KBC Privilege Portfolio 95

sporina

Has anyone any thoughts on the KBC Privilege Portfolio 95 for investment?

topper_harley2

Factsheet link? What's the TER of the fund?

sporina

https://www.kbc.be/PBL/CC028?isincode=BE0946344125&target=~/fundfinderie

topper_harley2 wrote: »

Factsheet link? What's the TER of the fund?

oh sorry here you go

BrokenArrows

sporina wrote: »

https://www.kbc.be/PBL/CC028?isincode=BE0946344125&target=~/fundfinderie

oh sorry here you go

Jesus, they're not exactly holding back on the fees.

topper_harley2

Subscription fee 3.5%
AMC 1.09%
Ongoing charge 1.49%

WTF?! Do not invest in this fund.

syntheticjunk

On 10000 investment since 2007 they returned 400 euros......

alb

syntheticjunk wrote: »

On 10000 investment since 2007 they returned 400 euros......

That's hilarious

sporina

topper_harley2 wrote: »

Subscription fee 3.5%
AMC 1.09%
Ongoing charge 1.49%

WTF?! Do not invest in this fund.

what is the difference between the above two highlighted?

topper_harley2

sporina wrote: »

what is the difference between the above two highlighted?

A Fund Subscription Fee is a one-time charge the investor pays upon subscription to the fund.
AMC is a yearly charge (hence "annual"). If this is over 1% then you're losing a large chunk of any profit to charges.

lcwill

topper_harley2 wrote: »

Subscription fee 3.5%
AMC 1.09%
Ongoing charge 1.49%

WTF?! Do not invest in this fund.

Should be illegal to offer funds with those kind of fees to the general public

sporina

lcwill wrote: »

Should be illegal to offer funds with those kind of fees to the general public

actually bank told me that the 3.5% fee does not apply to Ireland

Okon

Even so, it's still not a very attractive fund to invest in. I'd put my money elsewhere.

Nody

Honestly it's never gone past 6% return in a year; at that rate you might as well buy a cheap European index fund and call it a day esp. as it's a fund in a fund concept (which is a way for the bank to charge you fees twice; first from the fund you buy into and then a second time when your fund buys shares in other funds the bank owns charging you full management fee for both when the first one should be fee free). When looking at a fund the key rules are:

1) No funds owning funds (this costs way more money by doubling up all fund fees but the second set of fees are hidden from you and don't show up as a "fund fee" but simply in poor performance over time; in the above example your actual fee would most likely be around 4 to 5% yearly in fees!!!)
2) Below 1% fee, I'd say below 0.5% but there are certain exceptions worth considering for small cap etc.
3) Ignore the historical profits esp. against what ever they compare to (they intentionally pick a index that's favorable rather than a proper index in many cases) and ask if you think the direction is right (past history is not proof of future history)
4) Do not trust anyone who benefits from you buying the service (be it a bank, salesman etc.) but get independent advice

sporina

Nody wrote: »

Honestly it's never gone past 6% return in a year; at that rate you might as well buy a cheap European index fund and call it a day esp. as it's a fund in a fund concept (which is a way for the bank to charge you fees twice; first from the fund you buy into and then a second time when your fund buys shares in other funds the bank owns charging you full management fee for both when the first one should be fee free). When looking at a fund the key rules are:

1) No funds owning funds (this costs way more money by doubling up all fund fees but the second set of fees are hidden from you and don't show up as a "fund fee" but simply in poor performance over time; in the above example your actual fee would most likely be around 4 to 5% yearly in fees!!!)
2) Below 1% fee, I'd say below 0.5% but there are certain exceptions worth considering for small cap etc.
3) Ignore the historical profits esp. against what ever they compare to (they intentionally pick a index that's favorable rather than a proper index in many cases) and ask if you think the direction is right (past history is not proof of future history)
4) Do not trust anyone who benefits from you buying the service (be it a bank, salesman etc.) but get independent advice

thanks for all of that - but its where to get independent advice - thats the question??

Okon

sporina wrote: »

thanks for all of that - but its where to get independent advice - thats the question??

You've had plenty of it here?!

Incidentally, can I ask why you are so attracted to this fund as opposed to something else?

sporina

Okon wrote: »

You've had plenty of it here?!

