Girlfriend Applying for Loads of Jobs and Having No Luck

Chavways

Hi Guys,

My girlfriend graduated from UL with a high 2.1 degree last year qualified as a Biology, Chemistry and Ag Science Teacher. She didn't really want to go into teaching so she did a Masters in UCC in Molecular Cell Biology and Bio-Innovation and is due to graduate again with a high 2.1 or else a 1.1 depending on her thesis results. She's coming to the end of the masters now and she began the job hunt back in July.

Over 35 job applications later and she has only gotten 1 interview. She has been to multiple C.V clinics in UCC along with her lecturers and professors saying she has a great, well rounded C.V and also her mother who works as a Hiring Manager going through it to make sure it was up to scratch. She's been making job specific cover letters for every application but still no luck.

One big disadvantage she would have to most other science graduates is not having a co-op but she thought that having a masters and having a combined 9 months lab experience (in both UL for her FYP and UCC for her thesis) would stand to her but employers don't seem to care about it if it is internal university experience.

I know this time of year isn't the best to be looking for grad jobs but I guess I'm at a loss to what more she could do to improve her chances of employment. Is it a case of just keep plucking away and if nothing comes around, to wait until the grad programmes come up again? Does having a teaching degree and no co-op experience really hamper someone that much? I know every graduate isn't just entitled to a job out of college but it's a really ****ty situation to be in!

learn_more

Is she good looking ?

Lux23

learn_more wrote: »

Is she good looking ?

Seriously?

Chavways, to be honest I don't really think there is anything to be alarmed by not getting a job in only a few weeks. It sounds like she will have a good masters result, so my advice is to keep plugging away.

Has she gone in to speak to any agencies yet? There are some good ones specialising in lab/pharmaceutical type roles that might be able to get her an entry level role? I mean even if she was to take a temp role in a pharma company that was beneath her education just until she found something else. My partner did that and they actually ended up promoting to a better position.

JeffKenna

learn_more wrote: »

Is she good looking ?

I too would be interested in this information.

titan18

Know it's not great, but might even be worth taking any job even if not related to the field as she continues to apply. Closer related the better, but never know who you might meet that might be able to get you in somewhere.

Other than that, I'd suggest looking at more senior jobs than she could apply for, and apply for them anyway, but with a good cover letter saying you know you're not experienced enough for the role but you'd be a great fit in the company, and this is what you can do for them, and you'd love to be considered for a similar junior role if anything came up. I've managed to get a good few interviews from doing that.

Chavways

Lux23 wrote: »

Seriously?

Chavways, to be honest I don't really think there is anything to be alarmed by not getting a job in only a few weeks. It sounds like she will have a good masters result, so my advice is to keep plugging away.

Has she gone in to speak to any agencies yet? There are some good ones specialising in lab/pharmaceutical type roles that might be able to get her an entry level role? I mean even if she was to take a temp role in a pharma company that was beneath her education just until she found something else. My partner did that and they actually ended up promoting to a better position.

Yeah I think she has signed up to 3 aencies at this stage, one being grad job specific but I don't think she's had any correspondence from any of them yet.

At this stage, she would be very happy to take an entry level technician job or anything low level just to get the experience and then work her way up but those jobs are thin on the ground too. She applied for a grad job in Dublin and they said they had to stop taking CVs because there was so much interest. So it seems a lot of people are in the same boat.

Senna

learn_more wrote: »

Is she good looking ?

JeffKenna wrote: »

I too would be interested in this information.

Was this first posted in After Hours??

OP, early days yet if she has not finished college yet, but it can be a fine balance between holding out of the right job and starting any job just to get into the workforce.
I would be of the opinion of getting into the workforce straight away as delays in finding the correct job can stretch on. A good masters result will count in her favour and I'm sure a position will come up.

Chavways

titan18 wrote: »

Know it's not great, but might even be worth taking any job even if not related to the field as she continues to apply. Closer related the better, but never know who you might meet that might be able to get you in somewhere.

Other than that, I'd suggest looking at more senior jobs than she could apply for, and apply for them anyway, but with a good cover letter saying you know you're not experienced enough for the role but you'd be a great fit in the company, and this is what you can do for them, and you'd love to be considered for a similar junior role if anything came up. I've managed to get a good few interviews from doing that.

Ok cool thank you. I know she applied for a few jobs in Regeneron asking for a PhD or else 1-2 years experience but she got automatic rejections from them so it seems she wasn't even considered. But yeah I'd be of the opinion that any job is better than no job for the time being. I'll definitely tell her to keep trying for everything she finds. Thanks.

Chavways

Senna wrote: »

Was this first posted in After Hours??

