Advice needed on weather conditions

Whyner

Howdy,

How do you determine whether or not you should go for a climb or stay lower down? I did Sally Gap last weekend and loved it. Planning on doing Rathfarnham > Sally Gap > Laragh and back via Enniskerry tomorrow morning.

Weather has the gap at 0° (real feel -5) @ 8am rising to 4° at 12pm.

Ideally I'd like to get the tougher climb out of the way first but I'm thinking it would be wiser to return via the gap as it will have warmed up a bit with less risk of frost.

stecleary

Whyner wrote: »

Howdy,

How do you determine whether or not you should go for a climb or stay lower down? .

when you come back down from the climb ask yourself was it too cold.

fat bloke

Last weekend was a spectacular one for the Dublin and Wicklow mountains but you will have to embrace the lower lands as we get into the winter proper. Certainly for the early mornings. Though the inland low lying backroads can be very frost prone too.

Kinda need to follow your nose really. And don't be afraid to turn around if you think the way ahead might be dodgy.

crosstownk

Maybe I'm a bit chicken when it comes to low temperatures. I don't fancy sweating up a hill only to freeze into a shivering mess on the way down.

I'm also terrified of ice. Really terrified. The sun can come up after a <0C night but the roads can still be icey - especially in sections shaded by trees.

My philosophy is to stay low if the temperature is low - he who fights and runs away lives to fight another day.

I'm sure there are plenty of double hard basterds who will disagree with my chicken aproach.....

magicbastarder

the last couple of weeks also had me avoiding a couple of roads because i knew they were covered in leaves - though that issue seems to be less problematic now (at least on the roads i was aware of).

ted1

If there's a glaze in the road on the way up , or rain the night before and it's below 8deg setting out

stecleary

crosstownk wrote: »

Maybe I'm a bit chicken when it comes to low temperatures. I don't fancy sweating up a hill only to freeze into a shivering mess on the way down.

Seriously there's very few places in ireland you will get that cold on a decent. good layers and keep the legs spinning on the way down and its grand.

Wishbone Ash

If temperatures are very low, I tend to be more concerned about whether it had recently rained. Low temps with dry roads are generally fine. I've come through the Gap many times where my Garmin was reading below zero but the surface was bone dry.

There's less shelter at higher altitudes so less chance of black ice. Any time I've spilled on black ice, it was almost at seal level and near the coast.

Wishbone Ash

While we're on the subject a couple of Boardsies (and fellow club members) featured on the pic of this article from Sticky Bottle about winter riding.

http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/training-this-weekend-ireland-is-about-to-turn-very-cold/

godtabh

They key for me is layers in areas exposed to wind.

When I first started riding in the winter feet would go purple with the cold. Makes it hard to motivate yourself to go out.

I have decent socks and over shoes for wet/windy/cold days. Decent neoprene gloves for wet/windy/cold days. A good winter all round jacket with plenty of layers.

Makes it bearable.

Beasty

I used to go out whatever the temperature unless there was obviously ice about. Was caught out one evening when temperatures plummeted and I came off on black ice breaking a wrist

Nowadays I think it's simply not worth it. Even today it was supposed to be dry but the road was wet in places and there was some standing water. Temperatures were not low enough today to put me off but if they had been hovering a degree or two above freezing I would not have risked it.

philstar

winter time is time to retire the road bike and get out the mountain bike

morana

yeah you are right its not worth it. Also, fog i would never go out in it always felt the chance of getting sick breathing all of it in and being so cold it was too much risk. the visibility is also an issue

dahat

Galibier Minstral will be out tomorrow morning though I'm hesitant to go with just the Merino Wool base layer with it.

Surely I'll need another layer with it?

wanderer 22

dahat wrote: »

Galibier Minstral will be out tomorrow morning though I'm hesitant to go with just the Merino Wool base layer with it.

Surely I'll need another layer with it?

Spooky, exactly the same question I just asked myself :eek::eek:

dahat

colm18 wrote: »

Spooky, exactly the same question I just asked myself :eek::eek:

Galibier say 4 to 14 degrees just a base layer but I'll more than likely put a sleeveless Aldi base layer on as well.

Lumen

NCD always seems bad in winter judging by the crash reports, although that may be mostly Beasty. :pac:

Coastal group spins can be total crashfests. Get ye inland.

