Ford Mondeo problem

Silverfish

Hi,

I bought a 09 Ford Mondeo Diesel last week, picked it up on Thursday.
Had meant to get it checked out by a mechanic as I'd gotten royally screwed over on the last car I bought in November, but hadn't gotten around it yet.
Came out this evening to start it, and the engine light is on. The car seems to be driving alright with no issues, but that's how the problems with my last car started, resulting in it needing a new engine, so I'm pretty pissed off.

The question is, the dealer is 60kms or so away - would it be safe to drive the car that distance with the engine light on? I know it's a 'how long is a piece of string' question but I'm pretty stressed out right now.

Atlantic Dawn

Without an engine fault reader it's impossible to know what is causing the engine light to come on. You should check the level of oil and all fluids to see they are correct for a start, then see if there's any holes or loose connections on any hoses in the engine, something small here might be the cause. You could disconnect the battery for 2 or 3 mins and reconnect it, this will reset the light, however the underlying issue will likely remain and once the fault occurs again the engine light will reappear.

Has the car gone in to limp mode where it will only go to certain low revs and no more no matter what gear you are in? Any strange noises from the car when you were driving it?

Silverfish

No, it was driving fine, but I only drove it about 7k but seemed normal. I only have it a few days and I thought the engine seemed a bit loud, but I was assured that's because I'm used to a petrol engine - but it didn't seem any different today than the last few days

Atlantic Dawn

If it was me I would call the dealer on Tuesday morning and ask him what he advises, if he says your fine to risk it then go for it, no point in driving to him and then him say you wrecked it by ignoring the light.

robtri

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

If it was me I would call the dealer on Tuesday morning and ask him what he advises, if he says your fine to risk it then go for it, no point in driving to him and then him say you wrecked it by ignoring the light.

best advice that!!
let the dealer make the call

Silverfish

That's what I'll do, good plan.

This is just the last thing I needed, I got rid of my last one cos I've such a distance to go to work and I needed something reliable

Silverfish

Got a mechanic to check this out today, and he gave me the list of problems :

EGR Valve needs replacing
Timing and wet belt both need replacing
and a few other issues, inc needs a new battery (least of my worries)

Its under warranty for 3 months, what are the odds of the dealer actually doing this for me? I went completely underwater to buy this car, and I can not afford to be throwing any more money at it at this early stage!

lfc200

Silverfish wrote: »

Got a mechanic to check this out today, and he gave me the list of problems :

EGR Valve needs replacing
Timing and wet belt both need replacing
and a few other issues, inc needs a new battery (least of my worries)

Its under warranty for 3 months, what are the odds of the dealer actually doing this for me? I went completely underwater to buy this car, and I can not afford to be throwing any more money at it at this early stage!

Next to no chance on the timing belts I'm afraid... And unfortunately on that car it's an expensive enough replacement because of the wet and dry belts...
What miles are on it by the way?

shietpilot

If you end up having to replace the wet belt out of your own pocket - look into a chain conversion. You'll probably struggle finding a garage to do it but if you can find one it will be a nice and reliable upgrade.

Not sure if George Dalton here is doing them considering he knows a bit about these wet belts?

bazz26

OP, without trying to sound harsh and unsympathetic but you said you got burnt in the past with an unreliable car yet you seem to have made the same costly mistake again in not getting your mechanic to check the car out prior to buying it.

Being honest it's a lot harder to get some of those things sorted now that you have bought the car. If the EGR valve is causing the earlier issues you describe then depending on the terms of the warranty and how decent the dealer is it should be covered. The wet timing belt is a different matter though, as long as it hasn't snapped then very unlikely that a dealer will change it after you have bought the car. The time to get that done was when you were negotiating the purchase of the car. Unfortunately it's not a cheap job at circa €900 from an indy garage.

The other small things depends on what is covered under the warranty, most 3 month warranties only include engine and gearbox so may not cover it. Some of these warranties can be worth very little too if the dealer decides he doesn't give a toss and just fobs you off. By all means go back to the dealer and see what they have to say, they might be decent and work out some sort of arrangement with fixing some of those issues. Again though if you had got your mechanic to the car prior to handing over the money a lot of this may have been avoided.

Silverfish

lfc200 wrote: »

Next to no chance on the timing belts I'm afraid... And unfortunately on that car it's an expensive enough replacement because of the wet and dry belts...
What miles are on it by the way?

That's the worst news
I traded in another car that needed an engine replacement 3 months after I bought it to buy this one, so I was really hoping I wouldn't get shafted again so soon.

There's 122,413 miles on it, so I would have expected it to be done.

Silverfish

bazz26 wrote: »

OP, without trying to sound harsh and unsympathetic but you said you got burnt in the past with an unreliable car yet you seem to have made the same costly mistake again in not getting your mechanic to check the car out prior to buying it.

Being honest it's a lot harder to get some of those things sorted now that you have bought the car. If the EGR valve is causing the earlier issues you describe then depending on the terms of the warranty and how decent the dealer is it should be covered. The wet timing belt is a different matter though, as long as it hasn't snapped then very unlikely that a dealer will change it after you have bought the car. The time to get that done was when you were negotiating the purchase of the car. Unfortunately it's not a cheap job at circa €900 from an indy garage.