OP, early days yet if she has not finished college yet, but it can be a fine balance between holding out of the right job and starting any job just to get into the workforce.
I would be of the opinion of getting into the workforce straight away as delays in finding the correct job can stretch on. A good masters result will count in her favour and I'm sure a position will come up.

Nope it wasn't!

Yeah I think that too. I guess she has an idea that without a co-op nobody will even give her the time of day for any of the regular entry level jobs and the lack of replies she's gotten has added to that idea.

Apologies for the triple post too. Don't know how to multi quote on mobile! If it's even possible?

titan18

Chavways wrote: »

Ok cool thank you. I know she applied for a few jobs in Regeneron asking for a PhD or else 1-2 years experience but she got automatic rejections from them so it seems she wasn't even considered. But yeah I'd be of the opinion that any job is better than no job for the time being. I'll definitely tell her to keep trying for everything she finds. Thanks.

Only really works with a really good cover letter, and saying that you know you're not meeting the criteria they have for the current job, but are interested in anything else that has come up, or in future.

Needs the cover letter though, just applying for the job will lead to nothing, need to make yourself stand out from everyone else.

highlydebased

From what I can see it is not having the industry experience that is causing the problem. While qualifications are important, an employer will want to see experience of the workplace as it is a world away from academia. Even if she got an offer or something not directly related to what she wants to do, she should take it on a short term basis as a means to an end.

Dinkie

Her masters is quiet specific. I'm not sure if there are many companies out there at the moment looking for molecular biologists - especially with bioinnovation. Most look for general chemists, biologists.

Is there a chance that she is applying for the wrong type of job? She might have to target her CV at general science type jobs and try and work her way up from there. If you are good, its easy to work your way out of a lab fairly quickly. A lot of us have done it

Perhaps lessen the focus on the bioinnovation part of the MSC on the CV and highlight the amount of science work done.

In my industry that certainly is the case. You may have a masters in bioinnovation, but we want to see the experience along side the qualification. To prove that you can apply the theory.

And in my experience no, university lab experience does not always count as experience. My OH had worked in a university for years, part of it doing lab work and it counted for nothing. It took him a long time to find a job outside the university. People want to see commercial experience.

Hope this post makes sense. I've been up all night with a sick child who has finally gone to sleep.

Good luck!

BaaLamb

Dinkie wrote: »

And in my experience no, university lab experience does not always count as experience. My OH had worked in a university for years, part of it doing lab work and it counted for nothing. It took him a long time to find a job outside the university. People want to see commercial experience.

Hi Dinkie,

I was just interested in your comment about your OH. We're in a similarish situation as the OP in that my OH has applied for loads of jobs and is struggling to get interviews. He has been a researcher in a university for the last number of years and he also has some commercial experience. How did your OH finally crack the job market? Did he do any additional training or courses or did he just keep applying for job after job?

OP apologies for jumping in on your thread but I have been following it with interest.

Chavways

Dinkie wrote: »

Her masters is quiet specific. I'm not sure if there are many companies out there at the moment looking for molecular biologists - especially with bioinnovation. Most look for general chemists, biologists.

Is there a chance that she is applying for the wrong type of job? She might have to target her CV at general science type jobs and try and work her way up from there. If you are good, its easy to work your way out of a lab fairly quickly. A lot of us have done it

Perhaps lessen the focus on the bioinnovation part of the MSC on the CV and highlight the amount of science work done.

In my industry that certainly is the case. You may have a masters in bioinnovation, but we want to see the experience along side the qualification. To prove that you can apply the theory.

And in my experience no, university lab experience does not always count as experience. My OH had worked in a university for years, part of it doing lab work and it counted for nothing. It took him a long time to find a job outside the university. People want to see commercial experience.

Hope this post makes sense. I've been up all night with a sick child who has finally gone to sleep.

Good luck!

Yeah I see a lot of places looking for microbiologists. I think her CV has highlighted all of the techniques and stuff she has done in her time in the lab both during her FYP and her thesis. She would definitely be happy to take anything remotely related to lab work/general science at this stage just to get onto the first rung of the ladder.

Chavways

BaaLamb wrote: »

Hi Dinkie,

I was just interested in your comment about your OH. We're in a similarish situation as the OP in that my OH has applied for loads of jobs and is struggling to get interviews. He has been a researcher in a university for the last number of years and he also has some commercial experience. How did your OH finally crack the job market? Did he do any additional training or courses or did he just keep applying for job after job?

OP apologies for jumping in on your thread but I have been following it with interest.

No problem at all! I'd say there are a lot of people in similar situations.

