, went to the station and tagged...tagged....tagged....nothing

I tried at least 12 times, nothing. Frustrated and annoyed thinking this is absurd I've just paid for a journey and can't make it, I'm getting on anyway. I got on. I looked out the window it went from 6m to 2 and I said maybe I shouldn't...I'll try it once more then decide. I got off and tried a few more times. Inspectors come from the office (we were at Sandyford) one says I saw you get off the tram you don't have a ticket

Explained didn't believe me

I appealed the fine, they gave me some excuses why it takes 48 hours which was missing my argument completely
I wrote back a second time saying "you don't understannd:

First, I didn't take a tram journey without a ticket I merely boarded a tram then changed my mind before it left. Your cctv will show this go look

Second, there was no intent to evade the fare (I'd tried to buy a fare and tag it in good faith) and without criminal intent there is legally no crime, unless one was reckless or irresponsible ergo it was my responsibility to ensure ticket was valid...we'll as to that....

Third, I repeatedly tried to validate the card hence no recklessness

Yes one could argue I should have paid attention to the small print re 48 hours and you could argue reckless attitude there, but the preponderance of circumstances and evidence (inc my leap card history which they had as they took the card and which showed repeated regular paid journeys and regular top ups) shows I was going out of my way NOT to fare evade even technically, so I'm quite happy to argue that in court (it wasn't a bluff I was), do you wanna waste money on lawyers proectutjng a case you'll probably loose against a passenger who TRIED REPEATEDLY TO PAY THE DAMN FARE?

I made mention that of course I'd take more care in future but given the overall circumstances a fine was absurd and I wasn't paying it.

They let it go and shocked by their common sense (I been poisoned by dealing with CIE it's made me a cynic...) I sent them a nice thank you letter saying it was quite refreshing to see people not respond like robots in these situations for a change

XPS_Zero

Tow wrote: »

I have received 3 lots of fine letters to my home over the years, addressed to whom I assume is the former occupiers son. Not once has anyone come to the door looking for money. From what I can see, if someone does not engage with them nothing happens. I have even seen this a number of times on the Luas, the ticket inspectors will not ask people who look like skangers for their ticket, just skip by them. When they do try to issue a fine, I have seen people refuse to give them details and walk off the tram at the next stop shouting abuse at the inspectors. Nothing happens to them. This is a far cry from how the likes of the Paris Metro is policed, there is no messing around them them, but at the same time they are more pleasant to deal with!

In London if you say f u I'm not telling you the transit police just arrest you!