The other small things depends on what is covered under the warranty, most 3 month warranties only include engine and gearbox so may not cover it. Some of these warranties can be worth very little too if the dealer decides he doesn't give a toss and just fobs you off. By all means go back to the dealer and see what they have to say, they might be decent and work out some sort of arrangement with fixing some of those issues. Again though if you had got your mechanic to the car prior to handing over the money a lot of this may have been avoided.

I don't have a mechanic. I called 4 different call out mechanics to do an onsite inspection, none called me back despite multiple phonecalls. I don't know anyone else.
I don't even have anyone to come with me to view a car. But yea, I've learned my lesson, even though I don't know what else I could do.

lfc200

bazz26 wrote: »

OP, without trying to sound harsh and unsympathetic but you said you got burnt in the past with an unreliable car yet you seem to have made the same costly mistake again in not getting your mechanic to check the car out prior to buying it.

Being honest it's a lot harder to get some of those things sorted now that you have bought the car. If the EGR valve is causing the earlier issues you describe then depending on the terms of the warranty and how decent the dealer is it should be covered. The wet timing belt is a different matter though, as long as it hasn't snapped then very unlikely that a dealer will change it after you have bought the car. The time to get that done was when you were negotiating the purchase of the car. Unfortunately it's not a cheap job at circa €900 from an indy garage.

The other small things depends on what is covered under the warranty, most 3 month warranties only include engine and gearbox so may not cover it. Some of these warranties can be worth very little too if the dealer decides he doesn't give a toss and just fobs you off. By all means go back to the dealer and see what they have to say, they might be decent and work out some sort of arrangement with fixing some of those issues. Again though if you had got your mechanic to the car prior to handing over the money a lot of this may have been avoided.

As bazz says the Egr valve might be covered so you may get lucky there... At the 122K miles you would have expected the belts to be done and especially since the car is now 7 years old...
What sort of money did you end up paying do you mind me asking?

Silverfish

lfc200 wrote: »

As bazz says the Egr valve might be covered so you may get lucky there... At the 122K miles you would have expected the belts to be done and especially since the car is now 7 years old...
What sort of money did you end up paying do you mind me asking?

3900 plus trade in value of 4k on my 2008 car.

maximum12

Hang on, are people suggesting that a car bought last week from a dealer that now needs a timing belt was fit for sale and there's no come back?

Op don't take advice from these people. The dealer needs to sort this out.

shietpilot

maximum12 wrote: »

Hang on, are people suggesting that a car bought last week from a dealer that now needs a timing belt was fit for sale and there's no come back?

Op don't take advice from these people. The dealer needs to sort this out.

It's a service item. The car is at 122k miles and it's due at 125k miles.

rex-x

maximum12 wrote: »

Hang on, are people suggesting that a car bought last week from a dealer that now needs a timing belt was fit for sale and there's no come back?

Op don't take advice from these people. The dealer needs to sort this out.

To be fair the dealer really doesn't, its simply a service item like an oil filter and is now due.

While this cant help you now OP I would say a mechanic is alot like a dentist, find a good one and stick with them! They will be much more accommodating towards checking out a car for you if you have somewhat of a relationship built up. They will also be able to monitor your car and see what has gotten worse between services etc

Silverfish

Yeah, I had a guy before with my old old astra, he kept it going for 16 years with only one expensive issue but I've moved pretty far away so its just impossible to get to him any more.

Anyway I may just see how far I get with the dealer tomorrow, but I'm getting quotes now for the timing / wet belt and sure I may just eat the cost on that one. The Not Knowing About Cars Tax.

maximum12

shietpilot wrote: »

It's a service item. The car is at 122k miles and it's due at 125k miles.

Absolute nonsense. If a car is sold with warranty it should be sold as good for the warranty period at minimum.

For example, Reputable dealers would not sell a car with minimum tyre thread or minimum brake pads.

But hey if you're happy to go through life having your belly tickled good for you. My advice to the op is to not tolerate this.

maximum12

Silverfish wrote: »

Yeah, I had a guy before with my old old astra, he kept it going for 16 years with only one expensive issue but I've moved pretty far away so its just impossible to get to him any more.

Anyway I may just see how far I get with the dealer tomorrow, but I'm getting quotes now for the timing / wet belt and sure I may just eat the cost on that one. The Not Knowing About Cars Tax.

You need to go in hard. This isn't a private sale and you've been sold a pile of ****. Sounds like you intend going in on the back foot.

Atlantic Dawn

Would it be worth you doing a history check on the car to see if it was clocked and has much more actual miles on it? That might be a better card to play with the dealer if it turns out it was clocked and you can seek refund.

The_Honeybadger

Erg valve and battery would be covered under most warranties surely?

I understand where people are coming from with the timing belt. At best it was a little sly of the dealer not to mention this was due so soon. He must've known, but buyer beware I guess.