Cheerful Spring

Chavways wrote: »

Hi Guys,

My girlfriend graduated from UL with a high 2.1 degree last year qualified as a Biology, Chemistry and Ag Science Teacher. She didn't really want to go into teaching so she did a Masters in UCC in Molecular Cell Biology and Bio-Innovation and is due to graduate again with a high 2.1 or else a 1.1 depending on her thesis results. She's coming to the end of the masters now and she began the job hunt back in July.

Over 35 job applications later and she has only gotten 1 interview. She has been to multiple C.V clinics in UCC along with her lecturers and professors saying she has a great, well rounded C.V and also her mother who works as a Hiring Manager going through it to make sure it was up to scratch. She's been making job specific cover letters for every application but still no luck.

One big disadvantage she would have to most other science graduates is not having a co-op but she thought that having a masters and having a combined 9 months lab experience (in both UL for her FYP and UCC for her thesis) would stand to her but employers don't seem to care about it if it is internal university experience.

I know this time of year isn't the best to be looking for grad jobs but I guess I'm at a loss to what more she could do to improve her chances of employment. Is it a case of just keep plucking away and if nothing comes around, to wait until the grad programmes come up again? Does having a teaching degree and no co-op experience really hamper someone that much? I know every graduate isn't just entitled to a job out of college but it's a really ****ty situation to be in!

Back in July do you mean last year or this year? If shes only looking since this July, she probably find a job soon.

tricky D

You haven't mentioned 2 factors that are very important these days.

Get her to work on her LinkedIn networking presence. This also includes connecting with and researching of target employers. HR in many industries is using it much more.

Then there's the old picking up of the phone. There is nothing like personal contact as it taps into people's innate desire to help others out. A CV and cover letter has little if any effect for this. Call before she sends anything in, first to get the name of the person who gets the CV and cover letter, and better if you can get to talk directly to them.

hth

Chavways

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Back in July do you mean last year or this year? If shes only looking since this July, she probably find a job soon.

Yeah since July 2016 but it's not the time scale that I'm concerned about, more so the number of jobs she has applied to which is well over 35 at this stage. And still with very little positive outcomes. She has started to acknowledge in her cover letters that she doesn't have the desired experience but she is willing to work at anything relatable.

tiffbunny

Chavways wrote: »

Yeah since July 2016 but it's not the time scale that I'm concerned about, more so the number of jobs she has applied to which is well over 35 at this stage. And still with very little positive outcomes.

35 jobs and 1 interview can be a pretty good ratio depending on the industry, especially as she's only been looking for a very short time. Some company's processes take longer and several probably haven't yet decided on whether or not to proceed with her application. She may end up with a few more interviews from those 35 applications, but it's probably too soon to tell.

Chavways wrote: »

She has started to acknowledge in her cover letters that she doesn't have the desired experience but she is willing to work at anything relatable.

No, please no. Tell her to stop including those kinds of statements in her cover letter. I'm an in-house recruiter who cringes every time I see people do this. Why? Because if the employer isn't thinking about a lack of experience when looking at your application, you've just made it crystal clear they should be.

Also, personally I'd recommend she also remove the bit about similar roles. It's not a huge deal to leave it in, but this kind of flexibility is usually better discussed during phone screenings or calls with the HR/recruitment person or at the interview stage. Why? Because candidates see it as being versatile and flexible, but employers can read it as being unfocused, not being that interested in THIS position, or as being desperate for just any ole job.

Hope that helps, and as others have stated, it's early days yet in her job search, so just remember to be patient but diligent.

Best of luck to her.

Chavways

tiffbunny wrote: »

No, please no. Tell her to stop including those kinds of statements in her cover letter. I'm an in-house recruiter who cringes every time I see people do this. Why? Because if the employer isn't thinking about a lack of experience when looking at your application, you've just made it crystal clear they should be.

Also, personally I'd recommend she also remove the bit about similar roles. It's not a huge deal to leave it in, but this kind of flexibility is usually better discussed during phone screenings or calls with the HR/recruitment person or at the interview stage. Why? Because candidates see it as being versatile and flexible, but employers can read it as being unfocused, not being that interested in THIS position, or as being desperate for just any ole job.

Hope that helps, and as others have stated, it's early days yet in her job search, so just remember to be patient but diligent.

Best of luck to her.

Ok, thank you. We just said we'd try a different approach as ignoring the fact that she doesn't have previous industry experience hasn't provided many results up to now.

ted1

She needs to tailor her CV and cover letter for each application. Let her sell herself so that she ticks each box that is on the job specification.

dublinsdonal

Chavways wrote: »

No problem at all! I'd say there are a lot of people in similar situations.

There are! I went back as a mature student-36 to college. Graduated with engineering degree. Not a snot of a job. I worked for free for 6 months too!