Incidentally, can I ask why you are so attracted to this fund as opposed to something else?

I don't know of an alternative.. I would love to find someone who knowledge about savings / investments who could sit down with me and advise me on a good option..
I can't think of anyone who could give me independent unbiased advice

Nody

sporina wrote: »

I don't know of an alternative.. I would love to find someone who knowledge about savings / investments who could sit down with me and advise me on a good option..
I can't think of anyone who could give me independent unbiased advice

An independent financial advisor (i.e. not tied to any bank) is your best bet; look at how they suggest you split your money and then go to Degiro.ie and buy the equivalent Vanguard ETF (that's a stock traded fund which has zero fees with DeGiro).

What you need to think of before going to anyone though are:

1) How much are you investing and will it be ongoing?
2) For how long are you willing to lock your money away or how long until you're going to need them (minimum 5 years would be recommended for funds/shares)?
3) What level of risk are you willing to take over time? Higher risk higher reward and if you say no risk then it's the bank account only that's applicable.
4) Could you handle to see your funds drop 40% in value over a year without panicking?

Honestly investing in shares is not complicated at all but most people think you need to have wallstreet level of knowledge and five PHDs for doing so. For most people however it's simply a question of finding a set of suitable funds to match with the risk profile and you're not to far off the mark (you're not going to make 500% in a year but you'll accrue value on an ongoing and good basis with limited risk).

topper_harley2

sporina wrote: »

I don't know of an alternative.. I would love to find someone who knowledge about savings / investments who could sit down with me and advise me on a good option..
I can't think of anyone who could give me independent unbiased advice

Alternative to what? What are you trying to do? How did you even find about about that fund?! We can give advice if you provided some information about what you are trying to achieve.

You dont give any information about why you want to save or build an investment portfolio, what you are trying to achieve, what are your other financial priorities/circumstances etc. Hence its hard to recommend anything specific.

ANY independent financial advisor will ask you the following:

• What age are you
• What existing savings have you
• Do you want to save or invest (and do you know the difference?)
• Have you any high interest debts like car loan/credit card etc
• Have you an SVR mortgage
• Have you a rainy day fund of 3-6 months salary
• Have you a pension
• Have you kids
• Are you married
• Have you any investment property
• What exactly constitutes success for any investment portfolio
• How long are you happy to be without this money
• What would you do if value dropped 30% overnight
• What is your tax rate
• Are you taxed in Ireland
• Have you a lump sum or will you be contributing regularly, by month

Unless you answer all of those, you can't expect any useful advice. Most people when asked why they want to invest generally say "I want to get better return than in normal bank account"......that is not a goal, that's a vague pipe dream that you cannot quantify.

Sonnenblumen

topper_harley2 wrote: »

Alternative to what? What are you trying to do? How did you even find about about that fund?! We can give advice if you provided some information about what you are trying to achieve.

You dont give any information about why you want to save or build an investment portfolio, what you are trying to achieve, what are your other financial priorities/circumstances etc. Hence its hard to recommend anything specific.

ANY independent financial advisor will ask you the following:

• What age are you
• What existing savings have you
• Do you want to save or invest (and do you know the difference?)
• Have you any high interest debts like car loan/credit card etc
• Have you an SVR mortgage
• Have you a rainy day fund of 3-6 months salary
• Have you a pension
• Have you kids
• Are you married
• Have you any investment property
• What exactly constitutes success for any investment portfolio
• How long are you happy to be without this money
• What would you do if value dropped 30% overnight
• What is your tax rate
• Are you taxed in Ireland
• Have you a lump sum or will you be contributing regularly, by month

Unless you answer all of those, you can't expect any useful advice. Most people when asked why they want to invest generally say "I want to get better return than in normal bank account"......that is not a goal, that's a vague pipe dream that you cannot quantify.

On second thoughts, show me where's the nearest exit?

irish_investr

Hi,
One attraction of this fund is the 95% floor. This is completely bogus, though. It might have some merit if the fund was 100% invested in equities but this fund is: "The target allocation is 30% shares and/or share-related investments and 70% bonds and/or bond-related investments.".
Stock markets would need to fall by close to 20% before this floor "guarantee" has any practical value. --irishinvestor.ie