Help Camper DOE Weight

hydro1

I have just sold my camper and getting the DOE for new owner and don't reckon there will be any mechanical issues, its a imported van which i have owned for 9 years and its been off the road for the last 2 years.

The tester has found a plate under the van saying 4000kg and says this is a heavy vehicle thus needs a C license to drive and will only test it under the original category. So basically I cant drive it and the sale is lost and I really dont know what to do, has anyone come across this before.

John

crabbypaddy

Yes, you will need to downplate it to drive it on a B licence, you can only downplate it if the combined axle weights are currently less that 3500kg.

SVTECH in the Uk can provide the plate and documentation required but are a little expensive:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97231229&postcount=2

Benbecul97

Yes, a van over 3500kg requires a C license to drive, under 3500kg requires a B license.

Is there also a plate somewhere on the chassis (when you pop the bonnet to access the engine) that mentions a weight of 3500kg or less?
What weight is specified on the Vehicle Licensing Certificate that you have?
Was there ever a problem when doing the CVRT test on the vehicle before?

DakarVert

What is the base vehicle?
Transit or similar?

hydro1

Hi

The vehicle is a Fiat Ducato 2.8 with a Burstner body, but testers found a plate with 4000kg on chassis but some import doc's I have when purchased it here in ireland show 3500kg, can it be down rated in ireland. ?

DakarVert

Is their a weight on the log book?

hydro1

Its Irish registered and (J) N1 which says it under 3500kg, its it just a plate issue on chassis I have a problem with.

crabbypaddy

hydro1 wrote: »

Its Irish registered and (J) N1 which says it under 3500kg, its it just a plate issue on chassis I have a problem with.

N1 is a goods vehicle. Every vehicle I've ever owned has a load of rubbish in the log book.

Is it an alko plate he's looking at on the chassis or is it under the bonnet affixed next to the fiat one?

hydro1

Not sure what he was looking at as I wasn't there mechanic drove it over, as I can't get insured until doe is done. But it was imported around 2005 from Germany and imagine it would have to have been tested to be classed as this, I have seen one listed for sale in Germany at 3250kg.

crabbypaddy

hydro1 wrote: »

Not sure what he was looking at as I wasn't there mechanic drove it over, as I can't get insured until doe is done. But it was imported around 2005 from Germany and imagine it would have to have been tested to be classed as this, I have seen one listed for sale in Germany at 3250kg.

The reason I ask is you say the plate was under the vehicle. The plate is usually under the bonnet on the slam panel you can't expect police, customs etc to crawl around under a vehicle looking for a plate.

Depending on the model Burstner may have bought it as a bare cab from fiat and added an alko chassis to the rear or they may have bought it as a chassis cab and uprated it or the previous owner may have uprated it. The fiat plate on the slam panel is usually either XXXXed out with the new rating plate alongside or the new plate fitted over the fiat plate.

I'm just thinking that the plate under the vehicle may be the an al-ko chassis id plate.

hydro1

Hi Crabbypaddy

The plate on the vehicle is a AL-KO plate with 4000kg and the second plate in the cabin has no weight on it. RSA tell me the AL-KO plate is the finishers plate so is the final weight.

Yet I believed this camper was tested/inspected at time of registration and showed 3400kg so registered as a B class which I can drive.

Is there some way you know of getting a vehicle tested to see what weight it is and then get issued with amended plates for its weight. Or do I even need to get it tested just issued with new actual weight plates. Noticed same model for sale in Germany with a 3275kg weight . Camper was in storage for 2 years so first time officially DOE'd

John

crabbypaddy

hydro1 wrote: »

Is there some way you know of getting a vehicle tested to see what weight it is and then get issued with amended plates for its weight. Or do I even need to get it tested just issued with new actual weight plates. Noticed same model for sale in Germany with a 3275kg weight . Camper was in storage for 2 years so first time officially DOE'd

Its not the weight of the vehicle its the maximum permissible weight in service i.e. the maximum weight you are allowed vehicle + contents + passengers.

