Probable needle in haystack

pinkypinky

Hi all

I normally frequent the genealogy board and have recently discovered a great-aunt of mine had a baby before marriage in 1937. I have the child's original birth cert but have not located a baptismal record. Born in Holles St, no father listed.

It seems most likely that she was adopted but I know it wouldn't have been a legal one in the modern sense.

Without knowing where or what nuns were involved, am I correct to presume there's almost no chance of finding her? She would have younger half-brothers, and I plan to tell them (being aware that they might already know) and wanted to have a definite answer on whether there's any way to look for her.

Thanks

Moonbeam

Would anyone else in the family have any info about it?

pinkypinky

No one is alive who would have been more than a baby at the time. I will ask the oldest people but am not at all hopeful.

kathy finn

Hi
Most likely the child was fostered/ boarded out and would have kept the orignal name. have you tried the church in westland row dublin, babies born in holles st were all baptised there.
also try look to see did they marry under the orignal name.

pinkypinky

I have tried Westland Row - it was my first thought, but no luck. I also tried the home parish. Priest there suggested a couple of other parishes but I may run into data protection issues. Also, I'm not sure what the baptism will tell me about where she went.

I have looked for a marriage/death for her under her original name but the online indexes only go to 1958 for marriage and 1965 for death. Hopefully will get a chance to go into Werburgh St soon to search after those dates, which are more realistic anyway.

kathy finn

Have you checked with AAI to see was an order of adoption made, when 1952 adoption act came in some families applied to adopt foster children so they could inherit.
I see it all the time in adoption books in GRO.

pinkypinky

No, this is all new to me. Can anyone contact AAI about this kind of thing or does it need to be next of kin?

pinkypinky

Update: I've now told the half-siblings. They did not know but would like to try trace her.

I've read the sibling trace guide but it seems a bit out of date (especially on the GRO section).

This is what I've done so far, and I'd welcome any further suggestions:

Contacted the AIRR project to see if she was taken into care or an industrial school.

Contacted the HSE trace service

Put the siblings on the national contact register

Is it worth trying lots of churches for her baptism? Is it likely that she would have been baptismed under a different name by the adoptive parents?

Will also see if the sibs want to put the DNA into the various databases as a back-up, if the above yields nothing.

I presume making an FOI request to the hospital will be useless. Her mother is dead but she might not be.

pinkypinky

Further update:

She was not listed on the AIRR project.
Túsla does not have any records either.
Siblings have been placed on the national contact register.
We are looking into DNA tests with all the major companies, but obviously there's a large cost factor here.

I would appreciate any further advice.

Did Holles St have a policy regarding babies in unmarried mothers' scenarios? Was there a particular religious organisation they favoured working with? Does Holles St have an archivist who could give non-specific advice?

kathy finn

Have you searched for a death for her as a baby or young child. Very odd that no records exist. I would also get one of the siblings to apply under FOI/DPA to Holles ST Hospital, Include a copy of the mothers Death Cert

pinkypinky

I have searched for both a death and marriage up to 1965/1958 under her birth names online with no results anywhere in Ireland.

I wasn't aware an FOI was possible, so I'll get on to Holles St about that.

Thanks!

kathy finn

She could have married after 1958, have you looked in books in GRO research room.

pinkypinky

I haven't prioritised getting into the GRO (work full time - difficult to get in there). She would have been young to marry before 1958!

If she was adopted/fostered, it's probable her name was changed.

kathy finn

Have you contacted AAI and asked was adoption order made for her, If fostered most likely she kept her name.
If adoption order was made after 1952 then you can search the adoption books in GRO by date of birth

pinkypinky

No, as mentioned earlier in thread, this is all new to me. Can anyone contact AAI or does it need to be next of kin?

kathy finn

Get one of the siblings to contact AAI and see was adoption order made in this persons name, You really need to find that out before you go any further

pinkypinky

I emailed the AAI to ask what information was required to request if an adoption order was made. I just had a spectacularly unhelpful reply saying:

"The Adoption Authority is legally restricted as to what information can be released and to whom. I
regret that the Adoption Authority is therefore not in a position to assist you further in this matter."

And they don't even explain why or how to progress the matter!

Hermy

Perhaps in light of current scandals they're being overcautious but they should have been able to provide more info from the point of view of a general enquiry.

I'd suggest a phone call and ask to speak to someone in tracing.
Obviously my situation was different as I was asking about myself but I found them generally quite helpful.

pinkypinky

I replied quite grumpily and asked if they could at least tell me why. They responded immediately and said that it needed to be next of kin. I was only trying to collect information so that the next of kin had to do as little as possible because they are not computer-literate, which I said in my initial response. They could have said this in the first reply instead of the useless one they sent.

Hermy

Yes, that does seem like poor form.

kathy finn

You need to get one of the siblings to make the call and provide copy of ID.
They will only deal with next of kin of the bmum