Problems With Housemate

Motley Crue

First time posting here, so please bare with me, this is something I'm trying to deal with at the moment and I've never been the confrontational type and always had a good relationship with the gentlemen in question so it's a difficult thing to now have to face. But I believe action is needed.

I'm living in a house share. There were six of us but we've had some contracts end. We're hoping to get new people in ASAP (that's a different story) but at the moment there is just three of us. I've been here four years, another housemate three and the final housemate has been here maybe (at a guess, because I'm not sure) seven years. When I moved in there was the 'final' housemate here. Let's call him Steven. So Steven and I haven't had much of a relationship, he keeps to himself and seems to only spend a few days a month at the property. His parents live locally and he seems to return to his childhood home more than he lives here. Not sure why he keeps paying rent on this property and living here but that's his business. As I say, he keeps to himself and we hardly see him.

We've had issues with bills from Steven for years. He made an agreement, with my consent originally, to put only half his expected (expected being what the rest of the housemates who are full time habitually resident in the property would pay) Electricity money in the pot every month.We did this because he was only here a fraction of the time and as a gesture of goodwill. But, on occasions such as this, when housemates move out and the property numbers decrease we do expect - at least in the short term - that he will put on the full allowance regardless. But he doesn't play ball.

Recently, he's begun seeing someone, and he's brought her to the house about two weeks ago. She's been here ever since, and so has he, and there has been no discussion on how long she is staying or what the plan of action is - whether she's looking for work or lives here now or what? Her attitude is very abrasive and I suspect that he has told her stories about me and the other housemate, but I'm too old for that, I feel if she lives in the house, even as a guest, she should be respectful of the house and abide by the general good practice. What I mean by that is Steven should put his full electricity on, if not for himself and the empty rooms, but at least because he has a guest here and they're using added electricity and what not. Again, I've tried to discuss this with him, it's fallen on deaf ears.

Last week I saw her let herself out of the house independently of him. I didn't like this because he didn't appear to be in the house after she left so it meant that, not only was she here alone, but he had given her keys to let herself out. Because he moved rooms recently and a previous tenant dropped off an old set of keys I suspect he has two sets of door keys - I also suspect that he's given her one set. In one sense I have no problem with this, but she doesn't live here and he hasn't mentioned a word of this to us. Even just to tell us we might see her coming and going independently without him. Not a major issue but it's a lack of respect. Plus she doesn't pay rent here, so that means she's not entitled to front door keys full stop, if it was just more than an isolated incident.

Then there's a problem with the water bill. For the financial year we divided the bill in sixths and each took a share. Steven's share remains outstanding. As the bill is in my name and not the landlords (another problem) I am legally responsible. Despite reminders, and despite Steven assuring me he knows its due and will pay it, the balance remains unpaid. His attitude to any bills in general seems to be that we're forcing him to pay bills unfairly or unjustly yet we are just asking him to pay what he owes, and certainly what anyone else in the house will/would/has paid.

So, I've gone to the landlord's agent (as I don't have direct contact with the landlord) and informed her of the situation. But beyond calling him herself and sending a "text message" to remind him of the bill, there's little she can do apparently...and it seems like me running to another to sort my problems. Even if the issue is his problem. I've tried talking to him about it, being direct and not aggressive, yet nothing seems to work. It seems to go in one ear and out the other. Any help? Any hints and tips? Should I approach him about the girlfriend? When has she overstayed her welcome?

4ensic15

Is the rent joint and several? He should be told to cop on or leave. Tell the agent the locks will be changed. He will not be let back in or his girlfriend. then if nothing happens, change the locks. Get new housemates.

Baby01032012

Tenant has no rights to change locks. And the bills are no concern of the landlord/agent. House is let as a whole, I presume bills have been taken out by one or more tenants. So it's the tenants responsibility to pay the bills and to sit down with Stephen and clarify what the situation is with the girlfriend staying or not and bills and come to some agreement.

Baby01032012

Just curious as to why having the bill in your name rather than landlords is another problem. It's a utility so is tenants problem. You may not like it in your name but it needs to be in one or more of your names.

Nomis21

I have lived in many houseshares in London and Dublin.

First you say 'we do expect' him to increase his share of the bills. You can't expect anything when it comes to housemates and money. You needed to have agreements in place from the start. He chose to stay elsewhere most of the week doesn't mean you should have allowed a reduction in the bills if he still had the right to stay there all week.

The girlfriend issue is very common. She needs to pay a share of the rent if you allow couples at all. (Most houseshares don't).