You'll need to get it replated as 3500kg, simplest method may be svtech as I linked in my first post.

Its a pity the B licence is so restrictive here. 4000kg is actually a sensible weight as in the UK in 2009 VOSA and police found 80% of motorhomes to be overloaded at the port.

3275kg is almost certain to be overloaded once you add gas water, provisions and passengers.

zambo

Hi
If I read your message correctly it was weighed as 3400kg so this is its actual weight. If registered as 3500kg you would only have a permissible load of 100kg . This would be taken up by the driver leaving no allowance for passengers or luggage or anything else not in the van when weighed such as water or fuel. The registered weight is the maximum weight at which it may legally be driven. This is likely to be checked if driving abroad and is a serious problem if exceeded.
If there was any way you could do the test to allow you to drive at 4000kg you would be definitely be recommended to do so.

crabbypaddy

zambo wrote: »

This is likely to be checked if driving abroad and is a serious problem if exceeded.

Don't know how likely it is unless you plan on driving in switzerland, there are sporadic checks elsewhere but don't know anyone thats been weighed. Could definitely ruin your holiday though.

zambo wrote: »

If there was any way you could do the test to allow you to drive at 4000kg you would be definitely be recommended to do so.

He's trying to sell it, C licence is going to seriously limit the market.

hydro1

I will call Burstner today and see if they have records, as I said I noticed the same model for sale at 3275kg I didn't initially weigh it but it could have easily been loaded when weighed with water, chairs, tables etc as filled with furniture when i got it and I never empty a camper of stuff apart from clothes etc. So suppose I will just get it re weighed to confirm exactly what it is. This is a normal size camper its not one of the huge ones.

If I understand this correctly a vehicle no only must be under 3500kg it must be so with driver, passengers and fuel etc. So 6 people weigh 360kg, full tank fuel 80kg, water 120kg and stuff 100kg l So if about 3000kg I can use the weight cert to get it DOE'ed until I find a way of getting it replated. This is such a grey are and open to interpenetration.

AlKo plate is not the finished weight it's the chassis manufacture plate which was supplied to Burstner before camper was built so it's maximum permissible load allowed with this chassis type.

zambo

I accept your point re selling but is there not an ethical question about selling a van which will be overloaded with just the driver aboard.

hydro1

This really is just bureaucracy and I am caught in a bind with this camper, so if i get it weighted as I said and its well under the 3500kg allowing room for driver and luggage (around 3200) I should be ok. ( I do not know what the unladen weight of camper really is as previous owner was foreign and moved over so could have simply driven it in as was with everything loaded inside, my camper is always loaded ready for use apart from living clothes and could assume his was also )

But a driver could weight anything from 60kg to 200kg this is all open to interpenetration and if I wasn't concerned about doing what is right I wouldn't be posting here as it stands legally I cant even insure it or drive it home.

niloc1951

OK don't panic. a C licence is not needed if the GVW is 4,000kg. a C1 will cover it and people who passed their test prior to November 1989 should have that on their licence.

Most motorhomes rated over 3,500gvw were done so as an optional extra when ordered by people with a C1 on their licence but they were usually available rated at 3,500kg so that people with only a B licence could buy one.

Plated at 3,500kg such motorhome could still be used within that weight however the people and 'stuff' (pay load) they could carry was limited which is why the heavier option was available for people with a C1 licence which gave an increase in pay load.

Talk to SV Tech about getting the vehicle down rated to 3,500kg GVW, their certification is accepted by the RSA.

It is a far lesser evil to be over the plated GVW than to not have the licence to drive the vehicle.
Using it at over the 3,500kg but not over the 4,000kg could get the driver summonsed with operating the vehicle over its plated weight but a charge of operating it in a dangerously overloaded condition would not stick as the vehicle would still be within its designed capability.