Operation consent

Seanachai

This is just a hypothetical question, I'm not asking for medical advice mods. If somebody implicitly says that they don't want a medical procedure carried out and it is not warranted by a life-threatening condition but the surgeon ignored the patients request, is this illegal?

ED E

What did the patient sign?

Pat Mustard

Seanachai wrote: »

This is just a hypothetical question, I'm not asking for medical advice mods. If somebody implicitly says that they don't want a medical procedure carried out and it is not warranted by a life-threatening condition but the surgeon ignored the patients request, is this illegal?

I'm not sure that I follow.

Do you mean that the patient explicitly asked for a procedure not to be carried out but a surgeon carried it out, against their wishes?

Or do you mean that the procedure was carried because the surgeon made a mistake and thought that the patient had consented?

Is there a signed consent form in all of this?

seamus

Specifically illegal would depend on whether the surgeon was completely aware of the facts and proceeded anyway.

Ultimately it would fall under the competency of the medical council.

I imagine if the medical council ruled against the doctor and found the act was wilful, then further charges of assault or something may be possible.

You can't really "implicitly" say something, that's an oxymoron. I guess if you were thinking along the lines of a patient expressing a preference for something to *not* be done during an operation, but the surgeon going ahead and doing it that way anyway, that's pretty deep in the bowels of professional conduct.

But is probably covered to a certain extent by the surgeon legally having enough freedom to do the job that's required of them at the time without needing to conform to a bulleted list of do's and dont's and having to wake the patient for their consent if it deviates from that. If the procedure carried out deviates massively from the expected end result, there's probably an issue. But if it's a case that they used a specific kind of suture, or gave you an anaesthetic that you said you preferred not to receive, there's probably no illegality within that.

Grolschevik

Pat Mustard wrote: »

I'm not sure that I follow.

Do you mean that the patient explicitly asked for a procedure not to be carried out but a surgeon carried it out, against their wishes?

Or do you mean that the procedure was carried because the surgeon made a mistake and thought that the patient had consented?

Is there a signed consent form in all of this?

I took it as something like ambiguous refusal of consent, like:

"That's what a prostate exam involves?! I don't fancy that!"

Shortly thereafter: "Hey what you... ooooooh!"

Peregrinus

Surgeons are not mind-readers. I think the answer to this question is going to depend entirely on what the OP means by "implicitly said". You'd need to know exactly what the patient said, and to whom, and what the patient did, before you could make any kind of useful judgment about whether the surgeon knew or ought to have known that the patient did not consent to the procedure.

I hate to say it, but putting the enquiry in terms that the patient "implicitly" withheld consent looks awfully like an attempt to get the answer you want, without disclosing details that might impede that. If you want an answer that's any use, or in any way reliable, you need to be upfront with all the awkward, embarrassing or inconvenient facts and details.

Seanachai

Grolschevik wrote: »

I took it as something like ambiguous refusal of consent, like:

"That's what a prostate exam involves?! I don't fancy that!"

Shortly thereafter: "Hey what you... ooooooh!"

It's not that one lol, although I did get a rude awakening when I learned what an std 'swab' actually involves, such an innocuous word . My question relates to a procedure that I may need to have done, depending on the results of a scan.

It's a gallbladder op basically, relatives have had the same issue and the surgeon has removed the organ when it is not necessary, the condition can be alleviated by just removing the stones. If I need surgery I want to make it clear that if removal is not absolutely necessary, I don't want it done.

Pat Mustard

Moderator:

This relates to consent for an upcoming procedure. It is not a hypothetical scenario.

This sort of issue can be fraught with difficulty if not carried out correctly. It is not appropriate to ask for or offer advice in relation to consent for upcoming medical procedures on this forum.

Thread closed.