You need to get this guy to cop on. He is out of order,

Markcheese

Are you stressing a bit Unnecessarily??
Its a recent change, you dont see much of steven normally... I agree with you ,he should have spoken to ye about the new girlfriend staying ect.. and she shouldnt have a set of keys.. but sometimes things happen,(it could have been a one off,she might have his keys..)
When you get a chance have a chat with your house mate... dont do an "intervention" though....
The bills issue is a different thing..

syklops

Markcheese wrote: »

Are you stressing a bit Unnecessarily??
Its a recent change, you dont see much of steven normally... I agree with you ,he should have spoken to ye about the new girlfriend staying ect.. and she shouldnt have a set of keys.. but sometimes things happen,(it could have been a one off,she might have his keys..)
When you get a chance have a chat with your house mate... dont do an "intervention" though....
The bills issue is a different thing..

Im sure if there was no bills issue, the girlfriend thing wouldnt be an issue. Dude is rarely there and pays his bills on time, then you wouldnt mind him having herself over for a bit, but there is a bill issue, and now there is uncertainty over the girlfriend's length of stay and lack of contribution. Yes, two different issues, but its two more issues than any other tenants there at the moment.

BetsyEllen

I would send him an email highlighting all the issues and request a reply.
Have the other housemates included in the email also.

Give him a cut off date for the bills to be paid and make it very clear that payment will be due in full going forward as he is now in the house full time.

Request that the 2nd set of keys be left in the house in a safe place and advise they're not to be given to anyone else unless they are also paying rent.

Then say that if no response is received or the bills paid by the date given, you will be lodging a formal complaint with the agency and asking that the landlord be involved.

An email is best as you have a record of same then.

Finally, call your utility providers and request to have all housemates names added to the bills.

Pete Moss

Nomis21 wrote: »

I have lived in many houseshares in London and Dublin.

First you say 'we do expect' him to increase his share of the bills. You can't expect anything when it comes to housemates and money. You needed to have agreements in place from the start. He chose to stay elsewhere most of the week doesn't mean you should have allowed a reduction in the bills if he still had the right to stay there all week.

The girlfriend issue is very common. She needs to pay a share of the rent if you allow couples at all. (Most houseshares don't).

You need to get this guy to cop on. He is out of order,

Fully agree with the above. OP, you and your other housemates gave this guy an inch and he's now taking a mile, but that's hindsight.

From personal experience, I would fully recommend getting all utility bills (Water included) in everyone's name there ASAP, including any future housemates.

Shop40

If he has a new girlfriend, you can bet your last euro that he'll be living with you full time until that relationship ends, or until they get their own place. So you and the other housemate need to have a sit down talk with him. Tell him that he needs to pay an equal share of the bills and he must pay his share of the water charges (as this bill is in your name).
I myself do not like confrontation either, but it's the only way to solve these problems. He's the type that if he thinks he'll get away without paying his share, he will. Stand up to him, he's a user.

Tomw86

Power in numbers I agree with - firstly discuss the issues with the other housemates and find out a time that suits them for a meeting.

Then I'd send him an email outlining the issues (as agreed with other housemates) and saying that you propose a house meeting on a certain day (as agreed with others) and give him a timeframe of a couple of hours in the evening so he can let you know when suits him.

Then simply run through everything. If the girlfriend is staying there she needs to be contributing, end of.

If nothing changes then I would contact the agency/landlord and ask for him to be evicted or warned for breach of contract (girlfriend, not paying bills, giving a key our unlawfully).

Potatoeman

You need to make sure your housemates don't back down. If you do all the chasing you might be left to deal with this yourself.

Motley Crue

I'd like to thank you for your responses. And I'd also like to offer an update.
To clarify one thing about my first statement, when I say its a problem that my name is on bills for the household, I mean that I would rather they not be. It's a fact of life that they are and I accept that but I would like to think other tenants would have taken initiative and also willingly put things in their name. Everytime I mention about adding a name to a bill a fellow housemate gives me grief - yet they all should accept it as their duty to do so just as simply as I did when I moved here.
The water company called me and threatened me with legal action. Not being able to stall them anymore, and with the bill in my name, I was forced to pay Steven's share of this bill. I then left notice for Steven immediately (through the form of a discreet note as he never seems to be in his room) and went to bed that night. Before I went to bed I noticed that the electricity (which is on a PAYG meter) was close to running out completely and that Steven had not paid his electricity in full this month, whereas myself and the other tenant had paid.