Is the dealer also a mechanic OP? He may agree to cover some of the cost of the belt change or charge for parts only?

pred racer

Any car dealer worth buying something from, will cover the EGR and the battery and will do you a good deal on the belt replacement.
And I know its hindsight now, but if you asked the question here, before you bought. Even I would have told you to check if the belt had been done on that model Mondeo And to check the exhaust and springs!

monkeysnapper

I'm shocked a dealer would sell a car in that condition .your timing belt issue is a joke !!! Doesn't matter you didn't ask .
I agree you defo shouldn't pussy foot around here , go back in there and be polite but make it clear you are not happy.

biko

monkeysnapper wrote: »

I'm shocked a dealer would sell a car in that condition.

There is no "condition". The belts are a consumable and probably part of why car was traded in.

OP, do go back and see what they say.
Was the light on because of the EGR?

monkeysnapper

Look, I know what you are saying and your right , op should have known about belts , its in the main list of questions you ask when buying a 2nd hand car of that age and miles but you have to ask what kind of garage puts out a car that close to belts needing changed .

I wouldn't bring that kind of hassle to my door . op should defo ask for some kind of deal regarding belts change .

shietpilot

monkeysnapper wrote: »

op should defo ask for some kind of deal regarding belts change .

Would you really trust the garage to replace the 2 belts considering they already risked it by not changing them so close to the interval? The wet belt change is pretty expensive. If I remember correctly you need to also change gaskets for the wet belt cassette and all that sort of stuff so it's not a cheap job.

Silverfish

Just in my defence, they did say the car would be fully serviced, and I did ask if that included the timing belts and they said oh yes, anything that needs to be done. But that was during the initial selling spiel, when words are cheap
I didn't ask when it had been done, as I decided to go check that out myself. I would assume that if there's a few thousand miles left on the belt, they wouldnt do it, however the belt is overdue and definitely needs replacing.

Light is on because of the EGR, it's driving okay besides the rattle from the belt.

shietpilot

Silverfish wrote: »

Just in my defence, they did say the car would be fully serviced, and I did ask if that included the timing belts and they said oh yes, anything that needs to be done. But that was during the initial selling spiel, when words are cheap
I didn't ask when it had been done, as I decided to go check that out myself. I would assume that if there's a few thousand miles left on the belt, they wouldnt do it, however the belt is overdue and definitely needs replacing.

Light is on because of the EGR, it's driving okay besides the rattle from the belt.

Rattle from the belt? Belts are rubber so they don't rattle :eek:

Silverfish

shietpilot wrote: »

Rattle from the belt? Belts are rubber so they don't rattle :eek:

Well, the noise from the tensioner or whatever.

Stheno

Silverfish wrote: »

Well, the noise from the tensioner or whatever.

I'd not be driving that car.

shietpilot

Stheno wrote: »

I'd not be driving that car.

Yuppers. That tensioner may seize and then the belt will go flying off :mad:

Silverfish

I brought it back to the dealer who checked it out, they'll take it in next week to do the work on it and that's it's fine to drive in the meantime, but the timing belt is definitely due a change. I said I wasn't happy driving the car, they said if it was worrying me, they'd call me if they had a cancellation, but I shouldn't be worried.
The engine light was on due to the egr, when they gave the car back the light was off again and they said the egr would be done as well.

monkeysnapper

Are they doing the timing belt ? Have you had conversation with them regarding getting it replaced ?

That would be my number one concern . drive that car like there's a priceless antique cup and saucer on roof

Noccy_Mondy

That belt should have been done at 100,000 miles, no later, that's when I got mine done. Them belts are notorious for snapping early. Despite the recommended interval being 125k miles, it's not advisable leaving them that late.

Should have looked for proof the belt was done op, or negotiated a deal with the dealer prior to buying.

Anyway, that's no use to you now, but it's an 800 euro job.

Maybe they could offer you some goodwill, in my instance, the mondeos timing belt was due a year after buying (100k miles), brought it back to the dealer I bought it off, and got it done for circa 600. All depends on the garage though.

Silverfish

Yeah, its not the worst I've driven now in fairness but it's not great either. I'm taking it very handy. I'm going to drop it off tomorrow and get a hire car for the few days.
They said they'd do the belt, but tbh I don't trust them to do both. I'm going to drop it into Ford for a full service and see what was and wasn't done after I get it back.

Silverfish

Just an update on this - brought the car back to the dealer, he had it for two weeks but I don't think there was much done on it, they cleaned out the EGR valve but the car is juddering the odd time today so that's the EGR as far as I know.

I brought it to a ford centre who did the timing and wet belt, so at least that's done and I can forget about it for another 100k / 150k
They said everything else on it was sound and in good condition. He didn't get to check the EGR I'd say because he had the car back to me the same day, so they just did exactly what I asked for and gave it a brief health check.

The 'rattle' I am assured by the dealer, and two other diesel car drivers, that this is just a noise that can happen on older diesels, and someone used to a petrol engine won't like it. Once it's not the tensioner or anything else causing harm I'm not as worried.

Not sure whether to go back to the dealer again about the EGR, or just bite the bullet and get it done myself so that I know it's actually been done.