I realise now that I have,like alot more got a qualification that means F all.
Colleges are simply just businesses these days. I went back during the recession in the hope of bettering myself. LOl

BaaLamb

dublinsdonal wrote: »

There are! I went back as a mature student-36 to college. Graduated with engineering degree. Not a snot of a job. I worked for free for 6 months too!

I realise now that I have,like alot more got a qualification that means F all.
Colleges are simply just businesses these days. I went back during the recession in the hope of bettering myself. LOl

dublinsdonal my husband did the same as you, went back to college during the recession. He is currently battling to get interviews and has applied to loads of companies with very little feedback. He is a good bit older then you and I was worried that was the main reason he wasn't getting anywhere It is very tough going, have you had any luck since?

Bristol-Myers Squibb are building a huge pharmaceutical plant in Cruiserath. Its enormous.

dublinsdonal

BaaLamb wrote: »

dublinsdonal my husband did the same as you, went back to college during the recession. He is currently battling to get interviews and has applied to loads of companies with very little feedback. He is a good bit older then you and I was worried that was the main reason he wasn't getting anywhere It is very tough going, have you had any luck since?

Hi BaaLamb! Im 41 now! BTW
Your right its difficult! I decided to stop looking about a year ago...i was nearly having a heart attack. I got a van and tried to get experience in working for myself. Having spent time working in nightline and a few more it is not worth a crap. The contracting laws now which all of these companies use is useless to the driver. Im now considering working for myself again. Its a merry-go-round......nice day though! least the sun is shining...Im sure that will be taxed soon enough! Lol

NotaSheep

Bioinnovation is an extremely interesting field at the moment, especially seeing that EU funding is focused very exclusively in this area see http://www.bbi-europe.eu/ - there is always a number of multimilion projects knocking about looking for specialist support especially at entry level, one avenue could be monitoring the approval of those kind of projects and applying with the Irish partners involved in the bid (which can be industry or institute).

Chavways

Hey Guys,

Just an update to this. She has finished her thesis and is done with the masters but no luck with any interviews or jobs yet even after another 20 or so applications. She has been in contact with a few recruitment agencies and all have said she has a great CV and they will apply to positions for her but still nothing.

Really at a loss with what to do. I honestly don't understand how she isn't even getting a hint of an interview. She thinks she is unemployable and will never have a job for the rest of her life.

We've tried a number of different approaches to cover letters and whatnot, mentioning the lack of industrial experience and in others not mentioning it and just focusing on all the good points but still nothing. She doesn't want to work in Dublin where I know there are a lot of jobs but even searching within Limerick, Tipperary, Cork, Clare, Galway and pretty much all of the south west has given up nothing so really unsure of what to do.

Is there a point in trying to get a retail job of sorts to keep her going with a little bit of money even if she might get a job that suits her when she's 2 weeks into the retail job?

Really don't know what to say anymore because I don't understand why she hasn't had any luck whatsoever and its really affecting her.

jive

Chavways wrote: »

We've tried a number of different approaches to cover letters and whatnot, mentioning the lack of industrial experience and in others not mentioning it and just focusing on all the good points but still nothing. She doesn't want to work in Dublin where I know there are a lot of jobs but even searching within Limerick, Tipperary, Cork, Clare, Galway and pretty much all of the south west has given up nothing so really unsure of what to do.

Well if she doesn't want to work in Dublin she's at least halved her chances of getting a job. The vast majority of companies on a recruitment drive in biotech/pharma at the moment are in Dublin. Outside of Cork there isn't much work (there's a few companies recruiting in Galway/Limerick/Waterford but that's it).

If she really wants to improve her chances of getting a job then she'll have to apply for places she doesn't really want to move to. She can always get a job back where she wants for more money when she gets a year under her belt.

Dinkie

BaaLamb wrote: »

Hi Dinkie,

I was just interested in your comment about your OH. We're in a similarish situation as the OP in that my OH has applied for loads of jobs and is struggling to get interviews. He has been a researcher in a university for the last number of years and he also has some commercial experience. How did your OH finally crack the job market? Did he do any additional training or courses or did he just keep applying for job after job?

OP apologies for jumping in on your thread but I have been following it with interest.

Hi

Sorry, I have just seen your post now.

I'm not sure how he eventually cracked it. i'm putting down to (very non-scientific) fate.

The company he eventually got a job with were more interested in someone with good theoretical knowledge which he had. Its the physics area, and they believed he had the knowledge that would give him a sound basis for the job role.

Lux23

Pfizer have their Grad Programmes up.

http://www.pfizer.ie/graduate_programmes.cfm

Chavways

Thanks for all your help guys! She got a job in Limerick as a Production Scientist. To say we're delighted is an understatement. Thanks again for all of the advice and help. We did 6 hours of interview prep yesterday and it seemed to work out!