The following day I saw Steven and his girlfriend leaving the property with suitcases in their hand. I attempted to speak to him but I was ignored and he walked out the door. There was no indication of where he was going and for how long. I noticed that the note I left had been taken (presumably read) and that he had left without topping up the electricity. Not knowing when he would return, I sent him a cordial email (he has refused for the past four years to offer me or anyone who has ever lived in the house his mobile phone number) and reminded him that I paid the water on his behalf and he now owes me the bill. I also reminded him of the electricity and the outstanding internet charges (which are approaching September's payment date at the end of the month) because I believed, since he hadn't told me otherwise, that he might not return for a few weeks. Based on previous behavior. I reminded him that when he has concerns and addresses them with me I attempt to be respectful and assist with his wishes, I would only ask for the same courtesy back.
I (with financial help from the other tenant) topped up the electricity myself (because without it we would be in darkness) and we got on with our day. Steven returned to the property alone last night at 00.20 - much later than it would have been acceptable to speak to him (I heard him come in and open his door from my bed). However, having left a note and sent an email I wanted to give him the right to reply anyway. There has been no response left (in the form of a note) or no response to my email given as of the time I write this.
To be honest, I'm not sure what more can be done. Had I not paid the water bill, I would have been prosecuted. Paying his bill for him has now left him without responsibility, but because he refused to put his name on the bill in the first place, its a responsibility hes never legally had. Likewise, there is no legal responsibility for him to pay electricity per month, but it is expected that all tenants put the same amount each month on the electric and this was agreed too in good faith. A faith now broken.
I am worried that aggravating the situation with the landlord's agent will only seek to allow him to play the victim, insist that the note and email are a form of bullying and that it will sour my relationship with the landlord's agent who will see me as causing trouble that could be done without. I haven't mentioned the fact before now, but Steven does suffer a disability of some kind, though I am unsure as to the specifics and the nature of the condition. I have been hesitant to take sterner action with him because I don't wish to be accused of "terrorizing a disabled man" in the worst case scenario, and I wouldn't put it past him to make such an accusation to take pressure off him and avoid paying the bills and taking responsibilities.
Any further advice would be appreciated.

Nomis21

Looks like he's gone forever.

You are dealing with a couple now plus all the stuff that goes with that and now it's two against one.

Why do you think that 95% of house shares on daft say "No Couples"?

All sounds like a typical housemate scenario to me, seen it many times.

You were too relaxed about it all in the beginning and learnt a lesson.

Find a new housemate and move on.

El_Duderino 09

Nomis21 wrote:

Looks like he's gone forever.

Has he taken all his stuff from his room?

If he has moved his GF in and has stopped paying the bills then it seems like it should he straightforward enough to tell the landlord that he has moved a stranger into the house without adding them to the lease.

Don't mind his disability. Handle it like a normal person

syklops

but I would like to think other tenants would have taken initiative and also willingly put things in their name.

Nope. Thats just a pipe dream. What I did way back when I was "lead housemate", was just take care of all the bills. My approach was estimate how much each persons contribution would be for each bill, add it together and ask they include it with their rent. So if the rent for the room is 300, and bills contribution is 60, ask they transfer 360 into my account(I had a seperate account for rent and bills). Its better to over estimate than under estimate. If you underestimate you end up paying the shortfall. If at the end of the year there is a plus figure of more than about 40 quid, divide it among your house mates. If its less than about 40 euro, buy a crate of beer or a few bottles of wine and have a party.

The beauty of this approach is your not chasing people for bills, it goes in with their rent. It makes things a lot easier.

FAILSAFE 00

If his name is not on the lease kick him out straight away. He has 0 rights. Make sure the others are there when you do as witnesses.

athtrasna

OP where are you based? The water bill thing makes it sound like you're not in Ireland. This is an Irish site and advice is given based on the legal situation in Ireland.

syklops

athtrasna wrote: »

OP where are you based? The water bill thing makes it sound like you're not in Ireland. This is an Irish site and advice is given based on the legal situation in Ireland.

OPs location is down as Newcastle upon Tyne.

mkhall

I have to agree and disagree with some of the other posters here. You need to address these issues individually.
1) Bills: You were too relaxed with bills with him at the beginning. Most houseshares I've lived in or encountered everything is split equally. Some people are in the house more than others but there's no way to fairly measure that--and it's not your problem. Why should you have to pay more because he is there less? He obviously thinks now that because he was there less it's a pay as you go situation with the water as well. You need to avoid this going forward.
2) The issue with his girlfriend--if she isn't in your way and you don't see her it's not an issue. If she's there when he's not, more than 5 nights a week, and using things to her own devices then play him at his own game. She's here, she's a tenant she needs to pay for what she's using, including rent now. Put things in simple terms for him. I also hate confrontation, especially in a houseshare as there's nothing worse than feeling uncomfortable in your own space. Ask him whether he thinks it's a pay as you use situation with the utilities? If he says yes, let him know you'll be charging his girlfriend. He will more than likely disagree to this, so you win here in that you now get to charge him equally with utilities. Tell him same goes with the key, if she has one..she pays as it implies she has full access to the property just as everyone else does.
3) In regards to his disability, I have to disagree with the other posters. If it's intellectual, it could be why he is reasoning things the way he is and it could be half your problem. You may need to change your approach. If it's physical, then this doesn't apply as he should be treated equally in any respect.