I haven't had any issues with my D15-city centre commute in all weathers over the past few years. The last couple of winters I used regular 23mm tyres even on snow and "ice" (probably just frost).

I'm a hill troll now so this winter will be interesting, although the locals don't seem to make a big deal of it. Maybe the gritting is better.

Unknown Soldier

dahat wrote: »

Galibier Minstral will be out tomorrow morning though I'm hesitant to go with just the Merino Wool base layer with it.

Surely I'll need another layer with it?

colm18 wrote: »

Spooky, exactly the same question I just asked myself :eek::eek:

Just an Aldi/Lidl long sleeve cycling/running semi-compression? base layer required. When it's proper cold (minus degrees) I use one of the thicker motorcycling base layers.

After about 3km you'll be toasty.

Wishbone Ash

Unknown Soldier wrote: »

...When it's proper cold (minus degrees) I use one of the thicker motorcycling base layers...

I use these myself. Waiting on them to come in again as the ones I have are gone quite ragged.

I haven't seen motorcycle gear in Lidl/Aldi for a while now or perhpas I've just missed them.

Beasty

Lumen wrote: »

Coastal group spins can be total crashfests. Get ye inland.

Although ice tends to form easier inland, where there's often more shelter and a bit more altitude

dahat

Unknown Soldier wrote: »

Just an Aldi/Lidl long sleeve cycling/running semi-compression? base layer required. When it's proper cold (minus degrees) I use one of the thicker motorcycling base layers.

After about 3km you'll be toasty.

Minstral plus Galibier Merino Wool with a cheapo sleeveless top from Aldi n I was spot on today even with the stiff NW breeze from mid morning on.

Lumen

Beasty wrote: »

Although ice tends to form easier inland, where there's often more shelter and a bit more altitude

Maybe the crashes are caused by overconfidence in that idea, e.g. "it's icy inland, let's head to the coast".

smacl

Lumen wrote: »

I haven't had any issues with my D15-city centre commute in all weathers over the past few years. The last couple of winters I used regular 23mm tyres even on snow and "ice" (probably just frost).

I'm a hill troll now so this winter will be interesting, although the locals don't seem to make a big deal of it. Maybe the gritting is better.

I currently stick the studs on the CX bike once the weather goes to regular freezing overnight and suck up the extra weight and loss of performance in exchange for piece of mind. Next investment is a spare set of winter wheels which the studs live on so I can decide which I want on the day, as the studded tyres are a bugger to change.

Annie get your Run

Just an Aldi/Lidl long sleeve cycling/running semi-compression? base layer required. When it's proper cold (minus degrees) I use one of the thicker motorcycling base layers.

After about 3km you'll be toasty.

I had two jackets on this morning and a base layer and you guys probably still don't think it's that cold Two pairs of gloves and a fleece ski neck thing I bought in Lidl last week. The first few miles of my commute are dead flat so it takes more than 3k before I'm anyway warm.

Anyway, I came in to see what advice there is on ice. I noticed my car windscreen had ice on it but the paths and roads seemed dry. I guess roundabouts are the most treacherous areas? And slow down I guess?

Lumen

Annie get your Run wrote: »

Anyway, I came in to see what advice there is on ice. I noticed my car windscreen had ice on it but the paths and roads seemed dry. I guess roundabouts are the most treacherous areas? And slow down I guess?

You need to go steady on roundabouts but they're generally predictable because they're unshaded.

Cloud cover keeps the heat in, so clear conditions are usually colder but then there's no water to freeze (other than dew) and you have sunshine to melt the frost/ice.

It's the shaded tarmac with water draining over it that you have to watch our for because that's where the ice forms, e.g. under trees.

Obviously on sheet ice you will fall off even in a straight line, but that's rare enough. Mostly you can stay upright by steering smoothly, pedalling smoothly and at a high cadence, as that reduces jerky forces on the tyres.

Right hand bends usually have less grip due to the camber but if you at least if you come off you'll end up in the ditch rather than in oncoming traffic. So take it handy on left hand bends.

If in doubt use the back brakes to test out available grip, in a straight line. Skids are fun, in a straight line.

Don't brake and steer at the same time. Brake then steer.

Macy0161

Lumen wrote: »

I'm a hill troll now so this winter will be interesting, although the locals don't seem to make a big deal of it. Maybe the gritting is better.

In my experience, they're definitely much better at gritting now than they used to be on the likes of the R755. Doubt that extends to the Sally Gap/ Military Road.

However, days like over the weekend with the significant wind chill, a mechanical could get you in trouble if you had to stop, so it's not just ice/ crashes that people should come into consideration in my view.

I was out helping with the juniors of our club yesterday (at sea level), and the same gear that had me warm on my own spin over the weekend, really didn't cut it at the lower intensity, never mind had I been stopped.

Lumen

Macy0161 wrote: »

In my experience, they're definitely much better at gritting now than they used to be on the likes of the R755. Doubt that extends to the Sally Gap/ Military Road.

That's OK, I won't be commuting via the Sally Gap. :pac:

What's the road from Kilmac to Enniskerry (via poggio) like in the morning during deep winter? I'm hoping Enniskerry to Dundrum will be fine. I suppose I could always do the N11 to the Enniskerry turn off but I hate that road up to Enniskerry.

Out of my house is 10% down or 10% up. Winter is going to be interesting.

cython

Lumen wrote: »

You need to go steady on roundabouts but they're generally predictable because they're unshaded.
....

One notable exception to this in my (unfortunate) experience is the roundabout closest to Parkgate Street in the Phoenix Park on Chesterfield Avenue. I came off on ice there either late last year, or earlier this year, having seen none the rest of the way in, and indeed no more after it. I made the mistake of taking my usual line, which if you've taken the lane crosses from the left tyre track to the right and back, and in the centre there was a nasty patch of ice that took my front wheel. Might have been better had I stayed in one of the tyre trails.

Plastik

Lumen wrote: »

That's OK, I won't be commuting via the Sally Gap. :pac:

What's the road from Kilmac to Enniskerry (via poggio) like in the morning during deep winter? I'm hoping Enniskerry to Dundrum will be fine. I suppose I could always do the N11 to the Enniskerry turn off but I hate that road up to Enniskerry.

Out of my house is 10% down or 10% up. Winter is going to be interesting.

You have moved south of the border? I tend to use the most direct route into town everyday in winter - Shankill, Loughlinstown r'about, N11 and have yet to be iced off. I don't think I would fancy the poggio route on the bad days personally, but I've no idea what it would actually be like. An alternative could be to follow the Lower Dargle Rd into Bray and then turn left up Old Connaught Ave to Ferndale Rd, or go up to Shanganagh Park and turn left onto Ballybride Rd. Both will take you over to Ballycorus Rd and up to Kilternan.

http://www.wicklow.ie/sites/default/files/2015,2016%20Road%20Gritting%20Programme.pdf

Annie get your Run

One notable exception to this in my (unfortunate) experience is the roundabout closest to Parkgate Street in the Phoenix Park on Chesterfield Avenue. I came off on ice there either late last year, or earlier this year, having seen none the rest of the way in, and indeed no more after it. I made the mistake of taking my usual line, which if you've taken the lane crosses from the left tyre track to the right and back, and in the centre there was a nasty patch of ice that took my front wheel. Might have been better had I stayed in one of the tyre trails.

I hate that roundabout, cars expect you to be in the 'cycle lane' but it's quite hard to swing that far left. I'll pay extra attention especially to tyre tracks.

Wishbone Ash

Lumen wrote: »

....Left hand bends usually have more grip due to the camber but at least if you come off you'll end up in the ditch rather than in oncoming traffic. So take it really handy on right hand bends....

It would be the other way around in my experience. Coming off on a left-hander, forward momentum will generally result in a slide across the road onto the opposite lane/ditch.

Lumen

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

It would be the other way around in my experience. Coming off on a left-hander, forward momentum will generally result in a slide across the road onto the opposite lane/ditch.

Yeah, sorry. Fixed my OP.

Macy0161

Lumen wrote: »

What's the road from Kilmac to Enniskerry (via poggio) like in the morning during deep winter? I'm hoping Enniskerry to Dundrum will be fine. I suppose I could always do the N11 to the Enniskerry turn off but I hate that road up to Enniskerry.

Don't recall doing it in sub zero on bike or in car to be honest. Would the gritting truck get over/ be allowed over the bridge even?

I'd say the 21 bends would be treated though.